December 13, 2023 — Police Oversight Panel Regular Meeting

Transcript

Captions from City of Boulder YouTube recording.

[1:39] Hey? I think we have coral perfect welcome, everyone. It is December, December the thirteenth. That's crazy. and it is our December monthly meeting.

[2:01] the recording is started perfect. So first, I'd like to start with our land acknowledgement. We acknowledge the Arapaho youth and Cheyenne tribes the traditional custodians of the land on which the police oversight panel and boulder police department operate and pay our respects to their their elders, past and present. We'd like to just welcome the public and any members of the press that are with us this evening. And of course all the panel members that are here. Thank you. Everyone for being here. If there are members of the public that have questions we ask that you use the QA. During the meeting for those questions. And we will answer small queries in the Q. A's. But save bigger queries on the panel business or policy for public comment, please. And just to confirm Selena is going to be that who we have answering the Q. A's. Or okay, perfect. Thank you, Selina.

[3:04] Alright and if you do have any complaints regarding boulder any interaction you need had with Boulder police department. You can submit a complaint through our website, which is Boulder, Colorado, Gov slash services, slash police. dash oversight. or via our email, which is police oversight panel at Boulder, Coloradocom. Gov. and then, of course, if you do miss some or all any meetings. Those are all posted to our website as well. All right. So our agenda today is we will have approval of our November Minutes Committee updates discussion about trainings discussion about the nickel conference that happened last month. this was a request from a panelist to discuss an Naacp letter. We'll discuss the meeting with the Chief and the Ipm report. Sorry. We'll give her report and we will select

[4:08] we'll also discuss the panel recruitment. and in-person meetings. It's not on the agenda sherry. We do have cases to vote on today. Correct the one to email this. Nope, okay, so we don't have any cases to vote on so we're gonna skip that agenda item. And then we'll also discuss the Neuropa community counseling Mou, and then we have time for public comment. I expect there will be a lot of cases to vote on next month next month. Got it? Got it? Okay? Oh, that's okay. Alright. So first, just our first item is approval of our November meeting minutes do we have a motion for approval? Perfect? I see you, Chico, and A. B. Thank you.

[5:02] We'll take a first and a second, all right, and so we will now vote for approval of our November meeting minutes show of hands, or say, Aye, whichever way you'd prefer. Awesome. perfect. And that is quorum. Thank you. Everyone. all right. So now it's time for our committee updates who would like to start community engagement legacy. Chico, do you have anything for us today. Yes, we had our meeting on the eleventh of last month, thirtieth last month. I'm forgetting dates now. So essentially, we're just picking up on where we left off. It's been a while, and we will continue with what we had started, and I think the what was agreed on his wig continue engaging the BPD,

[6:11] with what the initial topic that we want to look at is their interaction with youth. and will be guided by the data that we get in terms of how far back can we investigate, and what kind of investigations we'll go on with all reviews that we can look at, and in what format will present the reports. So it's something that we are will be pursuing in the coming year. This being holidays so coming year. It's next month, so that's what we'll be doing. The next meeting will be January to the 20 fifth. So II presume that we may

[7:03] report, or we may look at some more things at that meeting. with a view of reporting more in the February meeting. That's all. Chika. Were you able to locate that data set. or should I reach out to Bpd. I think you should reach out. II wasn't able to find anything. Okay, thank you. I'll do that wonderful and for governance. We did. We did not have a meeting this last month. But we anticipate to have one. Thank you alright, and let's talk sorry. Was there a meeting with the Communications Committee this month?

[8:01] I don't think anybody showed up for that one only city staff showed up. Is that something we need to discuss for the the next meeting, or I know we were talking about. you know, trying to have 2 co-chairs for that committee, and I know Milan. You had volunteered. Yeah, and II miss it. I did volunteer. And I missed that meeting for different reasons. And I I didn't hear from anyone. I also, if II imagine that nobody else showed up. should we still recruit Co. Chair for that committee? I think so. I think it would be good. It would be good if at this point it feels like I'm the only one on the committee, so that would be very useful to have some other people and

[9:03] I'm sorry I was planning to attend, but I thought that we had cancelled. We got a bunch of notes that events were cancelled, and maybe II was mistaken, but I assumed that that was cancelled. So that's why I didn't show up, but so maybe that did. We reschedule a couple of things since various like updates in the calendar came in. I just know it was moved once. But I also know that that committee will be involved in the rep, the website redesign, and that will be the biggest project for 2024 for that committee of these early on. So whatever's in the past is in the past. But you know, moving forward. we're going to need a team effort on the website redesign. And so that committee is is going to be leading for spearheading that from what I understand.

[10:02] Ii do. Wanna say, I just talked with communication staff for the city. And because of this accessibility issue that we've talked about that's mandated by state law in effective in July. I think it's anticipated that a lot of websites get get revamped and re-looked at to make sure that they are in compliance with that accessibility requirement. so I I think that particular project might have a little bit of a pause on it, as the city obtains guidance from the state, and figures out exactly what their whole plan is for for websites and communication. because of that accessibility piece. Sounds like that gives us time to figure it out is a refrain. Yes, but I mean, I do think that working on figuring out what the communication engagement plan is for 2024 outside of the website is is a really important component for this panel.

