December 13, 2021 — Transportation Advisory Board Regular Meeting

Transcript

Captions from City of Boulder YouTube recording.

[0:37] emeritus.

[1:14] Happy Monday. How are you doing.

[3:55] muted.

[4:01] that's right after. You probably don't have thinking out the first hour or whatever. With course you. Have Cindy. You can you can hop on anytime. yeah i'll probably leave my computer here, but I may come a duck out and hang out with get up for a little bit. yeah I should. Talk to you guys bed just make sure that the connections working whatever. yep so i've got I have a power PowerPoint pulled up on on my computer. So we. should be able to set up, so I can share right. Yes, yeah Chris so I have all city of boulder employees are set up as Co host meaning, you can share, you can unmute yourself, so if you want to try right now to share, you can, but you do have that ability right now yeah.

[5:03] Okay. yep looks like it can it's always good to test it out. Oh tell. me and. meredith I was curious if my badge still worked at park central, and so I went down there today and I miraculously did, and I saw it, where we used to work. there. yeah it's all wide open there yeah. But not me right. I don't think it's done yet no. isn't the gofundme has. yeah for. Actually early. Somebody somebody had a meeting in there, there was there was a bunch of notes on some some whiteboard so maybe they've opened some of that stuff up. yeah they were working on it, I sure have heard something yeah but.

[6:00] Then. We. are starting to get busy. yeah so are you are you guys able to see that. Yes, looks good okay. Perfect I will stop I will mute. Coming back here in a little bit. To see ya. Okay let's go ahead and let people in. Thank you so much. All right, good evening oh. Great i'm so glad we're recording this. Recording right now. So one on Monday December 13 2021 I will call to order now. The December meeting for the transportation Advisory Board for the city of boulder, thank you for joining us, it appears everyone's in on the weight room waiting room.

[7:03] And we have no public hearing items and our agenda is frightfully short this evening. But I will begin by handing it over to Alice more Feral who's going to be our technical host for the evening to run through our. Rules and expectations for an online zoom meeting, but thank you for joining us allison go ahead. Wonderful Thank you so much sheila i'm such a go over our. Meeting roles, this evening, this meeting has been called to conduct the business of the city of boulder activities that disrupt a slight delay or otherwise interfere with the meeting or prohibited. The time for speaking or asking questions is limited to three minutes, no person shall speak except when recognized by myself and no person shall speak for longer than time allotted. Each person shall register to speak, by using that person's real name any person believed to be using a name, other than the one they're commonly know by will not be permitted to speak at the meeting.

[8:02] No video will be permitted, except for city officials employees and invited speakers presenters all others will participate by voice only. The person presenting at the meeting shall enforce these rules by meeting, anyone who violates any rule. If the chat function is enabled which it is, it will be used for individuals to communicate with the host myself. It should only be used for technical online platform related questions if an attendee attempts use chat for other reasons, the city reserves the right to disable that person's access to chat. Only the host and individual cells in a way the host will be permitted to share their screen during the meeting, thanks to you back to you. Thanks so much allison. I will proceed at the moment to the consideration of the approval of the November meeting Minutes do any time members have any corrections amendments or or other changes to the Minutes.

[9:04] I see a couple of shaking heads. I have no substantive changes. looks like no one else does either so entertain a motion to approve the Minutes, the drafts that were. circulated and made part of our packet. All move the we approve these, but I do have a comment on minutes in general, after this. Okay. Alex moves to approve i'll second that. Any objection. Minutes are approved, thank you. i'll see you're still on you to go ahead. In October, we had the opportunity to weigh in on the concept plan for the apartments on spruce and as Jacob Lindsay know that it was this historical opportunity for tap to weigh in on on something that was under concept review.

[10:00] And our recommendations and the projects in concept review form moved on to city council later that month. And I went looking through their materials, I was looking for our emotions and only found one of the two motions that this board. Past printed in those materials, and I was pretty sure that we had to and to confirm that I went to go check our meeting minutes and that entire agenda item is missing from our October Minutes it skips from agenda item five to seven. So, neither of our emotions were were captured in our Minutes. Then this just comes on the heels of the beast arapahoe see motion being a little misplaced and last year when we were. Testing emotion on the removing the North or the table miss overpass from the CFP, we were told that our.

[11:01] additional work burbage was not necessary, so just want to draw attention to board members that we need to be a little cautious as we review our materials and the staff that there's this there's several examples in the past year, so where. we've taken the time to read all the information provided to us listen to members of the public deliberate amongst ourselves craft particular language and it's it's going missing. Thanks Alex mark, do you have a comment on that. I do. When I became aware, so I voted to approve the October minutes and. You know I I tried to give the Minutes a careful reading and. You know I think I proved I moved to approve the October minutes not realizing that the that they had jumped from item five to items seven and.

[12:06] This is, this is an issue that I have experienced in the four years I have been on tap it's not just under. This in this last year, and it is moved, you know, to have our. our deliberations and our motions that we carefully craft. modified left out entirely you know it's gone beyond. annoying, and so I want to make a proposal when I became aware of this. issue in the October minutes on again on the heels of arapahoe and other instances. I want the tab. I would like to adopt for us to agree to a formal motion, and that would be that every formal motion.

[13:09] That we make as the tab is included exactly and in its entirety in the Minutes. And, and anything that is conveyed to counsel completely in its entirety, without exception. And I obviously staff is free to comment about why they might disagree with. The tabs decision recommendations or emotions, but they are not free to change omit or mischaracterize our emotions. And the second thing would be whenever a tab recommendation is reported to Council. A tab member is invited to be present with staff in that meeting.

[14:03] So those are the two items that I think. are necessary for. Our. our deliberations recommendations emotions to be conveyed correctly. Thanks mark, I see that Erica has had her hand up I do want to get back to your two points I think they have merit, but I just had her hand up since before you raise them and I wonder if she has some insight on to this in this omission or mistake Erica. So I guess i'm not the person during the Minutes, but I am the liaison between tab and the city and I just wanted to offer my deepest apologies. I am going to go back and we're going to put some processes and procedural things in place, so this doesn't happen again.

[15:02] Because I. agree with you entirely that whenever tab has motion, and you know you're offering advice and counsel, to the Council and a staff, we should be able to capture that and that's and. i'm really sorry I will go back and research with meredith what happened and put some processes in place so that that doesn't happen going forward. Thank you Alex. yeah thanks Erica that with the with the spruce thing is interesting because somehow one of our emotions ended up in the Council, materials and whoever did that really wasn't referencing art minutes. So it was there was the matter of arm and it's missing something but also someone took the leeway to describe one of our motions and quotes the second was described the first.

[16:02] One second one directly Okay, and I if we're going to talk about marks. Item that he has brought for it, a friendly amendment, I would like to add is that when things go from the US to planning board that they be. quoted in their entirety. Without anything being omitted or modified or merely just summarized by transportation or planning staff. understood and so let's get back to marks two points. Again this gets a little sticky because, to make a you know, an. emotion and take action by tab requires a public hearing, but that doesn't mean we can't like have a general consensus among ourselves and among staff that this ought to be happening. As to mark second point that a member of Camelot to be invited it's certainly the case that a member of CAP can come to any city council meeting and I think that the distinction is not just that we're allowed, but the we were explicitly.

[17:10] included, I suppose, is that about right mark. And I think that this was a more real tension longer ago, certainly in my time on tablet has been attention that has been alleviated somewhat recently by staff doing less. summarization and sort of editorializing of what happened to tab and and and doing a better job frankly of of conveying the the substance of tabs discussions, but I am sensitive to in particular being accurate and so I think that your suggestion has some real good merit. And my understanding, of course, is that staff and in preparation of the Minutes extends its best and most reasonable efforts and again those efforts have.

[18:00] been substantially better in recent months about capturing more verbatim what our discussion is, but we could be more explicit and, frankly, we as tab Members could be helping staff better capture the word for word. Yes, I do substance of what we're agreeing to I think what happened in October is not that i'm just catching up right now but it's it that's not an example of us not being clear enough. It does sound like mistakes were made and we will we will go back and see what we can do to correct the record, so thank you for catching this Alex mark. I appreciate it, and I would say that, as far as marks two suggestions we should probably fold them into. The discussion of our policies and procedures that we have table to the tab retreat early next year, because the seams directly related to the sections of that graph document that deal with our expectations between and.

[19:10] Our sort of relations with and communications between staff hands City Council does that sound fair mark i'm not really sure we can make any solid action right now, this evening. I had not thought of that, but I think that's an excellent suggestion and. It would allow. time for additional careful crafting. Of of that language, and I think that that's um I would be amenable to that especially thank you Erica for acknowledging the mistake and. And I have been also, at the same time i've been frustrated with this motion issue Yes, our Minutes have improved and meredith has been doing a great job overall in capturing a.

[20:07] The. The greater part of our of our meeting so. I am completely fine with that, but especially with kind of a tacit agreement or whatever that as we go forward and we discuss some issues that will be coming before this Council. That a attend member is invited and i'm not demanding that someone speak every time transportation department presents, but I would like us to be present, and if there is a. If there is a delta between what the tab thinks they made an emotion and what they hear being presented to counsel if they'd be given an opportunity to say, well, that that you know, maybe that wasn't exactly what we said here's here's what i'd like to add to it.

[21:04] Okay, I understood us to get him to be a little bit more proactive than that, instead of saying we have an opportunity to correct something that was a discrepancy that we. tried to have a tab Member attend a meeting where there is something that got discuss where we don't necessarily. completely support the staff suggestion or there's some kind of you know alteration to the staff staff proposal that we try ahead of time to schedule the tab Member to attend such a Council meeting. And guess what i'm saying is let's say we have something that's going before Council staffs presenting it is not customary that a board member demand demand there three minutes and I don't I don't want to be. That that guy. But I want it to be known that hey this evening, we have the director of the assistant director this engineer, and this tab number here.

[22:02] And this is the information being presented, and if the tab number never speaks break if they if they feel like an urgency to speaking, then they can raise their hand and be part of the. Of the transportation department communications to Council, but I don't want to be saying that pat gets. minutes at Council that would be different from another board. mm hmm. Okay. So. Erica and natalie does this seem like a rational sort of tacit agreement at the moment, until we have a chance to discuss it more fully and in depth at the retreat. So I wouldn't put characterize any of those that my comments and and responding to you know rational or whatever else. I don't know I mean this is one of these things where I don't know that I actually have the latitude to be able to say yeah, this is a great idea or you know anything different because.

[23:09] The relationships between the boards and commissions and the Council is the relationship between the boards and commissions and Council. And how that engagement happens it's it's a different process than staff, bringing you know, a package forward with it, and so forth, just like the public has places space and I don't have enough. I don't have you know i'm not the legal person to be able to look through all the you know all the guidelines, etc, to be able to say yeah, this is the greatest idea, since sliced bread or it's in conflict with you know. These issues, so what I would say is that I heard what you said and if we're able to go back and do some research with it, you know with.

[24:00] folks because I honestly don't know you know. This is a relationship between boards and commissions and Council and it's you know it's not a staff thing. Right. i'm just looking at the agenda this evening, it doesn't appear that there's anything that we're going to discuss at this meeting that's going directly to counsel and going to be reporting to counsel, so this doesn't feel like a fire, we need to put out in this evening i'm. Ben it gives us, it gives us a month to look into this, I will I say I suppose lead it or my reaction Erica to what you just said is that there is definitely an ongoing expectation when. A city department reports to city council and there's a transportation advisory board involved customarily. Staff reports to Council what that discussion was like and reports any decisions made. You know any resolutions that's usually staffs job when they are reporting to counsel and I think mark is suggesting that we at least have a Member of this board on standby, I suppose, when such reporting takes place.

[25:12] I think that's more or less where we're we're we're we're at i'm getting a thumbs up from where I also see ryan's hand APP that I would like to move on from this, if we can. write. just wanted to support the the idea that we look to at least recommend to counsel. An understanding that tab. be present at yeah Council meeting that believes subject matter that we've waited on I don't think it's enough to say a tab members, welcome to join. As a Council members not going to know to. Call especially study session and I think we're going to get into more and more nitty gritty I would expect transportation details with. So far, and the new Council has shown a great interest in our subjects, and so I just think this is going to be more important than than it was before.

[26:04] And if there's no clear way forward, I would suggest just we reach out maybe Tila to the Mayor of rocket say we ranked like to recommend that you provide us and make this your expectation there might be a better way but that'd be my suggested default have nothing there. Okay, thank you appreciation for that. Point well taken. and i'm gonna leave that there for now, but thank you again Alex for highlighting this. And Erica for the Green to look into it and. Next, on our agenda is a public comment but before that I feel as we have done in the past, we need to note that another young man has died on. boulder city streets this one was a 24 year old male on the Saturday after thanksgiving that will be. November 27.

[27:02] in the vicinity of table Mesa and US 36. My understanding is we don't really have any further details at the moment because investigation is ongoing, but this has been not a good year for our streets and to me highlights a lot of work that we still have to do to make travel here safe. for everyone on our roads. I hate doing this, every time. We have no public hearing items, this evening, but, as usual, we have a moment of public comment. And typically members of the public, and I see that there are a few here tonight will have three minutes to comment on anything that they wish to. discuss with tab. Excuse me.

[28:02] So if you're here to comment on the SNP project and pine maple turns Bruce or. The downtown station agenda items, this would be your time to do so, we want to have a separate public hearing on this items, and of course you're welcome to discuss anything else that is relevant to this boards work i'm going to hand it back over to allison to to handle the public comments. Thanks to thank you. um feel free to raise your hand Lynn I know you had your hand up so i'll go ahead and call on you, first, and if you'd like to speak at public comment, please. raise your hand or type into the chat box and Lynn i'm going to ask you to unmute right now, and I will pull up the three minute timer. behind. It thanks. hello, I love her. And yeah. and This miscommunication it's it's hard listening to this.

[29:00] So i've just experienced issues with boulder Community hospital and communicating with a patient representative there that. very sweet woman, but like she did not she she sent me back what I said and it wasn't what I said at all so God help us if we can't. Even communicate at the most basic levels and then communicating between all these different groups of staff and then Council in etc so. Good luck with that, but my comments tonight, I wanted to bring up one that I got in a bike crash with I believe what were a couple guys on math. That were just I was just going from the farmers market on the ninth of November and over to look at one of the landmark houses that I. I follow the landmarks board on 17th and marine and so I was on the bike path there, and these two guys were there with their dog. And the dog was on a leash and the dog somehow and i'm very cautious person, but somehow to avoid the dog I had to crash, and you know.