[11:23] I'll definitely try to make that next meeting. Milan to be there to support you. Great. Thank you. AB: When is the next meeting, Melanie? AB: Is it Malen AB: Milan? It's on Thursdays, I think. Can you hear me?

[12:05] Yeah, we can hear you. I think that they also did just send out an agenda. Right? We just had an agenda for 2024. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Sorry guys, I just sent that out. I think yesterday, I think the next one that's coming up for 2024 based on what we had previously is January fourth. from 6, 30 to 7 30. Thank you so much, Selina. And I'd like to just stress with any of these subcommittee meetings. You know, if the if the days don't work for people, especially as we're rounding, and on the holidays, you know, feel free to, you know. Start the conversation of whether there's a different day that we should try to have it.

[13:02] Yeah, that's a great point. A lot of these meeting times. We're set with people who are no longer here. So if 2024 is a good time to redo the schedule and make it so, it aligns with everyone's needs and meets. That's that makes sense. Yeah. And II just wanna invite new panelists to maybe come to the next meeting and see if that's something that they would like to participate in we can define what we're doing and how we're doing it. So that might be a good, a good time for everyone to rethink what what committees they're in. Yes, wonderful. All right. Any other items on committees or committee updates. Wonderful thanks. Everyone trainings

[14:05] think so. Yeah, so I wanted to just let people know that any input on trainings that you want to see, we should start figuring out what the trainings are going to be for 2024, and I also wanted to let everyone know that we are planning to have an all day training for the new panel members. on March second, of 2024. So once we get that training schedule all set. Ii anticipate, or I expect to send it to current panelists for anyone who wants to attend either. For like a duplicative training that you may have had, but you may have not been able to use it because of the moratorium, and just a time gap,

[15:01] refresher, or something that you feel you maybe haven't had before. But that's the that's expected. That March second is going to be a all day training for the new panel members. But I'm going to invite any of you to attend. If you feel like it would be helpful for you to attend one or more sessions that day isn't the requirement that every all panelists get trained every year. Thanks. We have been talking about this for new panelists. I believe it should be all panelists. That's what I thought as well. Some some trainings that everybody needs to do every year, so that would be a good opportunity for us to get together. So I guess March second, I will absolutely be sending it out to everyone. And I think then, Selena, we might need to make sure that we have a larger room than what we've previously looked at.

[16:05] I guess it. I'm sure there's a list of trainings that go out for like the calendar year. That will be send out when you send that out, or will it go out for like 6 months? I need. So when when I was initially thinking about training, my thoughts were that we would have some money like shorter trainings, but more frequently like, I thought maybe like 2 h like one Saturday a month, until we were caught up on all of the all of the trainings. And then this is an aspect that Farrah has been brought into, and you know it was her idea to have this all day training, for you know, new panelists. Her thought was that the new panelists would be able to start in or be selected and slated February, and we have this training on March second, and then by the time the next panel meeting happens, they have met their the like classroom training requirements.

[17:12] So initially. My, when I was thinking about it, II was thinking about this being you know, training that we would have on a staggered basis. But this is going to be a really big chunk all at once. And we have not put together that that training yet. So any ongoing training would be more along the lines of you know what panel members want and needs that we identify as opposed to those mandated trainings is use of force included on that March second training I have, I mean, I have not worked on that as of yet. I'm actually meeting with Fara tomorrow morning. But I cannot imagine that it would not be in. Okay, I would just say. in my experience

[18:02] there are certain trainings that need to be provided like by the police department. By, you know, other folks and use of force was. I think it was a full day. or maybe a half day, but it was in person at the at their office out there on Fifty-fifth. And so we make decisions about. you know, some of these cases, and we don't know the 5 scales of use of force. I would just really advocate, for it was a powerful training, and it really relates to some of the stuff that we do. and you think it was that long? I know we got there like 90'clock, and we left at like 2, and people were tired and crying everything else, and it was intense, but it was. It was much needed for the stuff that we do so much more than just a primer. Yeah, we saw takedowns. We got to see the little video game machine they used. And again, the 5 scales of, When do we pull up. We go from green to yellow to orange. And

[19:04] yeah. but you think 9 to 9 to 2 was the amount of time approximately, that sounds about right? Yeah, at least at least to noon, if not to do. Yeah. Okay. well, there is no way that that amount of training on use of force would be done in a day where there are so many other requirement required trainings that would happen. But it sounds like that was a very impactful training for you, Victor Michiko. You were there as well. Right? II wasn't. But II attended one with Joey. It was about the same couple of hours

[20:02] that so quite impactful, I must say. with what we do, we? One just has to go through it. Well. I will then work with Vpd. To try to get that on the schedule. Then. as soon as possible. I mean as soon as possible for the new panelists and the schedule that we that we have? Okay? Thank you. Any other questions or comments on trainees. So so when are we gonna see the schedule for for the training for the year. Like, I said, we need to figure out first of all what you know. What are the the trainings that we do on that march second and then figure out what other?

[21:02] What you know, what other trainings we need to do to you know, fill in the blanks. But ideally, we would get that figured out sooner rather than later. Cherry, for the right along. Do we need to contact you, or how do we go about that, or is, should we contact Sterling actually sterling? Maybe. I was I was. I went through Bethany, and she said that she's the person to go through at the police department. We can make sure that you have for her email. It's been sent out, but she's the the admin to the Chief. and if anybody doesn't feel comfortable, going with a random person feel free to reach out to me, and I can try to do what I can do in a uniform and go drive around.

[22:06] Thank you. And just also bethany had told me that if you know people have other questions or concerns that she's also available to try to answer questions about the police department. Oh, thank you. And I think do you think you could add, I know you sent us the information for Bethany, but maybe we can add that somewhere to our sharepoint, so people can access it. Thank you so much. Sherri. Awesome. Okay. So there are no more questions on trainings. We can move on to the Nicole Conference. And so, my God! Who? She and participants?

[23:01] Yes, she's in participants, so somebody could add her back as a panelist, please. and me. Len, right. Those were the 2 that went to our conference this year along with sherry. So if anybody has any takeaways or things they'd like to talk about in terms of like big learnings or things that they think are key to share with the panel. This is the time to share. Yeah, I don't know if you can hear me. My my connection again is very unstable, so I apologize. That's why I'm off camera. But I'll just say I would have to it. It was really an eye opening moment for me to be there. It was really great there. There was so many people talking about.

[24:00] You know, it was a lot of representative from larger cities, and we were in Chicago. So Chicago was very well represented, and everybody was telling us how lucky we are to to have sherry as our monitor and So that was but it really expanded my my imagination as to what we can do here in boulder it opened me up to possibilities that I had not thought about or, you know didn't know existed. I was really really interesting, would have to review my notes, and maybe you know, we can write a summary of of what we learned. but I think that if you have the opportunity to go next year, I would really recommend that you do

[25:05] because just even just chatting with people in the morning, while we were having coffee and other cities and and other issues that they have is is really interesting. And and it was pretty impactful for me to be there all day for several days, and really thinking about our work as a as as a panel, and possibilities. So I don't know, so that you have additional things to say. I'm sure you I'm sure you do. Yeah, so it it was. For me invaluable learning opportunity like, really it was eye opening. It was very moving also to be in the same room with people that have been doing the work for so long, and together with survivors and families of victims, and

[26:09] getting to hear directly all the perspectives and experiences it was. It was truly moving. And I think that we we talk a lot what we were together with Milan the whole time. But I would talk a lot about like how personally for me, energizing this was because it was really putting things in perspective and understanding that while we all share, like a common grounds or goals, also, our realities as a small city are a little bit different. So so at at certain points everything seems so big for us and what we deal with. but at the same time. being a small community. The impact of the things that are happening are are different also. So definitely, I think there were points that I would love to learn more about was split in a few. There were presentations from like taste companies.

[27:11] That was I didn't go to that one. Milan attended that one and you again, you you see things from different perspectives. And so so it it gives you a different understanding of of of the they issue on the community around civilian oversight, so super grateful for for the opportunity of going to. So I encourage anyone that wants to go next year to really do so. if if I may. This was the first time that I went to Nicole in a role outside of solely working in investigations. So it was really interesting to come with a different perspective. But some of my takeaways were the

[28:04] enforcement about the idea of how important transparency is, and along with that, the community engagement for both. You know the Monitor's position. And for you know the the panel. I also attended a session on data and benchmarking that I found really interesting in terms of trying to set goals and make sure that your the goals are trackable. it's too bad. We don't have a dandy scientist on staff as some organizations do and also I took away the importance of ensuring that the work that we do as much as possible can be published so for the, for the public to access and then also attended it. This this was woven throughout the conference. But there was 1 one session, I think maybe on.

[29:04] and I can't remember if it was the last day or one of the last days. but really drove home the point. How important it is to ensure that the the oversight does remain in a collaborative mindset mindset with the police department, and there were several people who spoke on. You know, the the most successful oversight programs are those where it is not overly adversarial with the the police department that they're overseeing And in that vein I had some conversations with some other oversight professionals where they shared some horror stories basically where their chief of police basically completely disregards any recommendations that they that they give? So I II felt like we are ahead of the curve on on some of those issues.

[30:01] at least now we are. And so those were some of the the takeaways that I had from from the conference. Additionally, just talking about Nicole. we, in the ordinance, adopted the code of code of ethics, and Boulder is now on the Napole website under as as having adopted the code of ethics. I there's a downloadable version that I put in the their, the sharepoint drive today. But it's from 2,015. So Boulder is not actually identified. On that, even though we are on their website. But I encourage people to take a look at it and and read it. There's a lot of thoughtfulness in the the nickel code of ethics, and those are what we are bound by according to the ordinance that was passed in October. It's in the Nicole folder in the sharepoint.

[31:00] It's in the in the meetings the general meetings for this for the December meeting folder. I'm I'm sorry, but I would just like to add that I discovered that there there is a certification that you can receive from Nicole. You can go to the website, and there are some required readings that are pretty interesting, not super. Well, some are, then, some are not that bad? It takes, like probably a year to 2 years to finally get certified. But I think I found super interesting the readings and the material material that are proposed to be revised. So if you want to take a look at that in their website, there is a link to the certification, I can look it up. I don't know. I can put in the title. I can send an email with the link but at least like reviewing those materials is is very enlightening. So if you want to find quote, like good information on different topics. that suggested reading list is very useful. So I'm gonna look it up and and send it in an email.