[30:12] i'm forward over my bike I got it human tome on my left calf, and my right knee a little bit and then crashed over my bike onto the cement really hard. And i'm 68 so my bones aren't you know what they used to be probably and I don't know what's wrong with me I bet it I couldn't use my arm at all my right arm. For like two days and it's gotten better somewhat since then, but there's still feels like there's rocket is out or there's like some the socket my my lower arm I can't rotate right and. And my shoulder and like and it's pretty disturbing because I just happened to have a kidney stone and don't ever get a kidney stone.

[31:06] And, but that was a surprise because I never get sick with anything and so i'm dealing with all of that, so I haven't been to the doctor about this. But my main concern for you folks is, please do something about getting a pie chart for each body that's coming to boulder of what how much. Transportation advisory how much transportation and they're using how much all of the end for different infrastructure, because this millennium and. The best Western and see you South what you said tonight to write down there at table Mesa. Like that we can't handle any more population here and it's just driving the homelessness and the meth people, and I know they're not intentional myth, but they're watching dogs that that that the dog is not safe with them either it's like really disheartening.

[32:04] yeah I hear you Lynn Thank you yeah I hope you hear well. What. The public like to speak. I don't see anyone else. I don't either, so we can go ahead and close that. Okay close the public comments section of meeting. When, thank you for joining us, as always, and i'm sorry to hear that that happened to you hope you feel better soon yeah. All right now, we will turn to briefing and have feedback on the SNP project on pine Middleton spurs. Everyone hear me. yep.

[33:02] hi dad i'm rhinos senior transportation planner here at. The City of boulder. And to see me and I just wanted to give you kind of a mid project update on the whittier an SMP project so that includes pine street maple avenue and spruce street between 20th streets and 20th street. And so, a little bit of background, just to refresh. So we prioritize or you prioritize I should say, for this project as the top complex project and the neighborhood speed management program in 2019. The applications that comprise of this project are actually. Three three applications, so there was the top ranked application on pine street between 20th street and full sudden. There was another pine street application between folsom and 28th which was ranked a few below and then there was spruce street between 24th and folsom, which was the top ranked simple project and so.

[34:12] When we prioritized pine street we decided to include spruce street initially we included me appleton because we are concerned that, if we further. Traffic on pine street we may push traffic to maple 10 and spruce and so thinking about that potential diversion we wanted to make sure that we were addressing the streets as well. And of course the number it's the management programs primary goal is to reduce vehicle speeding. In order to enhance neighborhood livability and improve public safety for all street users in support of our Vision Zero goal the transportation master plan, as well as the low stress walk and bike network plan. So I just wanted to point out. The levels of speeding that we saw when we embarked on this project in late spring of this year.

[35:08] And so, just as a frame of reference pine street has a 25 mile an hour speed limit, it is a collector street so it was not affected by the 20th plenty project, however maple avenue and spruce street. Both were affected by 20 is plenty and now I have 20 mile an hour speed limits, so we are primarily seen the majority of speeding on pine street between 21st and 23rd and then what you such wisdom rather. Between 26th and 27 on spruce street primarily around that 2200 block and then on may Bolton closer to four so. We held our first neighborhood meeting on August 11 at whittier elementary school and we're actually able at that time to hold it in person, we did it in the school yard.

[36:05] read a really good attendance about 30 people showed up so we had it kind of like an open house style format, where we. put some boards out and we're talking about the existing conditions in the neighborhood and then asking folks for some preliminary feedback on things they would like to see, and so the slideshow some of that feedback that we received. And so we've used this feedback to begin developing some preliminary options for for the neighborhood. So we've categorized these basically into. Two vertical device options, as well as horizontal device options, and so you can see the vertical options, and we are considering on maple to include. aprons on the existing traffic circle at 23rd street adding additional speed bumps as well as looking at a heart and Center line or an extension of the.

[37:08] Of the. pedestrian islands that are currently at ableton and folsom on pine street some options include a raised intersection at 21st speed cushions throughout the quarter. Additionally, a paper in at 23rd at the existing traffic circle harden Center lines on the at the folsom intersection on the north and south approaches and folsom and then on spring street also raised intersection and need cushions I should also know. The. recommendation from the low stress welcome back network plan for pine street is to add buffered bike lanes, so there are currently regular bike lanes so regardless of the other options that we choose to go forward with we will move forward with adding those buffers to those bike lanes.

[38:09] Horizontal device options we are looking at include on ableton adding splitter striping and high visibility crosswalks on the approaches to the traffic circle at 23rd street. modifying the right in right out pedestrian refuge on what I just kind of alluded to, with the audience online. On pine street there is an existing pedestrian refuge island on the. West leg of the 21st and pine intersections, we would, in this option at a pedestrian refuge island on the east leg. On pine street there are several intersections that currently have chrome extensions so at 22nd street, you can see here we're proposing. This is an option to add curb extensions there as well as.

[39:05] On spruce street at 23rd and 26. And then, in addition to the splitter islands and visibility crosswalks also adding a bike box has a potential option at the full some intersection and easton westbound directions pedestrian island at 26 is also an option. As well as a right in right out. At 28th street which i'll talk about in a moment, and then. On spring street again adding actually there is an existing I should say an existing pedestrian island at 21st and spruce and so. One thing we have considered is shortening up the lane papers on those so the length of the taper is such that it's a more gradual transition around the island, and so one option is to make that a little more abrupt which would increase the horizontal deflection around the island.

[40:10] So those are some things that we are considering. For the project and then that right interact right out option at 28th and pine would be very similar to what currently exists at spruce and 28th. And so we are actually going through a separate traffic analysis right now to look at potential impacts, to the intersections at maple 10 and 28th street, as well as Pearl and 20th street good should we move forward with this. option we would included in the construction of the 28th street project we presented to a few months ago. We held our second neighborhood meeting on December 1 and we did that, via zoom so I just wanted to give you kind of an overview of what we heard during that meeting.

[41:05] we've also added a recording of the meeting, the slide deck and a common common form on the SNP web page and so we're continuing to get additional feedback before developing a recommended design, which we would bring to in the New Year. So at pine and spruce are pining spreadsheets rather between 21st and 24th street we heard. that most of the options actually sounded pretty good to people. The I was surprising to see in the meeting was that people seemed excited about the traffic circles with aprons because, at the first public meeting we had heard that people did not like the traffic circle so much. We also were surprised to see that that was popular for pine street between folsom and 28th but that pedestrian refuge islands were very popular there, especially had 26th street which doesn't currently have sidewalks so um so we've gotten some interesting feedback all that to say.

[42:16] And we are working on developing. will be most likely a mixture of both vertical and horizontal devices for the recommended designed. And we will present that to the public in January at a final neighborhood meeting, so the third in the series of three that the msrp guidelines dictate and then in March, we will return to you to ask you for your recommendation on a recommended design after holding a public hearing. Should you make that recommendation we will place the recommended design on the city council's agenda for a potential call up and should move forward, then we will begin finalizing the design and contracting process in late spring early summer of next year.

[43:11] With the goal of beginning construction in the fall and depending on the devices that we choose from those options that I spoke of, we may have to focus on installing the project in phases. Just for example if we were to land on raised intersections of those are probably the most expensive traffic calming device in our toolbox, and that would more than likely require us to to do several phases of the installation of the project. And if you have any questions on him. Thank you Ryan so tab, this is a, as I said, it's not a public hearing item we're not approving anything this be great time for questions like i'd like around the questions if you have any before giving him feedback, so does anyone have questions for Ryan first.

[44:12] don't see you guys right, I had two questions Oh, mark you put your hand up go ahead mark well. I wait, as long as I can, in the hopes that someone else will jump in there today i'm sorry that but anyway i'm Ryan. I was going back to the the the vertical device option slide. If you could you have the traffic circles, where you and devin and I met at on 23rd street and pine and maple time. My question is. You label those well So are we talking about existing devices modifying the existing devices or replacing existing devices, because those those to my understanding, would be traffic circles, with our aprons.

[45:13] Correct so the so the existing devices of traffic circle would be modifying it by adding an apron so currently the the opening between the apex of the current extension at 23rd street in the outer rim of the traffic circle is about 24 feet and so we'd be looking at narrowing the. Vehicle path to about 15 by building an apron around the existing radius of the traffic circle. we've spoken with fire and me about that so we're thinking probably. Around two inches high maybe a little bit more. So, as is everything on this, and the next slide either a modification or addition.

[46:06] know, most of it is, it would be additions so, for example, there is not a speed home at these okay we're we're proposing, and there are existing speed on some ableton, but not at these locations, the speaker versions obviously aren't there. At 21st street there's an existing pedestrian island that we would be removing if we were to add a raised intersection. Okay. All right, great Thank you very much, that was a That was really my only question I just was unsure what was new what was existing but to be modified, but it's mainly. New or additions or a modification, but nothing you're not showing anything that's just will just remain that that's in its current state. I we're not showing anything in these graphics that would remain, however, for example at 21st and pine there is an existing pedestrian island on the West, the league.

[47:05] uh huh. So if we added one on the east, like the one on the West side would still remain so it'd be a pair of okay. Thank you. Okay. Thanks Ryan, I think one thing that's cool about this is, we have these three close projects that give us this little study area which allows us to look comprehensively at. A larger area i'm curious what the crash history is in this area, with regard to severe crashes or crashes involving users already users. yeah so the severe crashes will have mostly taken place at the intersection of full sermon pine. We, we do have separate funding for doing things at that intersection through the highway safety improvement Program.

[48:02] That will include. signal rebuild and then some protected phasing as of right now, although we are. adding a protected intersection about location, so I know you were emailing with mark earlier today about that, but, but we are, we are looking into that i'm just pulling up my. crash history. There were three crashes that's Bruce and full some two or severe injuries. Of the seven. crashes at pine and. Full some three or severe there was one severe injury crash North street north of the 20th and pine intersection. Several severe crashes on 28th.

[49:01] But in the study area, the severe crashes are mostly armfuls. Okay, thank you. Are there questions for Ryan. yeah this is this is hi Ryan this this may not be relevant, but i'm wondering what the parking rules are in this area. So. I believe in this area, there is no neighbor permit parking. that's not correct, there is, there are some blocks, there are part of an NTP. Are they I believe they're further West. def definitely I think beach on pine between 21st and 22nd I believe there's some, I believe, on the South side. I think they're all in pine i'm not aware any on spruce I haven't seen Diana stated in a little while and parking on there for a while, but definitely certain blocks in that area are part of an mvp.

[50:04] We do not. take a closer look at parking because we're not. Moving right. was a Roman question coach. yeah that's fine, the reason I asked is that i'm on that road, a lot on a bike and the most dangerous thing that typically happens is people pulling in and out of parking and not seeing stuff. Which. We don't really have a way of addressing with any of these mechanisms. Well, if people are traveling more slowly coming. yeah that's true. slightly over that. So I had a related question Ryan on driver behavior. Some of the neighborhood feedback talked about motorists not behaving properly about passing cycles to close to around about it's definitely something I experienced quite frequently in that area.

[51:08] Do any of these treatments or do you anticipate that any of these treatments would improve that did we have any thinking about that about sort of better educating motorists about what to do, and not to do with respect to approaching cyclists near around about. We have been thinking about that so that's a great question we so we currently sign the roundabouts as you sure where. That you shall not pass a cyclist in the circle. It says, you know, I was in a circle. So do not pass. Okay. So we think that the apron should help with like visually narrowing that space, so that it feels less comfortable for drivers to do that we've also been talking about adding the splitter striping.

[52:00] is something that can potentially help with that as well, and then thinking about how cyclists on the lane before they. actually enter the traffic circle, because we can pull the bike lanes through the circle and so we've been thinking about the markings as well on the ground, we have not yet landed on a recommendation for that something that we we are. Thinking about. Great and My other question was about. The treatment, so you have labeled as horizontal. And i'm not sure if that means that the treatments themselves or horizontal or that horizontal deflection of drivers, because I thought, like. curb extensions, are we talking only paint are we talking actual concrete same thing with refuge islands, would it just be painted is that what makes them horizontal versus vertical can you enlighten me. Yes, so so we mean horizontal deflection. Okay, what for and is a clarification for the SNP we are thinking.

[53:04] flat work concrete so not necessarily the paint and post products we've been doing to the vision to innovation Program. Okay, thank you and then my last one was on the right in right out. sign in 28 it looked like you were only thinking of changing that on the western leg of the intersection i'm just curious would this affect left hand turns from 28 on to pine where there's now a there's a left turn bay. And we would be restricting those movements. We would be restricting them, so we would be pulling the median. Through the intersection. Okay, and so effectively if you wanted to turn left into this neighborhood you would do so either at Pearl or at maple. If you are a northbound 28 street that's right okay interesting. um okay does anyone have feedback for Ryan now.

[54:07] Alex go ahead. It says Ryan alluded to earlier, and as nasty know i've been interested about thinking through what we can do at the intersection of full sermon pine It shows up in our most recent completed safe streets report technical appendix highlighting some of the numerous crashes that impact. vulnerable road users, I think the H SIP project is going to address some of the Left turning crashes that involve active users of transportation. However, there are some right turning vehicle crashes, that will not be solved by that and so that's where my interest in the. single else we can do on the ground to eliminate those right turn crash was that's really motivated my desire to see if we can get a protected.

[55:00] intersection here and I reached out to mark sizzler today he informed me that the city is looking into various treatments there they didn't feel like they have anything ready for. public consumption, yet I hope that if there, possibly is something it is incorporated into the January engagements and it's something i'll certainly be considering when this comes back to tap in March. i've heard some reluctance to include something there and it is partially, because it would slow cars down a lot, and it seems like if we have this. Right turning vehicle problem that can be solved via protected intersection and it slows cars approaching that intersection eastbound then we're we're we consult both that right turn crashed problem and the speeding on pine problem. And so, as those various designs for that intersection are considered I think it's also would be also be good to consider the.

[56:07] addition of of the right in right out at pine and 28th because that would also probably lead to some traffic diversion and then our counts at the intersection of full some in pine. would be lesser and the operational impacts might not be as as strong but really hoping to see what is available there and and happy to meet between now and. In January, if you have some things that are you can you can show off. Thanks Alex. Any other feedback for Ryan. Mark go ahead. boy, this is feedback I like this, all and i'm glad we're addressing this.

[57:08] This in a kind of a more cohesive and broader way, I do have a question that I should have asked earlier when we build a right in right out do further now. The treatment of a right out divert or at maple turn and folsom now is kind of like a slip line, it is not, it is generally radius and it. breeds a definitely a rolling stop at best on to full sun, so do we have any data that says that, in fact, that is a problem, design and regardless well a future right out divert or have a smaller radius and.