[32:16] Perfect. Thank you. Solar, that it won't let me create a folder. So I'm not sure if it's because I don't have ownership for sharepoint. But if we can just get a folder created in the nickel conference materials folder for 2023, then that way, so that I can add what she has. We can add that off some resource you have, and then any other notes that from either mainline or solid. Thank you. Alright. perfect. Okay. Any other questions. Does anybody have any questions for either anybody? Or I just say, I'm interested to to see those notes.

[33:01] I found this in other agencies where someone goes off to a conference. They get the specialized knowledge and they come back to the team, and then they just say the food was great, or you know, XYZ. So how can you share that knowledge that you got with the team is, you know, is what I'm curious, for. I have a hundred of pages of notes that I can make sure you see but maybe that will be away. And also maybe in one of the trainings that we have, because it's very specific thing. So whatever you think is best for the group. But we do have a bunch of notes, and and I can definitely share those from 2, 3, 7, yeah, same same for me. I don't know if I have a hundred pages, but I have quite a few awesome. I definitely noticed both of you taking notes

[34:02] in the sessions we were in together. Alright. If there's no other comments or questions we can move on to the next agenda. Item. Thank you. Solid up. Okay. Me, Len, do you? This is your request. Would you like to lead it up? Is that the n double acp If you're talking we can't hear you. So I'm sorry.

[35:08] Okay, can you hear me now? Yes, okay. My connection is very unstable. So I apologize. I might take this on the phone if we're continue to have problems. But yeah, thank you. Hades. I wanted to for us to discuss the the statement is still on the Boulder police suicide panel website about it's a statement with respect to the Boulder County and Doubleac's request to review previously closed cases dated from October 2220 21. I think this was a little bit of There was a lot of

[36:14] removed that we don't need to have this any longer on the website. and I just wanted to open the conversation about that. Why should we keep it, or can we remove it? It is It was a request from the Nwaac PP at the time to review past cases. And so, yeah, I just wanted for us to discuss how long we keep this type of letters from the panel on the website. the strongest supporters for this panel. They were very much involved in us creating this panel. They are representing one of the historically excluded a community in boulder, and I just would like to

[37:17] mend what needs mending with them. and I'll stop here if anybody has any additional comment. Maybe, Madeline, some of what you said I've got cut out so I don't. Yeah. So if you could kind of repeat or just do it just overview of of what you how you see, you know the perspective. So we can get the full understanding of what it is we we need to be discussing and considering. I'm sorry. so, Madeleine, if if I get

[38:00] if I get cut off again I'll I'll leave the this and and join with on my phone. Okay. we got some of it. We just didn't get. I think the real bulk of what we needed to hear. It's what it got cut out. And so a a yeah, if you could. Just sorry. But if we set up our videos, it will improve her bandwidth while she's speaking. So well, I think it's me. Hmm. and okay, go for it now. And was this. this has been in issue. I'm off. Camera. Oh, Madeleine, this has been an issue you're cutting off again, Milan.

[39:02] so we cannot hear you right now. Would it be right if she tucked it in the chat, and one of us could read it off? I think she disconnected, and she might get that soon. Maybe we can turn up our cameras on we need to keep an eye on her so she can join as a panelist, I think. while we're waiting, is anyone who's kind of familiar with the background and history here able to give like a factual background. So we know the issue that we're discussing. Maybe while we're waiting for Milan. maybe we don't have anyone that was around. If you read the letter, it's pretty. I reread it earlier today, and it hits all the points left, right, upper cut. It's a real play by play in there of

[40:04] why, we felt we were called out the legal implications of the limits of what we could do, and the idea that we were citizen volunteers being pulled in one direction, it was really a way for us to establish our independence as we were trying to establish ourselves as well. Oh, sorry! Sorry! What was the original? Call out? What was II can see some details in here. There's reference to it, but, like what happened to make this statement necessary. there was a complaint, and it wasn't submitted in the complaint process they decided to meet on the side city of Boulder police and N. Double Acp. Had a side meeting. Didn't file a complaint didn't tell us about it. And then, 10 min before our meeting. this issue was brought up.

[41:01] and so it didn't go through the official process. We weren't able to view it in an official way. And that's just kind of where it started. There. and so again, there's limits to what we can do officially. And that fell out of that. And it was compounded by the way that they didn't follow the protocol hadassah's at how it's the genesis? Yes, definitely, yeah. And we were, ultimately, getting pressure to do something that is not within our purview, that is not within our abilities to do. And That was that, was the response. It was a unanimous vote by the panelists at that time. And that's where we are, and I think. One thing that is important to remember is transparency and removing statements, especially when there are articles that are written about, or you know, in reference to I think that that's really key to maintain.

[42:07] you know, in in terms of what was what was alluded to, what was being discussed, and ultimately what was what was decided in the feelings of the panel at the time. Here, here's what II know. Here's what I will know. Here's what I think. and here's what I think. I know. it's been a a while since that happened during that time. That were some things that happen not so positive in terms of of how perspectives and how things were viewed, and the I mean all kinds of of what I considered it was strife

[43:00] and it. And looking back. if we all had an opportunity to do it differently, would we? I would say, Yeah, probably. And so I guess my question would be, what does it cost? Taking a look at? It is bit being there, remaining there more harmed and good? Does it make a difference, really. and would it be a good thing to remove it? Oh, it! Considering this is a whole new group. you know, we had a whole new air about us and our mission, and how we proceed going forward. I I just see things in a lot more positive vein. Then anything I heard, and I just heard a lot then. I wasn't as involved then as I am now, but so I mean, you know, we can weigh it both sides with, how hard is it?

[44:04] What'll happen? Will egos get smashed. or will? you know what? What's the best thing? What's the best outcome for removing it? Those are my questions. And I just what good does it do to stay there? And can we chuck it up to a learning, experience and you know. Let's move forward and and and and create a win win. Win in some way whatever that takes. Those are my thoughts in my feelings, and not to oversimplify, not to. I just think they're more important things that could consume our time. you know. to list. But still it needs to be done and move forward. Thank you for listening.

[45:03] Ca, can we? Can we try now if Milan can go to the thick of what Milan was trying to share. So so we don't need that Yes, maybe, Milan, if you can try again what I've what I what I think this brings is, it brings like a conflict between the panel and the N. Double Acp. The N double acp is highly involved in the creation of this very panel. It's it's historically, it's it's kind of their work with other community members, obviously. And and the city. But but I think that this is is a source spot for the people that we're trying to represent. With this panel, and I'm wondering if we could archive it now, because the

[46:02] the message of the panel has been given and and received, and what it shows by being still on the website is that there is some tension still between the 2, and I think we need to put this beyond behind us, I think we need to move forward. And as as Madeleine was just saying, we're kind of a brand new panel. We have a new ordinance. We have a new, and so I would say, I would like to see this being archived and start on new ground with with this community organization, that is, has been a key player in who we are and so that's and I know it's a it's a source spot for them right now. I mean, right now it has been a source bot for the last 2 years. So is this a matter that we need to take to a vote, whether to return or to remove.

[47:00] or we need some more time to reflect. I mean that for me. II don't. I don't know. It's it's for us to decide how we wanna go about this. II just wanted to bring this topic. And I want us to reflect on it. And and yes, make a decision together at some point. So it's it's how you see it check up. Can't can we just vote float? Now. I think Lizzie has a question. Find this done with it? Yeah, thanks. I'm just wondering. II totally appreciate and agree with, you know, whatever steps we can take to kind of mend relationships and move forward. Positively, I'm completely on board with that. I wonder if we can discuss options for the best way to do that other than just taking it down and sort of having it disappear. Maybe we can add a statement from 2023. Look at, you know, sort of an addendum at the top that says

[48:01] something about how we view the statement now, and our our, you know, sort of path forward. or re, replace it with a statement that recognizes that it was there. And now, you know, here's here's our stance moving forward just to prevent kind of having it disappear and having that sort of be confusing, or maybe look like a lack of transparency, because this page seems designed to be kind of a log of public statements. It's it's a public statement. It's been made. It feels a little weird to just disappear it. And maybe we can also talk about other things we can do to kind of proactively mend the relationship, you know. Can we meet with anyone who is involved, and talk about it and ask what they would want, you know, from a response for us to sort of put this behind us. So I'm on board. But maybe we can talk options, too. Yeah. archiving. It would not. Well, I don't think we're talking about it, disappearing. Just thinking that we're talking about it, not living, existing in its current state.

[49:05] but just move it to somewhere where it's not. It's not a relevant issue right now, is it? And I thought that I thought that our relationship, the relationship between the panel and the and Wacp I don't know it to be anything negative. I don't. But that doesn't mean it does. That just means me. No cause I don't. And I I'm very active. and so I haven't heard anything that I that would make me wonder, or would make me raise questions. How about you, Milan? I yes, I mean this part of the reason why I'm bringing it is because when I joined the panel I had a conversation with Annette, James and she she was

[50:02] wishing at the time that this was, you know, would would be archived by now, and had hadn't, and it was definitely a sore subject for her at the time, because it doesn't reflect, you know, all the work that the end of Ocp has done. But rather a disagreement with the panel. and so I don't know. I'm just trying to think that, you know, as we are starting with a new, you know, new panel, new new ordinance and all that. Ii don't wanna disappear. This. Obviously it has to stay. It was a decision that was important at the time. I'm I was just asking to for it to be archives, so that members of the public can access it, and I didn't need time, but not be so visible. by now, because we're kind of done with that with turn the page, as you said, you know. So

[51:07] Yeah. yeah, Hadassah, I want to hear what you think. Alright. Let me just go to Victor. I see your hand, Victor. Thank you. Thanks. In the past. We spent a lot of time on this. We extended a lot of olive branches that almost wilted because no one else picked it up. There were invites that were not accepted. There were times where we spent a lot of time on this in the past, and so that's just bring. Remembering some of this you talk about this being a new panel, but just like with life. There's DNA that starts with that. And so the DNA in this panel is written within that letter. During that time we were created. We're creating the bylaws right? So part of that DNA is.