[58:01] engender slower turning maneuvers. that's a good question, so the. So the MIC the appleton in folsom diver. is one where so so I agree it does feel very wide and actually the the primary issue that we're hearing from neighborhood residents at that location is that drivers are actually. Taking illegal left turns so they they're turning around the corner of Ireland ableton. So that's why we are actually considering heart and Center lines, there is to prevent them from doing it so. We haven't quite landed on should it be a harder and Center line along the actual Center line, or should we do something to extend the nose of the median which would, I think, slow down turning traffic to your point mark.

[59:02] So that's that's something to consider for the one we're proposing to build that 28th and pine. Certainly, will take a look at that design for that consideration, but I would say also that it would be really hard to turn fast out of pine street because you'd have to wait for a breaking traffic anyway. Okay, thank you. And then I went and I did want to know, separate from the whittier project is that we did install 100%. The 55th street pine street the 55th street complex project, which was one of the first complex complex projects you prioritized and then about 90%. Of the 20 631 any other feedback for Ryan.

[60:08] I don't have a whole lot substantive i'm also quite pleased to see the variety of treatments here. and very pleased to see that it will be a buffered bike lane I think that's been long a long awaited desire of the Community and the cycling community on that road as we've seen on spruce you know, and we will see in the coming months snow diversion plowing. That remains to be an issue, and I think it's more exacerbated by the on street parking that doesn't go away seasonally or with storm events. But that's you know something to think about in future future waves, I suppose, but i'm looking forward to seeing better cycling treatments along this facility and appreciate your ability to do more than just a few speed humps so thank you.

[61:02] i've heard a lot from people on the 26 week project, since you brought it up. In in particular cyclists asking what the heck are these speed bumps doing in the bike lane. And it's a little different road geometry there, because of course there's no pan and got her and things because there's no sidewalk along that section. Of roadway and I tried to explain to the people that have contacted me that mostly we put those people there, because otherwise cars go into the bike lane to avoid speed bumps. But there was also some someone to talk to you and Ryan and said, maybe the contractor hadn't fully followed the specs so are there kinks to be ironed out, and is there a better answer for the cyclist to use this other than go go too fast. Yes, what's what's the 10% that's remaining. The medians. Okay. not install the two mediums that book and speaker options. The submissions were initially installed with the ramps that we're about half the link that is of the design, so they they.

[62:07] did seem abrupt yes. You were very aggressive. Okay, so we have. We fixed that. Two weekends ago. Okay, so we lengthened the speaker oceans, so that they are now much more comfortable to like her right over. So you can yeah they are you can drive over them at about 15 to 20 miles an hour, you can bike over them about the same speed. Right, then you, of course, you know we expected that more confidence cyclists may take the lane and ride through the cloud, and that is occurring. I think, because the screen is tropical now that seems to be okay. yeah okay. we're comfortable doing so you can. All right, good to hear, thank you. Anything else for Ryan on the team before we move on.

[63:00] Excellent Thank you we'll move along then. Items five on the agenda downtown boulder station, draft a seat, we will not be having the the actual public hearing and seek this month that will come up as a January or February soon. But this is just giving us a touch point here as we're getting ready for the seat on the downtown station. renovations and street changes. that's also me. Well Hello. Hello again for the good of the recording my name is Ryan knows i'm a senior transportation planner here at the city of boulder and tonight, I am going to give a brief update on the downtown boulder station gate expansion project. So just a little bit of background the project is really intended to increase station capacity.

[64:02] So we did a study. That shows that downtown boulder station. Now accommodates more buses and passengers than the current design was meant to serve, and then we need more capacity, especially as we plan future projects such as the bus rapid transit along the state highway 119 and state highway seven are the Rambo avenue corridor. So this project really was identified in several studies wanting one was the Kenyan bull boulevard complete streets study. Which are called for improvements for mobility around the station and across Canyon in particular. The downtown boulder station feasibility study which limited those capacity limitations and the need for expansion and then our master plan which identified the downtown station improvements as a near term action item between.

[65:11] And so. The primary goals of this project is to increase the comfort and safety for existing writers. And to meet the guidelines and requirements of the Ada. So currently the existing conditions at the station is that we do have crowding. Especially. In the the regional route section. North of Canyon under the parking garage. So I would like to note also that the station serves about that same number of bus lines as vendors Union station, but has half the gate capacity so if you've taken the flatter and flyer they be one.

[66:04] In that possibly under the parking garage you'll notice that it's very congested it to. The. Inadequate bus gates on Canyon which we are looking at through a separate project also add to this issue, but we do have a example in the successful transit street between wallet in Canyon as a way to effectively expand the capacity of the station without building an entirely new station. So the concept plan is to extend the transit street to 14 South canyons between Canyon and arapahoe avenue. So this will primarily be for local routes, with the regional services staying in the actual.

[67:05] Bus base at the station that I mentioned a moment ago. So this 14 expect with industry expansion may include stops for the dash jump to a four to five to eight to 25, for example. And so the purpose of the seat, the Community environmental assessment process is really to refine this proposed concept. So we're looking at providing five additional bus gates. Improving sidewalks including info kiosks way finding. Creating some additional urban design and replacing existing landscaping. And we will also be removing some parking spaces, which is another focal point for the seat so potentially up to 18 spaces, will be affected on 14th street we're also looking at streetlight lighting along the corridor.

[68:10] Again, to improve safety and comfort for writers. So, just a quick breakdown of the budget for the project so as you can see, the majority of the funds are federal. With our TV also contributing, but the city does have our share. And the tool is just under a million dollars. As a reminder, the seed process is really to assess environmental, social and fiscal impacts of the project against existing city plans and policies. So, for example, the Bowling alley comprehensive plan, as well as rtmp and to identify and refined a preferred concept.

[69:02] And so, because we have a proposed concept for this project coming out of those studies that I mentioned at the beginning of the presentation we're really assessing the proposed concept, and then I know dealt option so doing. A refined expansion of the transit street or not doing not doing it. We held our first information session on October 27. And so. Things that we heard at that engagement opportunity where that we should ensure the safety of boulder high school students in the area and get an additional bus traffic. And so, our concept design will focus on ensuring that Vision Zero principles are applied to the study area, particularly at the intersections of 14 street and Canyon and arapahoe.

[70:03] We also heard, we ought to consider amenities on 14th street such as like parking and lighting. So those are things that we are looking into per the city standards. And then, extending the white rock ditch multi use path across 14 street, and so I just a note on that we. did recently replace the existing box covert bridge over the light rock ditch connecting 14th and 15th street the bridge lays the groundwork for an extension of the Multi use path further east, which is identified in the tmp. However, there are some private property constraints that may prevent us from doing that in the near future so that's something that we're looking into and working through. And then of course the impacts, the parking that I mentioned, are a concern for businesses in the area also the farmers market which is just one block over on 13th street.

[71:09] Next steps for the project, so we are going to give the City Council a briefing on where we are in the process next month, and then in February, we will hold our. Next Community engagement session and then do some further engagement online, we are planning on bringing a recommended or I should say we're we're planning on bringing the recommended design to you. In April and asking for your recommendation color in a public hearing and so that would be for the seat part of this and then, should you give us your recommendation we would go to city council in early summer of next year, with their option to call up the project.

[72:02] The project move forward from there, then we will begin finalizing the design work into the approval process in the summer and then working towards a fall 2023 construction. And i'll take any questions you have and we also have two people on the line, who can take ones that I don't have good answers for. Thanks Ryan. i'll turn it over to have any questions see if I can see you all. So Ryan, you referred to a beat you mark. You referred to the successful. With a transit stories I bet you know between. i'm blanking. On north of Canada Canyon. Yes, and. That street is pretty notable because it also restricts vehicle movements and back in that photo you can see motor vehicles with their diverted you know either left or right and buses and bikes get to go on that street.

[73:08] I know you've talked about removing parking on this outside of this intersection but are you also anticipating restricting vehicle movements. And then, as a related question i'm wondering if there's been thought i'm sure there has been thought i'm wondering what the thinking is about the routing of buses are they. Also, going to be coming on both directions on 14th street or will they be primarily coming from Canyon exiting on arapaho. How is this expected to impact those nearby streets if we change existing vehicular patterns. yeah those are good questions, so the first part of your question, we are not proposing restricting vehicular movements on 14 south of Kenyan and that's due to the fact that there are a number of businesses that wanting to use 14th in order to get to their properties. So it would just be very difficult to do that for us.

[74:04] Or the. Bus movements and I know I believe Danny is on the line, so you can weigh in if I don't say this, and its entirety or correctly. But we are still working on which routes will be served by the expansion and which will remain at the existing. station, and so we are working with our TV on that, but in till we know which routes exactly will be there we're not exactly sure how the approaches will work and how the warnings and a lightings will Danny do you have anything to add to that. Good evening, this is the me o'connor senior transportation planner transit program manager. Really, I guess, the only thing to add to that is. You know our TV is is a good and active partner in this project they're coming out this week.

[75:01] With some verses to do some turning. Turning movements and in different operational moves to really help inform. kind of the operation plan and which buses would go where with these expanded gates. Okay. i'm currently asking because of the. The public commentary about wanting to protect the high school students nearby say are, of course, not that far away 15th and a half ago. So curious if if putting it protected intersection on the arapaho and is at all, an option or that's more difficult if you're expecting high volumes a bus traffic. I don't know. So this is Garrett Slater principal logics engineer, and I can. Speak to that item and so as part of the the bus demonstration testing that will be doing this week with rtb what part of the the criteria we're going to be evaluating is.

[76:10] The ability of the buses, to make turns at some of these intersections and as we take a look at that, if there are opportunities to improve the the crossing safety while also allowing. Full movement of the the transit vehicles, then certainly will will factor that into the design, some of our preliminary analysis does show that most of the students travel down 13th or 15th and not so much 14th. Due to those being where the the traffic signals are located another bus routes, but with the presence of these bus gates coming in, on 14 that would certainly increase the likelihood of high school students using 14th as a pedestrian corridor. Right, and of course they're still on arapahoe at 14 street, which is why I was sort of highlighting that intersection.

[77:02] And, but it sounds like it doesn't necessarily that that the fact that their bus vehicles doesn't necessarily preclude something like a protected intersection of race intersection or the like, if that were deemed necessary. Right at this point, those options would still be on the table for consideration. Okay. Any other questions feedback from tab. mark. Go ahead, yes i'm sorry i'm sorry i'm scrolling through. Okay um My questions are in regard to the pedestrian crossing at 14,000 Canyon so. Are the mask arms and civilization in infrastructure there adequate should we want to implement a protected intersection protected left hand turns etc, or do we have a situation like we have at.

[78:16] baseline and mo hot where we we can't implement some things because the infrastructure is inadequate. So we haven't looked at the intersection for 14th and Canyon for protected elements mark and so that would be, I guess, as we take a look at the operation needs of the the bus vehicles, then we can factor in those types of questions as well. Is what what i'm really concerned about is a scenario someone from out of town gets dropped off at on walnut at this at the.

[79:02] The North side of the of the walnut street station. And they're trying to catch a bus to the airport or and I know the Ad will probably be under the shelter but but suddenly they realize oh my God i've got to cross Canyon i've got to go on 14th street a block block block and a half away to catch my bus and. So i'm concerned about pedestrians being in a rush trying to catch a bus and the civilization. being inadequate for pedestrians crossing. So I think that's something that we should look at, and so, as we have this pool of money to make these improvements I know it's not unlimited, but I would certainly. wouldn't want to be caught off guard for the signal ization aspects of 14 to Canyon the The other thing I have as a question that if you wanted to i'm sure there's a technical term for this and there's a.

[80:12] dancing square dance acronym where you turn all lights red, and you have pedestrians crossing in all directions, including diagonally all at once, so like we do. In our in our earlier discussion at time and 20th next to whittier elementary if you're a pedestrian and you hit that button. You are offered a an intersection where again the square dance term or whatever it is for that that particular condition allows for everyone to cross all at once, any direction. Would our current infrastructure allow for that kind of. pedestrian accommodation.

[81:02] I don't know the answer that question mark I don't know if anyone from operations it's on the call is able to speak to that. I can say that one factor that we would definitely need to consider is if we had an all stop what would that do to the queuing. In the westbound direction of Canyon and how that would affect buses being able to get in and out of the the station and how that might affect. departure and arrival times if we've got queuing during peak periods, but I don't know if anyone from operations is present, to be able to speak to that. hi good evening, this is Devon jocelyn principal traffic engineer for the city unfortunately mark I don't know the answer to your question, either at this time, and that is something we can check into. That you. Work it's called a barn stands. Yes.

[82:00] that's. that's what I was looking at is there a technical name for that all stop is that the. shoes okay. Thank you. All right, tab any other questions for Ryan. yeah I was just wondering if there's any mechanism, as you guys examine the operational details of this for thinking about the twice a week times when the farmers market is going on a week away and there's people in cars all over the place, going to the farmers market. It may be clear, I really liked this idea, so this isn't meant to be a negative it's just like huh there is something to potentially integrate with. Okay. Julie mentioned some sort of protections at a wrap 114 can you say a little bit more what you meant by that.

[83:01] So for me Alex. To I think mentioned arapaho and 14th and I was have margin talks about protected signal phasing. that's can even 14 I was curious what to is getting at. arapaho 14. yeah just a protected treatment there I have any whatever I don't want to dictate to stop what. You know what the mechanism is but i'm aware it's not civilized. And so what would we do there to protect pedestrians, as you know, assuming that there's bigger bust traffic less nimble bus traffic and still you know, at least for a good chunk of the year, some fairly erratic students in the area. Okay. Okay, so I see no other questions feedback for Ryan on this topic. looks like we can move along them.

[84:01] Thank you, thanks. Okay, we were no it matters matters from staff non agenda item one under here utility project related closure of baseline. Okay. So we have some folks here from the utility side of the House to talk about the utilities project that will have significant impact on baseline so with that I will turn it over to China kenichi. Thank you Erica and good evening tab Members, my name is Joe tucci I am the director of our utilities department. And I am here tonight with Chris olson Chris is a senior project manager and our utilities engineering work group. And we wanted to brief you on our baseline and foothills sewer project in advance of construction that will be.

[85:03] Starting in the New Year and Chris will be going through a few slides with you, but just briefly here, for me, this is a project that will increase the capacity of our wastewater collection system. And one of the primary and long term benefits of that to our Community is that it will alleviate the potential for sewer backups during precipitation events like happened. During the 2013 Ford, who are doing a number of these capacity projects, the project will also have some temporary transportation impacts, which. Chris will discuss, and so we wanted to check in with you tonight in advance of the work in case you get questions from Community members or to answer your. questions that you might have here tonight and then recognizing that there has been significant staff transition in both our. Transportation and mobility and utilities departments, since the design has started just for Chris and me to introduce ourselves so you will have a connection, and you can point people to us if you do get questions so with that I will turn it over to crystals and press.

[86:18] Thanks Joe i'm just for my own clarity can everybody see the PowerPoint screen that popped up. The thumbs up with no. No, not yet. not yet. Do wrong. i'd be sharing a different screen. So it says one participant can share the time. i'll try it again. All right, we can see it now. Okay, good. alrighty thanks Joe. yeah well i'll touch very, very briefly, on on some of the planning and drivers for the project and what the project is.

[87:01] And then we'll kind of get into some of the the traffic impacts and detours that are planned and sort of what outreach activities have happened to date and what's planned to to move forward. So, very briefly, as Joe touched on during during heavy precipitation events we we get a substantial amount of. Of rainwater that enters our wastewater collection system, and we have certain level of service goals. For how much of you know what level of storm, we want to be able to handle and on this figure here, this is a. This is a model that that illustrates certain areas of our collection system that have limited capacity during some of those more severe rainfall events. So these areas that are that are noted in red and orange tend to be a little bit more capacity limited and and have greater risk to our customers have sanitary sewer backups or overflows into the into the environment, so we really work to try and minimize those.

[88:05] So that's a that's a simulation that's done it's a it's a computer program that's you know it's based on you know all the geometry of our system, but we also look at from a practical standpoint, where we have seen. sanitary sewer backups are overflows in historic time, so this figure was was developed after the 2013 flood and any note in. or any any of these nodes that are either in in orange or blue were a backup into somebody's somebody's home or business during the 2013 flood the area that we're looking at improving the service to is this area that's highlighted in red here in this area. So generally that area is bound it's on the South side, where where this you know this off ramp here is the intersection of 36 and South boulder road. This this service areas is this area that kind of.

[89:02] You know, on the South side it's it's bound by 36 here foothills parkway intersects it down the middle and it runs this whole service area sort of runs all the way out to South boulder creek where our interceptor pipeline runs. And so, and then on the North side the service area is baseline road right here. So to you know we're really improving the service to this whole area that's illustrated in this kind of its kind of yellowish tan color here but i'll note a couple of things on sort of the interior sub basin areas. These two spots in blue and red here that i'm circling they're currently served by a single 10 inch line that runs down underneath the median of foothills right now and and that line as a you know, to serve this area really needs to be a 15 inch line and it's currently a 10. So you know, one might one might think oh great we're going to have to dig up foothills to to address this will know there's there's actually.

[90:05] A good opportunity alone thunderbird road and thunderbird court that's just on the West side of that so we're actually going to install a parallel pipeline that's going to convey all the flow from this red area. Up to an existing crossing and then we'll tie in here and then this this line currently ties into a line that runs from west to east. Down the down the existing baseline corridor and there are also limitations on how much this line can flow. So this this line gets in the size increased and installed at a steeper slope so we're able to convey additional capacity from really this entire this entire sub base and in the city here. So essentially there's a we start near just just west of the bubble link trailhead on some open space mountain parks property.

[91:01] From there we're along the baseline right away West almost all the way to foothills and then down. This is a small little drainage on the South side of baseline in the north side of foothills here, and then we pick it up again on the West side of the road. And this is in front of the on the on the east side of the safeway shopping Center here the Colorado athletic club and frazier meadows and this is an existing pedestrian bridge crossing that goes up and over foothills in the more about a block south of that. Unfortunately, given the geometry of baseline and existing utilities that are in the area there's no right way to really construct this this project without interrupting traffic in in baseline. That we're bound by by neighborhoods to the north, in this area. and end to the south, both you know city city of boulder residents and boulder county residents live in this area.

[92:06] And really we're a pretty deep sewer line here we're we're in the 10 to 15 foot deep branch and. East of 55th baseline is is bi directional so there's you know one eastbound in one westbound lane and there's really no way to get equipment in. And shoehorn it between between properties and getting in and doing it safely with with traveling you know even to be able to keep one lane open would be would be pretty dangerous. So that essentially means there will be a sustained closure of baseline road. From west of gapper road, which is, which is right here the bubble link trailhead is is right about it this this logo right here, so there will still be access to the global link trailhead throughout the entirety of construction. And it will be closed from this this point 250 fifth to everyone except for local and emergency access so folks may need to get to their home and police and fire may need to get two residences.

[93:10] from one side of the project area or the other side of the project area, so it essentially turn this stretch of baseline into a dead end road for those residents. Phase two is some intersection phasing work. Phase three is the next the next phase at that at 55th baseline transitions from being two lanes on the east side to being four lanes that's divided by a median on on the West side. So we're able to divert traffic on to the north, so the what is the current westbound lanes will transition to serve both eastbound and westbound and the project area will be in the south side, so the current eastbound lanes. From there there's a little bit of work, this is. This is some seed out right away that will be right up right up against but we don't anticipate having significant impacts for any any sustained period of time in this area.

[94:10] And then, once we make a tie in on the West side, this is near multiuse path that runs on the east side of that safeway shopping Center. will be running South down. down the path corridor on the thunderbird court down to thunderbird drive and then making final tie ins south of near Ricardo. So we'll be able to maintain access to everybody within the closure area, with the exception of a few small. We may be in front of somebody's driveway for an afternoon and we'll just be coordinating directly with those residents at that time, when that when that happens, but essentially it will be able to maintain access for for both residents and emergency vehicles through the area.

[95:02] So with closures come detours I didn't I kind of I kind of summarize the the major detour because I didn't want to pull up 10 pages of hts. And for tab which is generally the intent is for the primary detour to intersect or to intercept traffic on baseline at 76 and divert them down to South boulder road. Up to foothills and then back. So that would that would catch you know some of the major commuter traffic that comes into town from from the east and leaving from. From the West but it's not going to catch everyone there, there are certainly neighborhoods and things so there's sort of a secondary detour right at the at the work area, and that would go up and up or down 55th to arapahoe and then down cherry hill at that point. bicycle detour is up 55th. And then to the centennial trail and that ties into the south boulder creek trail and back down to the bubble link trailhead at this point here.

[96:10] we've done a significant amount of outreach to try and inform folks of the upcoming project, starting in May this year it's been a large variety of. Of mailers and then personally reaching out to to certain stakeholders folks like our TD holder valley schools, police and fire. there's there's one daycare Center that's within the closure area so coordinating with them and making sure that we're not impacting them at times the parents are dropping off kids that. And that were you know, addressing addressing their needs. Additionally, there you know just generally in the project area, there are a number of businesses there's the athletic club there's frazier meadows that both have access, near. near the area there there's second Baptist Church and the Islamic Center also in the area, so reaching out to those to those teams and those guys.

[97:07] have also been following up with. Targeted mailers and next door posts. Next door posts are slated to be coming out, you know a little bit closer to the to the timing if if you get ahead of people a little bit. little bit too soon, they tend to forget about it so that'll be about the same time that variable message boards go up in in this area, and then, as we go through the prod you know the actual construction of the project will be maintaining the the city cones own sites. As well as similar next door posts and variable message signage and we have set up a bi weekly meeting with certain transportation stakeholders to keep them informed of progress. So you know getting our TD, and the school district, and things in in the same room and trying to make sure that they're informed on on what's going on with the project.

[98:03] So that was a pretty high level project summary and with that i'll turn it over to transportation staff for any follow up from from their team. I think natalie you might have a couple. Words yeah sorry sorry about that I was working on my mute button. Thanks Chris and yeah, I just wanted to add just so that tabs aware, we will be coming we have this quarter planned for pavement resurfacing in 20 2014 timeframe that's obviously tentative but. we'll be coming back we're planning in 2024 and at that time is when will be as we you know prepare for the improvements in 2024 will be looking at what type of enhancements we can make through the Vision Zero Program. Similar you know to what we've done on other core doors today.

[99:03] Nothing. yeah. Is that for both East and West of those on based on. It so I was thinking specifically of East of hills Garrett Garrett may be able to provide the timing for West hills. Or we can get back to you with that if he doesn't have it offhand. Yes, I don't have the answer to that offhand Alex I know that the the plan was focused primarily East foothills but I will follow up and see, we have a timeline identified for baseline West. Okay, West looks like it's not on the. map is that safe to assume that that's true, and it will be 2023 at the earliest. that's correct okay. Thank you. Okay. Thanks Chris yep.

[100:03] Any questions from tab. Yes, I see right there. Chris thanks a lot question I heard you I heard some discussion on on someone referencing multiuse pass and trying to follow, can you just say directly. Where if at all well multiuse pads were with where you know people who would be traveling maybe with small kids are elderly or whatever, who are really going to be sensitive to versions on to higher stress areas where will they be effective. And so the only the only multi use path that's affected is is from thunderbird court North up to baseline and and we still we're still sort of sorting out what the what the official detour would be for that. So I would i'm not going to defer to anyone in transportation at this moment to try and clarify, but it is.

[101:04] On our on our projects we we try not to forget about the bike path you know that those types of pass it's it's an important motive transit for the city and and we definitely have a requirement to take care of those users. Thank you. thanks for that right. anyone else scrolling through. All right. Joe Chris Thank you very much, it looks like all we have. Okay. Next, Dr Carter update. hi good evening tab my name is Jean sansone I am a principal transportation planner with the city. And thanks for having me this evening so. This evenings regional update is going to be a briefing about the upcoming Dr Cox tip or transportation improvement program call for projects and i'm going to share my screen to give me just one second.

[102:12] See. All right, are you guys seeing a slide. Okay awesome wonderful so just a reminder, so the last time we went through this cycle and where we identified projects to bring forward for. Transportation improvement program dollars was back in 2013 for and 19 for the 2022 2023 cycle and this list just gives you a sense of the types of projects that have been are being funded through. A variety of sources and part of the doctor cocktail so, for example, the 28th street bike lanes was a regional tip application that we submitted with boulder county and the city of longmont to complete.

[103:05] Our northern section of 28 street, which is in final design now, along with improvements that are being made on the trunk of the diagonal or. Between boulder in longmont and then long line is putting dollars into improving Kaufman street. As part of the regional brt project at the north end of that quarter so again just an example of a larger scale tip project. And then the the projects that are listed down below or sub regional tip projects, so you heard from Ryan earlier this evening about the status of the downtown boulder station. We also mentioned the East arapaho multi use path and transit enhancements project which the seed was just approved by you all. The hot transit service expansion project, which was re scoped to purchase electric vehicles for our fleet and. At one time there was a proposal for a table Mesa multi use path and access improvement tip project.

[104:03] Those funds are now being directed towards improvements to 30th street between Colorado and our happened arapaho for raised. bicycle lanes and then I just want to mention the state highway seven bridge replacement tip project so that is a project along arapaho. And it is replacing the brother to bridge spans over boulder creek, and so this project is currently on the waitlist. it's not looking very likely that we will be able to accept the waitlist dollars, because there are restrictions that are coming with the dollars for that project and. they're very small percentage of the dollars, that we would need to complete that project but we're coordinating closely with si dot region for to. find other sources of dollars to replace that bridge, so an example of just how we leverage our local funds with state and federal dollars to.

[105:00] To bring forward these important local and regional projects that improve travel for all modes of transportation so with the upcoming. tip schedule and I don't expect you to read the details of this, but what I wanted to do tonight was just give you a preview. Of what we're thinking this next cycle of or call for projects is going to look like. And I should note that this schedule is still in draft form so again, I just want to make sure we all understand what the schedule will likely look like, but it's something that the Board is going, Dr cardboard is going to take action on this month. So, if they do take action and approve the schedule, Dr Khan will be opening up at a call for projects for regional projects. In January in late January and we've been in conversations with boulder county and our regional partners about bringing forward projects along Colorado 119 the diagnostic as well as Colorado seven two of our higher priority.

[106:01] Names quarter projects and then you'll notice that the first sub regional call is going to open most likely in May of this year and close in 2022. Then there'll be another regional call for projects in October of this year, and another sub regional call. In early 2023 and i'm not going to get into the details of why they're doing this to track process this year, except to say that with. The influx of arpa or federal stimulus funds as well as state new State transportation dollars. It just works out that it makes more sense to bring these forward in two different tracks and so what I want to focus on just for a minute is this first sub regional call for projects so. What this means is that we have between now essentially and may to start thinking about what the candidate projects are that we would move forward with.

[107:00] And I will say that, at this point in time, it seems to us to make sense that we would also identify that identify projects for that second call as well, so as. Not to make this a two step process for ourselves at the city, but be prepared to submit candidate projects for both the first and second sub regional calls. So i'm just going to spend a quick minute looking at what that application process has looked like and will likely look like moving forward so. We start by identifying candidate tip projects we develop very high level concept designs and cost estimates, we take that out to our Community members. And to Dr Kong for feedback and then bring those projects to tab for your endorsement before it goes to city council and verse in me submit those projects. As candidate projects for our applications, and I want to focus on that that first Square, which is to identify candidate tip projects so again.

[108:02] I wanted to mention that I bring this early because there's work for us to do even to get to that first box, if you will, so. As a staff are going to be working to identify what our I would say theme or policy approach. To putting projects forward will be so, for example, are we looking at regional connections, is it more of a quarter approach should we also be considering our lives just walking bike network. What is the status of studies for projects that are part of the tmp and what is their project readiness and then what types of projects might be more appropriate for other. types of grant applications are set asides so we're not sure what that's gonna look like, it would be great to get feedback from tab this evening. But we are going to be working diligently to identify what that process looks like to bring those projects and to that first stage and we'll be updating you along the way, and so thank you let's see yes, thank you.

[109:04] And that's all I had and i'm happy to answer questions and i've got Garrett here, which is great because he's actually been was closely involved in the last process and i'm still getting my arms around what this is looking like but happy to answer questions, so thank you. So gene if i'm understanding you correctly you're looking tonight for feedback from tab about how basically how we should be prioritizing among sort of an existing wish list of potential tip projects. Well yeah you know, to let me be nice to start brainstorming that or to follow up after this evening's meeting, because this is all very new information. And really the point of this evening's briefing was just just to let you know that this is coming. Okay. Thanks, now we know it's coming what's coming.

[110:01] Well, well, I was like I said, you know the what's coming first is we're going to be bringing to tab what are proposed approaches to identifying. Okay. And you're still figuring out what that I put but that proposed approach is. We are still figuring that out and. And you know, based on a lot of the work that we've done, you know, over the past past year or two you know, we want to be more systematic about it this time around, so. we're you know we're really focusing on and more of a standardized approach to putting these projects forward, and you know another consideration is looking at. The scoring criteria for these projects so again like what is going to make a good candidate project what's going to score well So those are the types of factors will be considering. And do we know what that scoring criteria looks like because it's that's been changing over the course of the last couple of years. yeah it has been changing and we have a pretty good sense of what well, we have a pretty good sense of what it looks like for the regional tip application so, in other words.