[52:08] This was pulling us away from a bylaws work at that time. Right? And so. there are things from each group that will carry on to the next. And so yes, I do agree that maybe archiving, you know, could be a way to declutter the website. As we look to the whole thing is gonna be Redone, anyway. Right? So maybe here's the historical archive of the panel, since it's inception. Here's a link. Here's everything that we've done. I definitely, you know, agree with capturing the history of that I don't know if there's specific wounds on the table. There's and hasn't been a representative to say, I leaders here and leaders here talking we're going to. That hasn't happened. So if there's something for them to bring up, then hopefully, that will go through official protocols. But I'm not aware of them as an whole entity, saying, we feel one way or another about the police oversight panel.

[53:09] It's almost like if our Governance committee says, I feel one way about this. Well, that's just the Governance Committee that they don't speak for the whole panel right? So if there's some energy within their committees that may have an issue with the panel. I don't think that speaks for You know the whole group, so if there's wounds, I don't know about it, and hopefully there's a way to have an unofficial protocol. So you know, we don't get caught up in side things you can have if needed. You know, I want a dumb type conversation. Oh. II mean. So II manage 2 websites from 2 different organizations and and I have ipides of the last month, Newsletter. So, and and it's a link. You go there. You find everything we said, since

[54:05] App forever. I think. as a way of managing the website. It's it's healthy to set archives for at least a year. Because this, this our statement statements for 2021. This out, the statement that we, the group created for 2022 II my thought is that having this in the one page of statement that we have. and being that From October 2021, it seems pretty outdated to me. So beyond the conception, I think, is outdated like, I wouldn't have that on my website in any website as a manager of a website. So I don't think that we need to engage. I mean, we can 100. I don't think we need to have a discussion about the

[55:00] that issue itself. This is out updated website issue, if we keep it like in a folder and link here. But it's not like a front page statement. I think that's what we're looking for. And I think what Milan has. I mean, if I'm understanding correctly. That is the thing. It's not. Let's talk about this again or opening anything. It's just that it's so updated. It's not representative of the conversation we're having today. So if someone comes into the website, we want them to see updated information. so I think this is merely, it should be, in my opinion, merely like a website design decision. Let's create a tab with archives, statements for the year period. That will be my proposition, I guess.

[56:01] Thank you. Thank you. Some of that. Thank you. Victor. Yeah, I'm just jumping inside of it. I want to let them talk first. Yeah, I mean, II agree. I think I think archiving is a good way to not act like we're trying to hide anything or dismiss the sentiment at the time. But also, have our website truly, reflect what we're doing and what we're what we're involved in now, right? And so ultimately, maybe the maybe the question for the panel is, you know, when we're thinking about restructuring our website, do we want to move toward archiving things that are that are older. Do we still want to continue, you know, and I think we could also think about. Do we want to submit a a statement for this year? For 2023, and see how we how we feel about that. And you know, as the communications team kind of starts to work with other communications and and then updating our website. That would be something that we can. We can think about. It sounds like most of us aren't are in favor of archiving things that aren't

[57:12] current from this year. what? I'm what I'm hearing. Yeah. yeah, I said, let it down the death that it needs today? Yeah, okay. do we have, do we want to take a vote? Victor, is that that seems like. okay, okay, so the question is, I guess. And while you know, we're updating our website, do we vote in favor? Or, again, so we'll take the yeas first for choosing to archive older statements that aren't from the current year, current panelists. How do we? Wanna

[58:00] current year? Yeah. Yeah. So moved, yeah. So moved, okay. so yes, please. for archiving previous statements. Wonderful! It looks like the yeas have it excellent. Thank you, everyone. any other thoughts or questions. but just to clear it up for the newspaper folks. There's not a current beef with the panel and Naacp, we're just cleaning up our website. There you go. Thank you so much. Yeah. And III think that's really important, Victor. I appreciate that statement because it's That's why we need to archive that to just make sure that nobody thinks that we do have any bit with them. So thank you. Just one thought for the group. If we archive everything

[59:01] from previous years which I totally support we. I don't think we'll have any statements on the page, so we may want to get something up there that represents this new group. Okay, do we? Would that be so? I think, in previous the last one on there is a co-chair statement. I believe. And so I guess the question for y'all is a larger group. Do we want do you? Would you want us to spearhead putting something together and having you guys vote to approve it? Or do we want to set a time for all of us to put to, to come together to create a statement or the panel? Okay, we can start, we can start putting something together. And I think for me, it would mostly just you know what I'm thinking now would be just kind of an update of. Here's what we've had happen over the next year. Here's what we look forward to this next year. And then we can. We can go from there and have anyone input

[60:07] things, and we'll have, probably a vote next month on on that. If that sounds good. Wonderful thanks. Everyone alright moving on down. Our next topic is meeting with the chief. We are at 7300, yes, thank you. Thank you for keeping eye on the time. Thank you. Let's take our 5 min. Bio breaks to be humans for a second. It will start at 33. So please come back at 38. Thank you. So much. Good. excellent! As we welcome everyone back.