[111:02] The draft application right now waits i'm going to stop sharing for a second because i'm gonna. pull up this information I don't want to miss speak and so let's see right now the regional tip application is scoring regional impact of the proposed project at. 30% of the waiting and then. 50% is weighted towards metro vision regional transportation plan priorities, and there are six of those priorities, so they include safety air quality regional transit active transportation freight and multimodal mobility, so that is 50% project readiness accounts for 10% and. we're missing one yeah project leveraging accounts for 10% so, in other words, how much match is the local entity, putting forward. So that's what he so that's what we're seeing for the draft regional application at this point again it hasn't been approved.

[112:05] We expect the sub regional application to look very similar to this but it's up to our sub reach Dr colleague boulder county sub Regional Forum to identify exactly what that criteria looks like for the sub region so, for example. Where the region's looking at regional impacts, we might be looking at sub regional impacts or inner city travel. Okay Eric I see your hand up. I guess just contextually you know we're sharing with this with you early in the process and, as we know it, you know there's clearly fluidity involved. But this is part of the kind of sausage making, if you will, when it comes to transportation funding and getting a you know. one or more projects funded within this regional process and so that's really the intent, you know today of just trying to share that with you and give you kind of a peek behind the curtain of essentially how a project comes to be a funding standpoint.

[113:09] Okay, thanks for that Alex. yeah thanks for presenting on this June it's exciting to be a part of this process from the beginning of must have been reacting to. projects that were well before my time so it's cool to be on the front end of this. i'm curious how shovel ready things need to be or how much analysis, the city feels, we need to do before we're comfortable going after something so, for example, we've got this these fabulous multimodal improvements coming in, on 30th street that will get us from. Colorado up to arapahoe and then we've got a study that gets us from arapaho close to Pearl if we wanted to continue that sort of improvement north of Pearl would we. be able to rely on that corridor study or do we need to hit the ground running on a court or study, so that we could.

[114:01] Have a conceptual design that we could then look up what the cost might be at it and get Community feedback and tab and Council by in advance of submitting the application for a project like that. So I I would defer to Garrett, to speak specifically to a project like that, but I would say. You know what Dr Kong is looking for when they're speaking about project readiness is they want to avoid the pitfalls of. You haven't gotten through environmental clearance or there might be, you might get tripped up in environmental clearance and or. There might be issues with right away acquisition and that sort of thing, so you want to do enough to feel confident and moving it forward. But, again, I would speak to I would ask Eric to kind of speak to that level of readiness for a specific quarter project like the one you mentioned Alex. yeah, so I would say that the plan that we have in place for 30 streets between our APP home Pearl is certainly.

[115:08] better than nothing, but I would imagine to score, the highest points possible in that category they'd be looking for something a little bit more engineering oriented and a little less planning centric in terms of its content. And so they're they're the highest points possible would be that we have a set of final construction plans and we just need to get. approvals on all the different aspects and permits that are required, but we don't have the time or the budget for that, so I would say if we wanted to position, a project. of that sort, and in that segment that we would need to advance some design work to have a cost estimate that, as a little bit more. based on actual quantities on the ground and a little less planet metric or in it, so I would say that we could spend some effort to score better points to position the project for for better award opportunities.

[116:06] Okay. We would need to review that on each of the projects that are being considered right. What level of readiness, we feel we are versus where we think we need to be in order to make them as successful as possible for consideration of award. What are some examples of places where we've done some of that preliminary design work and my be able to in a year's time, be able to submit some. convincing plans, I know we've studied Canyon we've got 119 and highway seven are there any other places where we've we've done some of the groundwork dinner would be well situated. Right so so the quarter studies that we've got in place as you noted and there's also the Colorado court or would be another place that we've done some some study that that we could. Take a look at, and I would also save it, there are other project locations where we have previously done design work and the hope that a project might be considered.

[117:10] For a temp award and that work is still good work, it would still be that would need to be sort of dust it off an example of that would be. We have a multiuse path that runs parallel to 28 street or highway 36 from basically the self edge of the city up to four mar Canyon creek and we have. an actual final design ready to go to complete that multiple use path, all the way up to the connection with broadway but it's been. unsuccessful twice and prior applications based off the criteria, depending on the the shape the criteria comes up with this next call that might be another example of a project that could be considered right. Okay, thanks, but so if a tab or Council on something that we don't have on the books is there would there be time to if it was a priority and fit into the word plan next year, do you think there'll be time to turn that around and.

[118:09] early enough that it can be successful. So fortunately i'm not directly underneath the table from Erica natalie's they can't kick me with my response here i'll say I would have some concerns about our ability to jump on an effort, based on our current staffing levels, but if. You all is our advisory board says it's a priority, then that would be something that not only America, we need to help and prioritize amongst all the other items we've got in the work plan. We appreciate the transparency and then. Just for clarification sake, neither natalie nor I kick anyone under the table, or even over the table, but. I guess what i'd like to highlight, you know in this conversation in this process is that.

[119:00] It takes a fair amount of getting ready in order to be able to go up and ask for money, and so I know that i've heard from tab members in the past, you know being frustrated about. Having corridor studies and so forth, and then you know the matter process that we have to go through, but in order to be competitive in this regional and state funding arena. The more information we have, in order to be competitive with other jurisdictions and other projects, the better off, we are so having that you know, clarity and these different layers of the onion. It makes us more nimble whenever the opportunity for funding arises because it usually comes and goes pretty quickly, you know as gene that said in the schedule, but then. You know alex's point about well if there were to be a project, you know how nimble can we be and actually achieving it.

[120:04] You know it's one of these bigger than bigger than a breadbox smaller than an elephant kind of things and so we'd have to figure out what we have to be able to dust off to hurry up and scurried up make it. I don't know if not shovel ready at least boom ready. Thank you. Thanks natalie you have your hand up or maybe. yeah I was, I was just an ad and. So, so I think just to kind of round out the conversation I think we're planning to come back potentially in January, if we have more information about the process at that point from Dr cod. And so I think it'll be helpful, because at that point we will have had a chance to have some internal conversations about. You know our own kind of how are we what's the policy driving our priorities. And then also kind of looking at as as Garrett mentioned, you know past efforts to get funds and so we can look at what's kind of on the shelf that we could potentially desktop and we can bring some options forward.

[121:07] You know, potentially January, February to tab and that might just kind of help guide the discussion a little bit more. detail I don't know if you have anything to add to that as far as just like process for next steps. Now I think that's right and it might just be categories of projects in January, as we start to dig a little bit more into. Project readiness and and I know we say desktop but you know, frankly, we have a lot of very relevant and timely quarter projects and design work that we feel pretty optimistic about moving forward as potential candidate projects too so maybe not that dusty. So in listening to this, you know process and how much goes into the scoring and just the length of time that it takes to to to realize anything. Out of out of these wish lists it's a little discouraging when I you know want, I want to see things that will often require.

[122:07] Coordination from other cities other agencies in its it's mysterious to me. Advancing um but there's this long that need for a bike way like what we have on us 36 between here in Denver. To have the same thing between here in Lyons and that there, there seems to be just absolutely no hope of ever achieving that and so i'm just very confused about how how we even get to a stage where we're we're proceeding with. Real byway plans along the diagonal to between here in longmont and what what you know, the average. person who wants to see a correction and change in direction. toward more vulnerable road users in a real distinct way that is different from how we've been thinking about things for the last 20 years because the stuff that's on the shelf is still sort of reflecting.

[123:14] Some miss allocation, I would say, of prior public priorities and public funding and I don't know how we. How we turn that around, and I think the second thing that I would say on this process is we'll get to it when we start talking about. Our letter to city council for their retreat. But you know tabs done a fair bit of navel gazing in the last couple of months, you know how do we actually help staff and help this city realize the goals that we've set our our Community goals and the tmp. And the biggest lever that we could think of the biggest sort of litmus test was reduced you know motor vehicle miles traveled because that's going to push this along. The right direction, or at least leanness in a better direction than we've been leaning for the last 10 years and so.

[124:02] If I could offer at this stage, just one you know one big lens the tabs going to be applying to this probably when we do come back and discuss this is. How does it measure up to, and how does it serve our larger goals in the tmp and when we've kicked you know, reduce bmt as the big litmus test. That we want counseling to turn to will probably ask you to do the same thing, unless you got a good answer for prayer casing something else but that's going to be sort of the flavor that we are going to be. hoping to add to the soup I guess. I think that's that's really good feedback and direction to it, and I would say very consistent with the conversations that we're having with our regional partners about putting forward regional tip applications, for example, for when the 119 day I know between. boulder in longmont so we're doing a lot of internal work to look at what. The most viable project would be knowing we can't fund the entire project, but also, knowing that, for example.

[125:05] When we're looking at improvements at nodes at key intersections, for example. That when we're putting in transit slip lanes that we're also putting in the underpasses needed for the bike lane because we wanted to touch a project once right we want, we don't want to go back so we're getting. Really, strategic and creative about how to stop silo going even see dot projects between you know roadway transit and bicycle projects, but to look at it comprehensively and I think you're going to see that reflected, particularly in the regional applications that we're putting together. Right, thank you. Kevin anything else on this. All right, thanks gene. Very much yeah. neighborhood green streets update as next DK.

[126:01] face life, well done. let's see should be working now. yeah please God. Okay. Great. you're not seeing the Little Red box that says give subtitles a try, are you. yeah. We are. is bizarre. He. Maybe I want to get past that it'll go away, but i'm hi i'm you know me up DK and your transportation planner and great to be back with you happy holidays tab. and have a brief presentation, for you tonight actually consider this a two parter because we're gonna be back in February, with a little bit more detail. Tonight we're going to give you a brief update on kind of where where where we've been and where we're going, and also the presentation i'm sharing with you tonight is a. Oh it's Okay, is a.

[127:03] i'm sorry i'm trying to get this off here for some reason it's not working it's me one second here. A little technical difficulty. Is that working a little better. For folks okay. Great okay good, and so the presentation i'm sharing with tonight is a slightly modified version from the one that was in your packet we've made some refinements to it, so when to. Put a shout out for that alright so let's go ahead and take a look at progress today. You know, essentially we've been working on this micro network for some of our high priority neighborhood green streets and again for those that are not familiar neighborhood green seats are one of the facility types that are in our low stress walk it back network plan. The other two being bike lanes preferred be buffered and then also the vertical separated. The vertically separated facilities like multi use paths and protected bike lanes and so, for the past.

[128:04] Two and a half years now we've been working on our neighborhood green streets, and it was in 2019 when we incorporated the low stress walk and bike network plan into the tmp. Work and and our first project we went to town on was the 13th street, and that was our first trial run at putting in our first neighborhood green street. And we did that between 2019 and 20 and then last year and part of this year we finished up with grove and 23rd street and currently we are studying and will be working to implement early next year 19th street 22nd and maple to the streets. And so, for tonight, I just wanted to share what those focus streets are a few key points of interests. So 19th has a number of different intersections here that we're going to be focusing on pretty straightforward fortunately there's a lot of a lot of the intersections already have facilitated crossings, that is there a centralized.

[129:03] But there is some. Some work that will be doing in conjunction with some other projects that are happening. And for example at 19th and walnut there is a development occurring there the old September school they're putting a new multi use path. And so, essentially what we're trying to do here is create a direct line that will access see new in that see you campus we're 19th ends on the South part is where the new bridge currently as it goes into to see you. And I should also mention to the red lines on the map here, those are grove and 23rd so those were implemented last year and, earlier this year, but I included those in the presentation to help you understand how we're how even working on this micro network. And, and then taking a look at. 22nd here, we have some overlap with our pavement management program and in and so 22nd we resurfaced and 2022.

[130:12] And the intersection that arapaho and 22nd is a challenging intersection so we're doing a study right now to determine what that best crossing will be in come back in February will have more information. And and speaking of cross pollination with other programs and projects Ryan mentioned early earlier about a lot of the. SMP work that he's doing in this area as well, and so we are coordinating on maple street and, of course, for highlighted the intersection of maple 10 and 23rd will be installing high visibility crosswalk. And so, for in 2022 will be back with you at your next tab that the February town meeting. we're at take a look at the data collection and the results of that data collection and the Community engagement we've done.

[131:04] we're going to take a look at some of the conceptual designs that we have for those intersections going to talk about our implementation timeline. And then we're also going to discuss what some of the proposed focus streets will be for the next round of neighborhood green streets and. starting next year and in through 2023 also will have the opportunity to look at our low stress walking by network plan update. As part of the overall transportation master of master plan updates are looking forward to that so with that I know that was really quick, but just a quick high level for you and thank you for your time i'm happy to answer any questions. Thanks decay. Questions anyone. We cycle through it's hard for me to see DK with me, sharing the screen. Okay me. Sorry i'm a little that's helpful, thank you.

[132:00] Any any questions. So we're letting you off easy I guess that was all crystal clear. Pretty straightforward okay. Well we'll be back. With a lot more information so just. One of. The highlights real kind of where we've been where we're going. Okay, I think i'm curious about you know we're always trying to evaluate how we're doing um what's what kind of data, do we have to evaluate the first green street the 13th street. Counting number of people on there are we, what are we thinking. that's a good question, and let me get back to you. can have more comprehensive answer. Okay, actually we've been. Collecting data we've been collecting over that quarter. Okay, thanks, Federal I am. Right now we're letting you off easy. Okay, well, thank you have a good night to have. All right, you to. see your capstone engagement natalie.

[133:02] Yes, thanks, and I do not have a PowerPoint, but I just wanted to provide a brief update, because I, we were called you know tabs interest in our engagement with see you earlier in 2021, and so we just wanted to update you that we have been working with them on a couple of different projects. With airport, most recently. we've been engaging with the College of architecture and environmental design, with a group of students who actually reached out to us to look at how the they could come up with designs, to make the airport and more like Community facing asset and, and so our. Our airport tenants some of our airport tenants, and also our airport manager john kenney has been engaging with them on that work and another. Just bit of good news, out of engagement with see you as we've also been there was interest in their aerospace engineering department having an opportunity to come out and utilize some of the space at the airport to develop prototypes for electric aircraft.

[134:12] And so we're partnering with them on that and they're engaging with some of our tenants, to have access to hangar space to do that work so that's really great and then. we're also working with them on the visa evaluation work so they've done some preliminary student from their master's program has done some preliminary evaluation. of our visa treatments and so they have shared some of those findings with us and and will continue to evaluate those and. have more information to share, probably in late q1 with tab about how those things are performing for us but that's all I had and i'm happy to answer any questions if anyone has any.

[135:00] I don't have any questions anyone else. Great we'll move right along thanks natalie interesting cool. Okay, assuming, there are no other managed him staff we're going to move now to matters from the board. looks like we're good okay Madison the board and let's turn to the letter. That Ryan and mark worked on Ryan did email a revised version of the letter and a red line version. Just before the meeting. I thought I thought the draft was terrific, by the way, yeah and I hope you got some feedback from some other people, but. Does anyone have a proposal of how to revise this or what we have, we want to proceed. You look at it, maybe say a word or two for. Do Thank you.

[136:00] Okay, so just in, mark you, you can you wait to do here, but just so everybody's on the same page. So we mark and I developed this letter and it's yeah it's, the most recent one this afternoon um that's that's the updated one Alex gave me a couple of data points on on some stats that yeah that. But um but just just to tell you that you know we tried to do the will of the discussion from our last. And we really debated some different pros and cons of kind of some different trainings and and then we took a step back as well we sure this is the right approach, it would be more focused on Vision Zero. Recognizing comments you know from key light others about our tutorials and um and it was you know which is not easy to focus on one thing, but we agreed on this, in the end for for a few reasons I this thesis. Is thesis for a few reasons um so one is this allows us, this allows Council to compass, a number of different of rtmp goals what up being pretty focused on this, the single one.

[137:10] It brings together land use and other matters that are that are outside of our generally I said, have a formal scope on that we're not going to get down without counsel Calvin. And then, this seems to be a topic that our new Council somebody Members are quite interested in, so it felt like the right thing this time. And I have you have tried to you've given comments you get I talked to you Alex has provided some comments I tried to make this work together. patch I don't think we've heard from you, so this is now's your time. But we need to get this into I think by noon on Wednesday, has the email, so my hope would be that we can do by tomorrow so either with any edits tonight, or a deadline of tomorrow late morning, if anything else, and then ask for blessing to know just just to send this on.

[138:04] Well i'm happy to. Have a comment, and I didn't I didn't respond because i'm just i'm very supportive of bmt as a theme it's it's a business really hard. And you know figure out what to measure and all the wide range of policy drivers to it. But I thought that you guys hit the right set of themes which is. You have to work on bmt as a met overall measurement construct, and you have to have a way for those themes together to come together and they don't come together and then he existing into the other than the Council. And I think you made that point pretty clearly, so I think at this stage, rather than try to prescribe something very, very detailed. For for the Council since, since you know the, the only place for the liver sit is with them.

[139:03] And they're you know they're they're not city management there, the Council, so they need to think about mechanisms and that's the one piece that I wasn't quite sure how to work in there was mechanisms, because you know we've got all these entities and all these processes, but. What by what mechanisms to they orchestrate themselves around the bmt theme. Okay. um. I would kind of please that we are not being too prescriptive about. How to achieve things, but that this was one, as I say, one big lens that tab is intending to put in front of a bunch of work going forward does this actually reduce me empty or you know and thereby effect a number of other goals that we have.

[140:01] articulated as a community and and rtmp is important goals, so I didn't I the the how wasn't as critical to me because the how really is left up to the city manager, the Director of transportation and her staff, so I didn't want to. Step on any further toes we already have with this, I am curious whether Erica or natalie have any. response or reaction to what we have in here, I know that you know Councils like just one item and be succinct and we're like here here's the biggest cookie we can think of. And some of the feedback that I gave to Ryan was essentially they know fully operationalize and achieving results by 2022 is cray cray. So any any any gut check any you know real problems or reactions, I would be very interested to hear from you.

[141:01] Thank you so much for I guess you know your gut check or whatever about you know, having substantive results by the end of 2022 That having been said, I had a really, really great conversation with Ryan, this afternoon, and it, I think that in this letter that. Both Ryan and market put together that it really acres in a really key point with regard to our transportation master plan and how to begin to. Look, through a slightly different lens we have our goals, but you know how do we put a strategic planning framework in place to actually achieve those goals. And anchor at least one of those elements in this case being bmt and. I told Ryan that. I fear the tab is bound to be dissatisfied with the end result.

[142:03] In terms of an all of us actually because we want to do things faster we want to do more of it, and we want to have it, you know move very quickly and as. You need that a taste of just earlier today some things aren't able to move as quickly as any of us want, but by the same token, this gives impetus to move things forward in a very straightforward and strategic way and I think. it's easy. I think. The input, the tab is providing on this is really stellar. And really don't have much to say, beyond that, not just joking. Okay, so that's going to go in the Minutes, the input tab is providing family stellar. Okay. Well, you know i'm prepared to be to be underwhelmed and no one's ever accused us of undershooting so i'm pretty pleased with, where the draft is that I suppose, what I would like to know is, many members of tab having reviewed.

[143:13] The revised version, the red line version that Brian sent around around I don't have time for 434. Are you okay with those changes any further revisions any further major changes that you have to suggest. And you know if you don't want to sign on this is your time to say I don't want to sign on as well, or I thought this letter was going to go a different direction. You look I just quickly just quickly stipulate so the data points that Alex and provided in the draft on the second page there's a reference to. We ever had a reduction in 20% of the empty mile vehicle miles and serious crashes down 40% I believe that should be 29% on the on the vehicle miles and on the crashes, it should be a 44% total.

[144:04] yeah that was 43 or so, but. In 40 and 31% serious so reflect those were Alex whatever you. Okay yeah that's what I saw from the latest streets. Oh yeah i'm supportive of this, as is. appreciate the work that Ryan if mark kept put into this towards the bottom left lists areas where. We should factor in bmt two areas, I would also consider our traffic studies and corridor studies, those are. city processes that span both transportation and planning and we typically plan for all too often we plan for an increase in growth. In bmt and those are places where updates to our DCS or just general practices could lead to planning for a reduction in bmt and I think.

[145:01] Over time, if we planned like that we would get what we plan for which right now is growth and the future the month production so traffic second quarter So these are the only two things I would request you can sit so. To be clear, you would add traffic studies and quarter studies in at the end of the sentence that begins bmt reduction needs to include land use commas own economy that that sentence. Okay. um yeah I was wondering because well because of the work it you Alex and market been highlighting is if we should be talking about you know budgeting as well. Well, this is an activity will be on the formal scope of term yeah yeah. um. I think the only other thing that jumps out at me still is the phrase fully operation lies.

[146:02] At the end of the success could be defined paragraph at the top. As long as we have a plan and are making measurable progress I don't know that we need to say it has to be like falling in place, I will be. pleasantly surprised. If we can manage to to have a plan, and you know I did suggest that we we point out work that that staff has already done and can pull off the shelf we're talking about dusting things off shelves. and put cobble together a plan, and this is not talking about you know beginning a whole new public engagement mission, but instead to take the work that staff has done and try to point all of all of it toward bmt reduction released. view it with a with an eye toward whether it advances bmt reduction. Even if we can't fully operationalize that plan because part of that plan might be pursuing tip grant money that you know.

[147:06] Has has a big impact on bmt where we're not going to be able to actually have realized that that goal in 2022 or 2023 necessarily so, I would just take out the be fully operationalize that. Take out fully. Take a fully. operationalize or something about the fact that it's it's. being implemented. it's being where yeah Okay, I understand okay. I mean we're beyond the planning stages of. Talking about right future you know, like this is actually happening what's. Okay, take out fully. Mark you have you've been very quiet this whole time. Well, I want to say a couple things one each draft of this and there have been substantial changes and every draft initial ones between Ryan, and I.

[148:08] Again Ryan did the. lion's share of the work and i'm really appreciative of that but. Each track is improved, and I think this latest strap is great. And as far as the operational ised fully operationalize them message that I want. To counsel to hear is that. feel I remember back in the day when we first adopted Vision Zero you were really against moving towards Vision Zero right okay so it's like I don't want to be planning to have a plan that etc so and having a plan.

[149:00] doesn't mean we have implemented that it doesn't mean that we have an infinite amount of money, it means that we have completed this plan and we've said okay now we're starting we're not planning to start, we have started. And there's a you know so anyway, that that was that's really all I have to say, other than I, in this new version I think is missing, some commas. And i'd like to change a couple things in the sense of breaking things into two sentences were there one very long sentence, but I don't know if we need to do that now if we, as a board can say hey. This this conveys our message and we're going to let Ryan, and with input from others operating under the correct procedure. provide that sort of niggling input that i'm referring to i'm ready to go with it, I really appreciate the the very latest input that.

[150:10] that other Members have provided. Okay, great. um. stressful who's who's okay with. Approving this current draft and without. realizing there might be a couple of comments or a few word choices. But that the substance of the draft will not change and approving it and letting final cleanup go back to Ryan sounds like he's made author. to submit to cancel tomorrow i'm good with that Alex looks good with that marks okay I just good Okay, we all seem pretty good on that basis i'm really was very pleased to see the draft that came out this was. terrific work both of you Thank you so much for that and.

[151:03] No other substantive comments here tab. Just confirm i've got the three points that we heard and i'll incorporate those and not on the substance of process to a weekend I don't know if you don't need to talk with I can make sure this gets sent over to graduate is by by Wednesday, but. I think if you forward it to meredith meredith can take it from there is that correct meredith. Yes, thumbs up from meredith and I would when you do so you're going to copy tab anyway. But, in light of our discussion earlier tonight about the clarity. And you know recording verbatim what tab approves. I would request that this be entered into the Minutes, whatever the final version is that have been been the Minutes for this meeting. terrific.

[152:00] wow Well done, thank you, I think that takes care of this item. Right Ryan you'll have time to to fix it up by tomorrow. yeah yeah. Thanks so much all right any open board comment, where they are already. Alex oh that's my hand in front of you. Does anyone have an item for open board comment. PT I had a couple things. No, no. You go first. Okay. Any data gets you Okay, so I have three things. These are mostly comments first one is, I just wanted to mark this is our first. Is our first meeting I first had meeting, since our Council, the Council has been sworn it, I think, for at least I think it's the first one so.

[153:06] And I am sure i'm not the only one that's been following meetings, and you know I for one have been just really kind of. Like i'm like i'm still trying to get my bearings with the new attention is Councils seems to add on subjects in rtmp be empty parking and. I watched a few times over again, so that I could write it down what counts them every eight said on Tuesday last week and i'm just going to read it here so case anybody missed it. And this, the discussion was on on on Vision Zero and he said in 2015 Council saying the transportation staff, why are you being so bold, here we are, here we are 2021 saying the transportation staff people. I think we've come a long, long way and you're getting six years, and obviously you're doing a lot of permission from Council to people. To tell so when you need to do to protect our community that starts at two hours and 15 minutes, the YouTube video and.

[154:07] raise the question Okay, what do you mean by old exactly, but I can guess at a lot of this, I think, and I think it's worth us giving us some thought in terms of in discussion in terms of. You know this is this is our executive body that that gives us tab direction and give staff direction and it is we are hearing them say. You need to raise raise the standards and this might require some clarification from from Council, but I just wanted to mark mark that I think this some we should we should be able to. Take this take this seriously and as we go forward, so I just wanted to say that that's my first Twitter comments, but i'm happy if there's any if that simulates anything from YouTube or others i'm happy to hear. me keep going here. Okay second thing i'm on a on a gluten your note and our last meeting I was just kind of.

[155:08] watching gene and Danny talk, I was just watching watching with my mouth open listening than describe what an abysmal state our training services and. we're still 60% of transit service, not even planning to go back to the fibers by 2025. And I couldn't I sort of like unless i'm missing something so I asked for them to talk to do a follow up call and gina Thank you. And they clarified yeah you got it right Ryan, they were really in crisis and I don't i'm not sure they use our crisis that's that's my read on it. And I just I just feel that this is this is something that deserves some real stone turning I know it's a common theme that we don't have enough funding various proposals, but I just. It just makes me think like are we are we active do we have enough active engagement with the governor's office with our work on federal advocacy.

[156:01] A to increase the size of the pie if it's not just it folders not unique um we have people who live in places that depend on a bus that has gone. On, and this is a wealthy city, you have, I think, MEDIA I just saw the median home prices are like. 1.2 million, or something and I just I just feel like there's a i'm just experiencing a lot of dissonance between. What seems to me, such a profound problem and just just kind of seems like well that's just sort of is what it is and maybe i'm you know just want to be optimistic and think there's. look for solutions, but I do believe we have at least some ability to engage with higher higher jurisdictions that have an interest in this with with other cities, too, so. Maybe it's just the for the suggestion box, but I wanted to raise that I think they'd be this doesn't get as much attention as it should, and our Council I don't know if our Council knows this. Our Council understand that we're 60% transit levels and not going to be even 85% by 25 or maybe something like that anything exactly right i'm big problem i'm.

[157:06] happy to take. questions on that, but want to make sure we all see that. I haven't been keeping track of who there's different hats and move around. In terms of city council members being responsible for different things, so the agenda stuff like that so i'm not sure who the Council representative, Dr cog is or the liaison with Dr cogs right now, do you know Erica. natalie. Well Erica could look it up. My whole sphere. Okay, we got the lawyer around the case. that's interesting um. Ryan you're so persuasive. I wonder if we should we should put you in touch with Nicole spear directly. When we hear my third one, but i'm.

[158:01] yeah i'm happy to reach out to Nicole if that's if that's the way. For for. For some of some of the city council members, especially new ones who know that they don't know everything they're often very grateful to have. You know, someone reach out and say I have thoughts and and information for you and, particularly, this is a that's a big role for a new City Council member. You know and you're you're the new kid on the block here, but you know a lot, so I would I would certainly support you reaching out to her directly. Okay, and gene and data feel free to correct anything I said here or in the future, but in any case, thank you for your help with orientation. Just before we carry on, I just wanted to correct one thing kayla. Dr sphere is a PhD solace. She is not a lawyer. Here right you're right. Even even better.

[159:01] even better. All right, should I continue to. Please do. Okay, the third one. Was Okay, so thank you for the shoutout allison Thank you allison I just want to do a quick report out to sorry feel this on behalf of our field trip to. The amps milliamps okay good. We did it the Teal and I attended the the amps curb access Alex curb curb. effort management. or management yeah last week, I just want to get some quick impressions, so a lot of there was a number of different stakeholders away it in. And I you know the early forming stage of it, but I heard a lot of input going into this kind of inputs sort of brainstorming exercise. That that highlighted climate and bmt um but but there's a lot of stuff going on there, so. I did not one thing that I was a little disappointed by is in the original presentation I didn't I didn't see the tmp goals I didn't see that.

[160:03] You know, among the things we're going to do you know we already have a TV with these you know via bmt goal Moshe goal climate, so I had a shopaholic called allison allison Thank you. I told her that feedback and she said well you know it is you know it's it's in there, and so, in case just want folks to know that we're in dialogue about that um and then the third thing is I, I do have a question about where this tab fit into the org chart. so to speak, and it does feel like we're a little peripheral to this that may just be the facts of life, but I want to have to be aware of at least my impression which was there's a. kind of a couple of organizing bodies that have that that some different boxes feed, up to and then we, along with a couple few other focus groups are kind of reporting into a columns and in. kind of a section allison or somebody could maybe maybe clarify, but this was prompted because we do you notice that mentioned to me that Community vitality, we.