[61:06] Thank you. So all right. So across my agenda page so our next topic is a meeting with Chief which was postponed this month. I guess. Do we have a potential proposed new date sharing I was going to wait to hear from when the the chief returns. Okay. but II reached out to her. I also shared some of the well wishes and get wells from from panel members. And she said that she very much

[62:02] no looks forward to when she returns and being able to meet with people in person. but I'm not. I don't have a I don't have a timeline on that. And but II was hoping I was hoping that because there is some time for to have it to have a conversation about what panel members would like the the format of that meeting to be and just some ideas to make sure that it is meeting the needs of the the panel members and worth everyone's time. Yeah. So in for panelists that have not attended one of these before. In the past. What we did do is we kind of got together and had you know, people people said, Here's some questions that maybe I have and so we kind of as a group decided what some of our questions were going to be

[63:07] I don't know. I think mainly it was because there was we were having to submit our questions before the meeting, and so I don't know that I saw that requirement for this last one or that. That is an expectation moving forward from the chief. And so I think. yeah, how do we? How would we like this to go? Are there? you know, if there are questions that we have, we can save those or open open discussion, any comments or questions. I'm curious. Is it like just QA. Or is there any sort of like typical, like overview presentation, or like, are there sort of standard things that we're supposed to cover in these meetings? Or is it mostly just for the conversations?

[64:04] Yeah, mostly just for conversation in terms of like past qu past past times. We had, you know, questions that kind of arose for us out of specific case reviews, or specific dispositions. From from cases that we had reviewed. And so those were some of the you know, brain topics that we've brought up before. Maybe some other like things that are community concerns. So maybe questions we've gotten from the community or you know, things things like that have generally been our questions, or, or, yeah, yeah. things like that. Yeah, I would also say, just based on past meetings. do you try to make it more less formal. So we didn't order food in the past. Now we try to order food.

[65:00] again. We're in the chief's office area, right? So you know we're in the the building off of 30. Third but the idea is that if you don't show, if you show up unprepared, then they'll set the agenda. And so there may be questions that you have personally like, why do you use this ammunition versus that ammunition? Right? But since we're also community representatives. There may be people in your community that say. for example, why are there so many bikes being stolen? And why is nothing being done about that? And we brought that up in the meeting, and Redfern explained, you have to register bikes and this and that. And so there. This is a chance to bring up community concerns community concerns, but also your own personal curiosities. and since we have limited time the chief can talk for 15 min on anything. And so if we let her. the conversation will run away, and we will will miss the opportunity. Passinger.

[66:01] for example, spending an hour talking about ammunition where we should really be spending this time talking about statistics or things that you know. Other people, you know, want to bring. Sort of. Yeah. So so for background. We new part, new ish panelist. We haven't met her we had only one meeting at the beginning of our term. and it was with at that red friend attended, and he was able to provide some answers, but not all of them, because the cheap wasn't there. And while I totally and absolutely respect how it was. I think we have an opportunity to create how we would like these meetings to be.

[67:00] At this point I would really like to have a meeting to meet her, and to see, like learn what she thinks, who she who she is and what is she looking forward for, or what whatever is like planning for next year. And what are the things that we might kind of, also, of course, bringing questions. I think that the meeting that that the one meeting that I attended with II guess we did have food pretty sure with it, and I think it was very structured, and we couldn't ask questions if they weren't sent in advance, which was kind of we would. II guess I can remember how we navigated that, but we couldn't ask questions at the moment, so we had to send the questions before. But since we haven't ever met, and haven't ever been in one of those meetings. We didn't know what to ask so I would love to take this opportunity to kind of create something. That is what this panel would like to see. So and for me personally, I would love to hear from her

[68:10] because I don't know her. and I don't know what her vision is in terms, not vision. Of course there's Media, and there's a lot of other, you know, kind of information out. But in regards to this panel, that's what I would love to know like, are you engaging in the in this oversight process? How this, how you want to be in this relationship. Do you even want to be in this relationship? So that sort of thing? And that's what I will. I will look for in in the next opportunity that we have to meet. I think what you just said was very key. It would be a wonderful start. so I would say that We can have all the above. So in in my mind I'm speaking to what Viktor is saying, so as not the agenda to be hijacked, so we can have a timed session.

[69:06] Where written comments are submitted or written questions are submitted. time, session. After that. then we are, but we have an open forum where we can talk about anything. So I don't see a problem to having that structure of the best of all worlds. Yep, Lizzie, go ahead. I see you. I wonder if we can get some clarity on the like submitting questions ahead of time issue. It sounds like, maybe at 1 point that was expected. But maybe we don't need to assume it's expected anymore. Do we know sherry? If that's part of the current expectation. I I was really surprised. I only learned, I think. Was it the day before the meeting that that was what happened in the past?

[70:03] And so that was nothing that was asked that we weren't. you know, we weren't asked to put together a an agenda or submit questions in advance for this meeting, so I didn't know that that was the standard procedure until I think the Cochairs meeting that the day before the meeting with the chief was scheduled to take place last week. But I think that some of the the things that are being said are are absolutely correct. You know what happened in the past is really helpful to know, so that we can help design it can help inform us as as we design what's happening. Moving forward. So like you know, even the idea of having the the meeting at the police department, you know, if we do want people, if people are interested in in taking a tour, then that makes the most sense, if that's not valuable

[71:00] for for people at this time, especially if you know people are trying to schedule like their ride alongs, and they feel like they've already had that information. And you know, then we can talk about having it at a more neutral location, like probably Penfield tape, because that building seems to have the best video capacity. So that's II am more than willing to, you know, explore options. I want it like, I said. I want it to be valuable for for members of the panel. Given that maybe we could go for something a little different, and and not plan to submit questions. I feel like it would be helpful, maybe, for us to curate like an informal document together, maybe just over the you know, week or 2 before, in the sharepoint with questions or topics we're interested in. I'd be curious to know what you all are thinking going in, and I'm sure we can kind of build up each other.