[161:09] weren't there and I said, well, they were pretty instrumental are pretty important the previous. amps engagement seems like they should be here right and so that I think the answer that I heard was well you know there's there's a lot more going on here, and so my impression is we're will be heard, but it feels like we're kind of peripheral so just want folks to do that question. Okay. And I see allison is come back on camera maybe he wants to speak to this, but I just wanted to add one thing before she does assuming that's what you try to do allison um. yeah it's it to. ryan's point about tab being peripheral, I would just say we felt like tab was one of many stakeholders that were identified. And not only where they're not you know no reference to the tmp and here's where we want to go, it seems clear with this group, it was a Community outreach engagement.

[162:07] Exercise I just said, we don't know where we want to go we're going to have a vision, you know vision statement and objectives, you know setting thing, and it was it was just this engagement platform all over again it's just never clear to me. When and how city staff decides, you know this is now going to be a consult or collaborate level, this is public property that. The city manager's office and our various like rules, laws and regulations, regulate and if there are changes those regulations. I don't see why it's put to a Community visioning exercise on some of these things and I guess that that's another level of unclarity you know. Why is it that we went to this group of stakeholders to begin with, to say what do you all think in the broadest terms possible and not even begin to point them in a direction that says.

[163:02] You know, serve these bmt go serve these these tmp goals are these if there are you know business concerns and goals point to the guiding planning document so that and say you gotta. You know, have these guardrails here and, instead, it was just sort of a very open ended we're gonna have a big big conversation about it and i'm like why. Why are we subjecting this to another round of just open in the Community, discussion and engagement when we've done this previous times and previous plans and come up with. Some metrics and some things that we do want to achieve. I don't know if our semester. answer that night I can speak to that a little bit and a little bit when I shared with Ryan. And then we can yeah we can discuss further but um, it is the access allies, which is. What you and Ryan, are part of, and we appreciate your time and effort there, that is an advisory group for the curbside management policy and Program.

[164:05] And so we do have a number of advisory groups and focus groups as part of that. That initial meeting was to get everyone on the same page because there were a number of people who were not involved with previous amps work, so it was meant to be more of a broad. focus for that meeting, and we are working through the city's engagement framework for that, so I certainly understand what you're saying with. Especially as, as people have a lot of experience in the in the type of work that we do, and the projects that we've worked on that that can be. Can can feel repetitive, and the purpose of that meeting was so that we can all get on the same page, but I certainly hear you and and we can deepen and dig in deeper and provide more detail on that actual engagement and the purpose of that.

[165:00] Mark but. I just wanted to I guess commiserate with and say that in my time on tab to say that cab is on the periphery of parking issues is an understatement and and what you have pointed out Ryan and Tila is that when you take an issue that deals with critical transportation infrastructure. And our climate goals our climate crisis and give it to Community vitality. This is the reason you know when you do that, you have to expect the result that a kind of a merchant based downtown sort of group. And it's a city agency, but as sheila said, we are talking about public right of way, we are talking about city assets and when you give it to a Community vitality group.

[166:11] This is what this is what the result will be, and I think we should we are naive if we think anything different is going to happen until. The responsibility of managing parking is given to a different department so that's my. Thanks mark Alex you have your hand up. yeah I was, I was happy to pass off my responsibility with hampson XX allies, because I felt it was a very unproductive use of my time and that the. Consensus building that happened in the meetings was not reflected in what was pushed forward and that there were perhaps some. Things that we see other communities implement successfully that Community vitality had these it wasn't on the table from the get go and it didn't matter what I said it didn't matter what the consensus of the group was.

[167:04] We were a checkbox exercise and a process to a predetermined outcome, and so, like, I wish you guys luck and I hope you're up speak up sooner and more often. Thanks Alex. Okay. I think i'm still left with the question why, why are we working within this level of the city's Community engagement framework. I think that sorry I was just gonna. say I think yeah. I think that was the piece that allison was was saying that you know we could come back or or follow up with you. To talk about. Okay, great Thank you yeah talking about the answers that the only thing that I had for open board comment so thanks fran yes.

[168:03] Right yeah just just say one other word I Thank you everyone else, and thank you for your work on this, I hope this isn't let me to. On you have this is great, I mean overall has joined the dialogue and appreciate you making time and now they, thank you for your for that comment, I just wanted to offer one thing that I, you know feedback that i've heard it. And when I was on a different side of the table in a professional agent wants, and it was you know when when. hey Ryan and team, when you invite the public to come to give input we want to know what the decision making processes, like we want to know, we want to understand like is this just the like. Is this just you just listening to us you're going to do with what you want, or we is there is there, something that we can do to expect. that the key decisions that have been identified are going to go to a certain place and like where that's gonna play out and that's that's one of the things that leaves me just a little bit kind of.

[169:00] feeling, not that great which is like understanding it looks like it's pretty clear that there's going to be is there some they're going to be some trade offs to make in the process, with respect to. Climate and mode shifting versus a more merchant you know sort of oriented approach. And I you know I, the question is like where's that table where's that table going to be and the org chart doesn't reflect the tab is going to be, you know in at that table maybe we won't but i'd be just be good to know. um you know, like where that where that is so, I apologize that was done, that I just wanted to share. got I hear that and it sounds like it looks like Erica has something to say yeah. So I guess I. just want to say I see our job here, you know staff is kind of doing the knitting after hearing all the different views and perspectives and so forth, and trying to knit together things as a as a whole. Ultimately, the table that you're talking about is the table Council, and so we try to give them options and choices and they can choose where on a spectrum based off of different policy.

[170:09] impacts and implications. Okay i'm like I that's an interesting analogy, and I guess what i'm saying is, I feel like staff already has all the yarn. and your guys are going out and soliciting extra yarn meat from different kinds of animals, and no one has a real pattern, and we don't even know what schadler we're making a sweater or is it a hat, or is it baby duties or is it a Christmas stocking. make a sweater actually but. OK. We are especially with the access alleys and focus groups, we are looking to. consult and involve does members of the community so, so there is still pieces to develop. Right. Which. Which is part of our purpose.

[171:00] yeah and you know i've seen live in action on you know doing this with the pedestrian actually committee and and and she does it really well, I was just like oh no. i've been on this boat before do I have to do this for parking to I thought I thought we I thought we knew what we needed to know for parking and so i'm just yeah and it's not a critique of how you guys are doing it just to do we really have to do it this way. yeah well, I will say sorry just just on that note that it's not just about parking and we're trying to make that really clear through. Other yes. Thank you, I know I know say that because i'm because some people and and i'll even share that like people we interviewed like thought that it is just about parking and that's not what curbside is so. fair point airport. So, as I just wanted to know that that is not working. that's good. One more thing in response to what Erika said I think it's insightful that that if the table is with counsel and, in fact.

[172:02] That is what happened, I think the last time last go round, where I would you know, took it took a visit to counsel and the dialogue when something like. Staff saying well tab would like us to do more, and then the tab representative means that yeah that's right we'd like you to do more. But actually can you just do this anyway, and you can say fine we'll just do what you're saying so, so if the game is lobbying Council directly, you know I that clarity is actually quite helpful. to know that you know if we're going to do that same exercise again that Council, it would benefit from getting a briefing or you know some help from us, at a time so it's all happening within 90 seconds. I don't think that's like really the plan design, but if that really is it I i'd be happy to understand that and prepare help to progress Council because it is our job, in fact, to prepare counsel and advice so. So Eric has to respond. Romney I just every call it slightly differently that. Council took into, at least in my talking with Council members afterwards that they took into consideration a broad range of things and heard what tablet said.

[173:12] and gave some direction to staff to you, essentially follow up on some items, but felt that they needed to balance, a whole array of different Community priorities, and I think that's how I recall the conversation. Okay, I don't feel like be laboring this any further. I think we could probably go back and forth let's not. Does anyone else have any comments are open for comments this evening mark, yes, you had your hand up earlier. i'm okay i'm an ultra or really try to make these go quickly, I also have three items. So I just sent you all, an email, I hope you received it by now I didn't say I kept thinking Okay, this is almost over, but I don't want to send it and have it distract from ryan's discussion, but I want to talk about the fact that our agenda for this month.

[174:18] was presented with zero future agenda topics. and I would like to as a board. Where we control our agenda, to some degree. Add back in our agenda topics to our agenda future agenda topics, need to be an item on our agenda, and what I sent in the email, not only should they be part of our agenda. I just did a quick little Google sheet of the future agenda item tracker because if you if you if we've all agreed that we're going to do something in the future.

[175:01] One that's always subject to change, we can change our mind and say yeah we don't we don't want to do that, we could kick it off. But if we've agreed we're going to do something in the future, then let's establish who's responsible for that future item. who's working on it, how long I think it's informative to see how long it's been on the on the topic list, and if it's if it's on there forever we either need to kill it or do it one of the two so. I don't really care how this works, but I provided an example. There is a little bit of a question of would, if we decided to track agenda items and attach that either as a table within the agenda as a second page whatever it might be. Would that be maintained by the Chair and vice chair, as part of the Agenda committee to make sure that we don't violate the Colorado open the meetings that would it be maintained by staff but.

[176:13] Those are details, I want, I would like to have the board adopt that we want our future agenda items back on our agenda. Okay um, I would like to respond to that Am I needed no good. We at the last agenda setting meeting, well, I thought the last meeting we did kind of talk through. The items that were there, and so yeah this one's coming you know, in three months this one's on for whatever this one definitely we don't have an answer on here's a new one. And then, at the agenda setting meeting we agreed, those of us at that meeting agreed that it was just getting too cluttered to carry all of these things forward and that we would clear off the ones that we had.

[177:05] decided we're going to be taken care of at some point that we're you know floating somewhere on a future agenda. With the exception of the potential. crosswalk treatment matrix mark that you had proposed and that I was I said I will circle back to you and say, if you were ready at this next meeting or not so it's still you know floating there but you're right it's not on our agenda. And it hadn't in years past these these loose didn't get carried forward i'm very open to having a discussion again I think at our retreat probably. about how we're going to function as a board and what are the rules and what are the expectations, because this past couple months is the first time in my five years on the board i've ever seen anything like a keeping keeping track of. Some of these items, because sometimes they come up and it's not clear.

[178:04] When they'll be addressed, whether they'll be addressed, I think, for instance, the clay phone presentation on your proposed tracker and the email that you had just sent. we've got sort of folded into some larger discussion I think you've emailed after the last meeting and had some very good points about why that's not adequate, and not the same and it's a very useful conversation to have but in in substance that's why the stuff came off. off of this agenda i'm. Quite curious to hear what other tab Members feel about whether it should be carried on as a matter of. Just the public record going forward here's what our agenda is in our future agenda topics, because to put them as agenda topics as a future agenda topic item is to some extent put things on staff work plan that may or may not be there.

[179:05] Any response to any of that work. Well i'm curious what other board members. But yeah i'm happy to respond, but let's let's let someone else okay. Well, this is how much i'm. Agenda management to me, as always, pretty important because it essentially says what we're going to think about and what we're going to do and there's always more things and then, what we are going to meet on that are interesting and important. And I can certainly see the list always being longer than we actually execute. So I resonate a little bit with mark that you know, having a list somewhere of the stuff we've talked about that we haven't decided to use our you know very important allocated time on.

[180:00] make sense, but I actually liked the flexibility of saying well for a while we thought that that really should be on the agenda. But when we do our check ins to that agenda and maybe it's not all of us, maybe it's just the Chair or the chair and vice chair. that's not making the grade so. To me there's a little bit of a just watching that list element, but I don't feel that sense of responsibility that every time something comes sniffing around and comes close to the agenda, we absolutely have to do it. I think it's a good suggestion that the Chair. keep a keep a track keep track of this stuff and certainly one of my my critiques of previous years. Is that often things will you know don't make it on the agenda will get through them in the meeting there might be outstanding questions No one ever follows up there's a request for the records.

[181:02] it's not clear from the records of tab even before I was on tab whether those requests got followed through. But definitely there were there were things that you know just got kind of forgotten. Because they just sort of fell off the radar that's often with past agenda items and the required follow up more so than future agenda items, but I am definitely in favor of you know, writing stuff down. and keeping track of it and so. As I said, I feel like this is probably more of if we wanted to formalize something, then it would be part of this these rules and procedures and regulations that's. apparently going to be a large part of our retreat. This next year. But in the meantime, I appreciate the effort that you've gone through marketing yeah now's your time, I think, to to respond what I said oh brian's come off mute so. Stay around. Thanks to that just a question mark had a comment I think what I have a question is, I think I was hearing you suggest that, like the part of the implication is that we would.

[182:10] We would, and having this table we would make it we make decisions about taking things off of it so but, but so that's more than just having a kind of a rolling tracker that we that we have. I don't know that I feel that strongly the way I like the idea I guess step one of having something that I can remember, we can recall and I don't feel super strongly about the formality that mechanism, but so anyway, thank you for clarifying. I think this is a great great step forward, I will say the thing that the thing that the related thing that. rubs me the most is is thinking about some of the future topics that tab numbers have not add asked to add, but that I know are in the future that I would expect to want to prepare for some of the bigger planning exercises if there's a. Climate or tmp or when I don't want to see that two weeks to go, I want to be able to understand.

[183:05] You know months out ideally if there's going to be some subs substantive. Issues that I like to research that might be to telephone order that might just be like we don't have we can't do that, but I just wanted, you know, in case I resonate together so anyway, thank you mark for getting started. Sure okay um. Unless does anyone else, want to go, I want to respond to a couple things. i'm. In listening to my own thoughts in my head and and to hearing other other cabinet Members I think about three things. One I want, I want to be clear that, to put something on the list it's not just like Oh, I want to put it on the list i'm going to type it in. know this would this would go through something like what happened last meeting when I said gee I wanted to add this we discussed it, it was a close vote and and so eventually got added but it didn't get added just on a whim or because someone.

[184:14] Add access to the sheet and type it on so to get something on and needs to go through a process, the other goal here is accountability anytime if it's if it's really worth having on the agenda, then let's either let's uh let's let's have the accountable parties. act upon it with their presentation together, whatever and let's let's get it scheduled or and then the third thing is decisions, you know there's there's. I think it's a great thing to change our mind and say yeah that wasn't you know, six months have gone by and. You know scooters are off the street and hence we don't need to discuss scooter safety if that was one of our items.

[185:07] God want to take it off this gives us a mechanism and away incentive if our list keeps getting longer and we get up to 10 or 12 items on future agenda topics, then. I would advocate yeah let's What do we want to cut because life is short and time is limited, so I am not about having this list get long i'm actually about. Doing those things, cutting those things. Okay. So how about this, I know, we need to resolve things and move on. i'm happy with based on last month minutes or last month's agenda anyway to. maintain this until we.

[186:04] Until we go to our retreat and we can formalize it then, if we want, and unless people want to formalize it now. But if we want to delay that formalization for a future agenda topic. You i'm willing to maintain it temporarily if everybody says yeah I think that's a good idea, then great then it's not it's not really shouldn't be a big deal. To have. have our future agenda topics tracked. Okay. So I just want to reiterate the way that we did it last month was just sort of provisionally trying out, you know something in those draft policies and procedures like Oh, this was you know, a mechanism that got proposed. So, when you say i'm happy to maintain this you mean the list that you have email.

[187:02] yeah that was not a complete list I actually. yeah yeah. Okay i'll take you up on that offer. Okay, do we have agreement that. We will formalize this at a future date, probably the retreat, but in the meantime. i'll maintain it. That is my understanding is that square with everyone else on time. Ryan nodding Alex nodding catchphrases hands all right, thank you mark. Okay. So, speaking of future agenda items I have one, and that is that the one I committed to which is tackling a presentation at the mercy of an SMP like process for pedestrian crossings, and so I have to request.

[188:01] And i'm very cognizant of both in the proposed. Rules of Procedure and, in general, good good governance that it's it's not cool to ask staff to spend a lot of time on board request. So, but for me to put together a presentation with really any sort of data, what i'm requesting is if. Ryan, or any other staff members have produced presentations in the past or giving presentations to other. Transportation agencies communities, about the SMP success because I again I think that's a real success and I think we've gone out and presented it to other communities as success.

[189:00] Is i'd like to get copies of those presentations i'm not asking for collection of data, but if we have data collected and as soon as some sort of format gee i'd like to see it and i'd be happy to sort through it and to minimize anyone staff time, but I would request that. If there's things that would help my case and i'd like to be the judge of that that I would like to get a bunch of an SMP stuff that's already prepared and have it sent to me please. Eric i'ma let you handle that one. So a qualified, yes, and the qualification is that, basically, from now until just a little while before the Council retreat it's all hands on deck at this moment for trying to get information to counsel and so that is my reality. So we'll go back and see you know if it's if it's easy to do you know after that it just sort of pull stuff or whatever certainly we'd be happy to share it with you.

[190:11] But that's that's all I asked, thank you very much that's a great answer and again fully cognizant of you know, I think the in. The entire city is producing their letter action item requests etc to counsel right now, before the retreat so anyway that's great that the second one on the same topic is. Is Erica and again, you may do this after your retreat preparation in our last meeting you had stated that there that you all do have a rigorous process for. pedestrian crossing treatments or treatment of public request from citizens, so if you have such a thing I would love to get a copy.

[191:05] of that process. of how you currently deal with crossing request or other other public process requests. and staff and see what we have. Okay, thank you okay that was it from my second one, and the third one, is, I think this is primarily for Erica and natalie or or anyone else on staff. I have perceived and I don't have any data or anything else to back this up. But a reduction in this may be due to staffing or whatever of responses to Community Members and to tap numbers when we write to staff. So I would like to know, and this is actually kind of a confusing thing for me, what is our policy for responding to tab communications and and public request.

[192:12] might be for more information or gee i've got this my perception is my street is a terrible condition, whatever it might be but i've seen a bunch of you know emails from the public go by, I am also I send my own emails into staff and. haven't received much of a reply, and nor have I seen much reply to other cities, and so do we have a policy and, if so, what is it or is it kind of an ad hoc thing in the moment. I would say it's something that's evolving because there's a lot of commentary that comes in, that is along the lines of I don't like this, or I want you to do this and.

[193:05] that's that's a comment that's a piece of input, but it doesn't necessarily need to be responded to if there's a factual question. We try to be able to respond to that and sometimes it's taking us a little bit longer to do so, and if things have gotten you know caught in the cracks I would invite you to resend your email, you know directly to me and then. i'll follow up with them. Okay, thank you and I will say that, in particular the the item that. is of great interest to me is I had suggested three action items in regard to the 15th street a pedestrian crossing, which was.

[194:04] The way we phrase, the task to our consultant, a meeting at the publicly noticed meeting at the site I think that's important in that particular case and. And then, a request for a tab review. Once the consultant has come back with their. Product so. I don't expect the answers to those tonight, but but Those were my my. My letter was I hope not perceived as just a complaint, but it was actual. process request regarding that particular project.

[195:04] So we also talked about your letter. briefly at the agenda setting meeting. um. You know the SNP has this like process and here's how many touch points tab has. This kind of project doesn't have that set of guidelines. But it is for you know, for better or worse, not subject to the public engagement network, the talking about curbside management is it's it's really unclear to me what level of public engagement and back and forth. is required a different project That being said, staff has limited time and effort they don't have to consult us at all on these projects.

[196:01] for whatever reason, they did consult not just us but Community cycles they consulted us a couple of times and and as an advisory board. We don't really have the authority and power to say you staff audit direct your consultants to do this, you need to conduct is another you know another round of public outreach that's not our job. I feel that we've had our chance, I feel that staff has listened to us, they did adjust the design. But we're advisory this is their job and their. purview, and this is the amount of effort that they decided that they're going to do, and that this project deserves I think it's not perfect, I think. And you know we've said this at the last meeting i'm not thrilled it's better than it was but staff gets to decide.

[197:04] that's all that's all they're going to do, and I think the staff has decided they've they've listened to us thanks for our advice they're going to move on and we can keep pestering them and, hopefully, will do better in the future. Well, thank you for a direct and clear. response and. That that you know, again I am all about clear and direct communication and decisiveness and so, if, in fact, thank you for you know, speaking for SAP and, yes, I acknowledge all of those things and I have repeatedly acknowledged the PR Advisory Board. However, at times, I have regretted. Not being clear enough or strong enough in my positions and I decided that, with this project.

[198:06] I don't want to have that regret that that my input was inadequate or unclear and so again seth is free at every turn to say go pound sand, thank you very much for your input. And so, but, but I was actually looking for was exactly what you told me, and that is yeah Thank you know, and you know your three request items one, two and three are answered with no no and no so that now, I know what the answers are so thank you. So that concludes my portion.

[199:04] Thank you. anyone else. Alex. i've gotten some questions and inquiries about the protects lanes on full sun which are, of course, a project I support. However, I am. capable of answering some Community questions as to why certain things were done, they were they were, and I feel that about. I don't know 16 months between tab providing some very informal conceptual feedback and a final design being implemented. And it it that's one where it seemed like we were sort of excluded from the design process we get three opportunities to weigh on a single speed bump, but when we overhaul a. Half mile an arterial we get we get one touch 16 months in advance and so i'm out there, supporting the project but.

[200:04] I don't know why that curve, is that way I don't know why there's a gap here, but not a gap there. And, and we weren't able to I think is a disservice to the project because we weren't able to either here staff rationalization or turn to Community members to help us get an understanding of the design and that input ultimately influence the final design. Now go ahead. Well, I think Alex you're making a kind of a procedural point but there's also a substantive one which is yeah we there was at least one person who said. that's right way to put it, but hey this dangerous and I just I don't know like I mean i've written it a little bit I don't have it so i'm just started curious on like yeah this. One is it to what is there to the feedback that things just the low kind of curve sort of style but anyway i'm just curious I don't know.

[201:08] Erica. So I was gonna ask natalie to speak to this a little bit, but basically you know we've actually done a lot of design a lot of outreach a lot of engagement with Community cycles and have listened to. The cycling Community extensively and really tried to lean in to do the right thing and then we have a different group of cyclists that have different opinions around stuff. And so we're trying to work through we're not entirely done yet and so we're trying to work through things to be able to you know. To Polish it off, etc, and I think that if you have specific questions about why something is the way it is we'd be really I mean we'd be very happy to explain that you know if you have a specific question about it, I mean we certainly have gotten the same comments that you've seen about.

[202:14] A bicyclist or a cyclist or you know, an individual saying I don't believe X is safe but. On the same token we've gotten input from the whole cohort of others, so this is what we need to feel and be safe, so. we're trying to figure out how to navigate that. Can I just say thanks Erica just real quick, just so you know I don't know if people notice this but Susan I don't necessarily think she. She feedback. And then she joined to try to join the meeting I think she got the public on it wrong so in case she's still paying attention just so that's known that she she actually tried to be here. yeah and she sent an email December eight. So.

[203:04] yeah I mean I don't know if there's anything to add to what Erika said, I think we have been in we were engaging with Community cycles, as we were finalizing the design for folsom and what the curve was going to look like and where the gaps are going to be. And, and I think we had gotten to a pretty good place with committee cycles, as far as. You know what they expected to see along the corridor. And as Erica said, you know we're still making refinements we still have the dells to install that will be installed later this week to help with visibility concerns of the curb, especially when the snow starts hauling so. You know we're definitely open to continuing to hear feedback and and definitely reach out to us with questions, because we can probably help answer some of those questions. But yeah that's what we've got at this point. Okay, with within SMP we have a proposed project, and then we hear from a variety of opinions, those who.

[204:05] Think it's a fantastic thing those two things it's a waste of money and then a Council appointed board of people who have been briefed on. This topic and many related ones are unable to provide a formal recommendation then staff and counsel can rely upon and with with fulsome we seem to have. sort of deliberately gone a different route excluding from that process. And and not making that information available to us, or or asking for a formal recommendation, where we can hear from me vehicular cyclists who might tell you why carbs are bad, and you might hear from a a. Interested but concern cyclist who will tell you how they're not going to ride on fulsome without them, and what are we here, for, if not for helping wade through the.

[205:05] available information and public input and helping city staff and Council land on resolutions. So I guess the only point I would make is the NS MP is you know, in the tabs charter. As far as your role with the SMP. And and and and I think you know we're happy to explore how we engage with tab on these types of treatments going forward, you know. As, as you all know, we're we're kind of building. How we're implementing Vision Zero projects as part of our pmt the pavement management program, and so I think we're open to feedback about how we engage in that process, and you know honestly I can't remember the details of when we were last at tab with that concept.

[206:02] But as Erica Erica mentioned, you know we were we did do extensive outreach with Community cycles. and Like I know i'm being asked by Community Members who I don't know questions I can't answer. And it's way more central to what we do, then a detour on baseline. Like there there's so many things that we spend time on. The that seems to be similar or less central to what we're asked to inform you and city council on, then something as significant as changing the working feel and function of an arterial street. Would it help if we put together just a little on fact sheet for you, so you could answer the questions that you have i've heard i've heard your concern about providing input.

[207:08] As part of our broader discussion on how to get all these different projects getting alignment and the transportation master plan and so forth. I committed to progress not perfection. still working on that, but i've heard what you've said, and for the immediate concern about being able to answer questions we'd be happy to put together a little you know faq sheet or something if you think that would help. I think that wouldn't help the general public, I think, instead of coming to us having to SF and you know going through yes to anticipate these kinds of. what's going on, why is this here, why is this changing that's that's definitely something that should be very public facing and easy to find an easier to find them the email address of a tab Member.

[208:07] It all still comes back to I think a question that keeps recurring this evening when when when do you engage who you engage why, how do we determine. Who, we talked to when do we talk to you how how much input and how much how much hand holding versus you know just inviting comments and writing it down and proceeding apace, do we do. it's super not clear, and I appreciate natalie calling out the you know that the SNP is in our Charter um. it's actually like traffic management, or whatever you know the previous name of the innocent, it was but also there's a catch all section that says any and all transportation issues so. um the Charter is not much help here, except to say something like the SNP is explicitly described, but all other transportation things I either way that Alex. I think well summed up the changes that went on a major bicycling corridor in the Center of the city to have been fairly central to what we do.

[209:09] it's it's not a concern, we need to, we will be able to sort through tonight. But yeah this the public engagement framework that necessity is anticipating it's not it off there when and how we apply it, and it doesn't seem to be serving. us well, at least in this context. And it's interesting because you know i've been having a lot of conversations with our Community engagement folks about how to help. create a clear and more focus, but also expedited process and because, in order to realize many of the expectations that Niall you have you know to with the bmt you know strategy, etc, but also the.

[210:01] expectations, the Community has it eventually you know it's like you have to have a pathway that's clear and consistent for all the different things that we touch and engage in and at some point something needs to get done. Right. it's these to be made, because otherwise it's just circling and circling and circling and. So I think you know together, not just tap at the Community, and then we will be able to come up with that sweet spot we're just not there yeah. yeah. Okay. We have to start planning to plan start doing to do and be able to explain why we're doing what we're doing. Can I quote you. Please. it's being recorded as I understand.

[211:00] It will be in the minute. Mark yes. want to weigh in on this topic for just a second and I, and I concur with everything Alex has said and I just occurred to me to harken back to 20 is. When we decided to do 20 is plenty after lots of tab request for 20 is plenty in a few places suddenly we have plenty across the city. But it was it was it was presented as a very big thing and we you know bill brought the big orange new 20th plenty sign to tab and we kind of you know, we celebrated and it was a. You know, it was significant and tab was now included was brought along and it was a big moment because that's a big deal so is the first permanent physical.

[212:07] Physical physical vertical barrier for a bike lane on an arterial in boulder that's that's big stuff, and so I would urge staff to you know, rather than. Think wow we don't have time to take the tab, how can that help us with this and and how can we engage with them into help. So that tab can help bring the Community along, because we are Community members that are well connected, you know transportation apartments far as I know, doesn't have a Twitter account well, some of us do, and there are things that that we can do to help and. You know I think back to the 28th street.

[213:00] mash up that we had and had staff. Actually sold us. On and saw our input and sold us on some of the changes to 28 street We may not have had the kind of thing that I think staff doesn't like like us making a recommendation to counsel. That runs counter to staffs agenda, so I think there are examples of a couple of opportunities that. You can you can bring us along and we can be part of the team, or you can surprise us and we can. Look, and say gee Community cycles got this briefing we didn't And why is that so. that's that's my goal.

[214:05] Here was hoping to like end on a little rosier note than that. And I would also just like to assume that we're all working toward the same thing I. think we have fundamental disagreements about the best ways to communicate what the best thing is and. The best well, the more preferred option on design at times it's certainly something we. We differ on, but there are with rare exception. In general, the changes that we see on city streets that we're all working toward our improvements on the status quo. And that's, all I can ask for us to do better, every day, better every year for our Community. We can end on progresses good.

[215:01] Thank you. Can we end do I have a motion to adjourn. A future agenda topics are we exhausted down. At the moment, one moment. I moved to a drug. All right, all in favor. Thank you guys, this has been edifying. We will be in touch and we will see you in the New Year.