[72:00] And maybe if it's helpful for the chief we could give like a couple of broad strokes of the types of topics we're hoping to discuss once we have that. But it seems great to have it be a little less formal than that, and let the conversation kind of go where I will. I like that idea. the the the idea behind the written questions, if I remember, is that we we we don't want a situation where we go into a meeting when we ask a question, and somebody defers and says they are not prepared to answer the question because they they didn't have time. So that's that's the idea behind having some written questions so that you give the other person enough time to do their research and give you an inform answer. But like I was like, I'm proposing the second half where it's open. Then you can talk about anything. Then you that gives an opportunity to cover a lot of ground.

[73:03] One thing that they did they did ask, you know, was who we wanted to as present from Vpd, so I can imagine. Like you know, if if there's something where we really where people have a lot of questions about data, then maybe having a person who is really fluent in that versus, if there are questions about training and use force type of issues for them. We'd have, you know, request some of those other members of the department to be present who are really experts in those specific areas. I think part of the idea with the list was, we all have burning questions. And so maybe 7 people have the exact same question right? And then that can sort of filter some of that out, but also make sure that we have enough time and space for everyone to at least ask their one burning question. You know that they want to ask from, you know, the source. Sort of

[74:01] yeah, no, I would. I mean, I think, and and I don't honestly don't want to be annoying, but I think that's great for a second meeting, but we haven't. I have never met her. so I would love to have an opportunity to hear what is her expectation like? What, what. how can we build this relationship? There's II don't think there, maybe there is a relationship, and I'm not aware of it. But that, you know, can might perfectly be a case. But I think we need to have a first interaction, and you know, then we can. I don't know what to ask. If I you know II have no basis, so I think maybe we can. We can set the next meeting as a kind of presentation introduction type of thing. and we can hear from them. and maybe because if if you ask me like, who should be in the room to to respond, I have no idea. I don't know.

[75:05] you know, and I don't know. If I should know. Then if I should know, then II should go to my homework. But you know, maybe we can get clarity on that like. If you have a question about kind of taking what Victor said about bike, that then we bring this person in. They they are the one that can give you the answers. If you have a question about I don't know the cars, or whatever specific thing, then this other person is the one to call. But I wouldn't know what to ask for if that makes sense. Yeah, that makes sense. And you know, we just talked about how important relationships are and we don't have to wait 3 months for that. So maybe in the rescheduling within the next 30 to 45 days, we also let them know. Hey, we really want to meet the chief one on one. This is important to us. You really don't care about the other 6 command staff right now. Maybe we will in the future. But we haven't heard her stories about the streets of Cincinnati and working in the river down there, and all her great thoughts on, like police science. And right like, she has this whole different view that would definitely be helpful if you haven't heard that.

[76:13] And so I definitely agree. You saw that. So am I. Am I hearing correctly that for the next, that like initial meeting, we're looking for definitely, the chiefs presence being able to hear from her about her thoughts, but still leaving time, then for open, unscripted questions. Even if the panel has some prepared in advance. Yeah. yeah. And I would say, if anybody psu might be good to join, just because that's another key component of our system. And there are a lot of people that haven't met them yet. I think so.

[77:04] I have a question in the QA. That is along this topic. So I think that maybe we should answer this live cause we're at the moment where we could probably talk about this but there is a community member asking whether it's Sterling can ask the chief to come meet with all of you. I guess for this first time meeting I can definitely ask her. But I'm not in charge of her schedule. So yeah. So II will just say, we do have as as part of our agenda with the chief we have set up like quarterly meetings with the chief on our agenda, and so share usually sets those up, or she looked at me like, no, maybe not sharing, but sort of helps us set those meetings.

[78:04] So it's it's it's definitely on our schedule. It's it's going to happen. It happens every quarter but this one was just postponed. And so it's just about setting something within the next 30 days, and then the end. We hadn't had one in a while because we were on moratorium. So they were also not doing our our chief meetings because it wasn't part of the moratorium. So think. let me know if that answers that question. I think it does. Thank you. Guys. thank you. Okay. Any other thoughts or questions on students with the chief. Oh. okay, so, okay. then we will move on to the Ipm report.

[79:06] all right. Okay, can people see the screen? Yep, thank you. Okay. As we have discussed. we, I was able to get this put into a more accessible version. So this was sent both to the the panel Sharepoint folder in advance and uploaded for public to be able to view. So I am just going to

[80:01] give a brief overview of more of the the stats of what's happening, and then give people the the chance to discuss some of the other cases. So the the full file case reviews completed in November of 20 23 were 0. there is one k, one. A case file review completed and pending the police department disposition. and one case awaits panel review, and that is scheduled for next week. and regarding the statistics for the month of November, in 2023 there were 0 cases that were classified, and therefore 0 misconduct 0 serious misconduct 0 community inquiries.

[81:02] I observed 2 interviews. and I deemed 2 older police department investigations. They're uncomplete. and 7 cases were closed by a Bpd. In November, and the docket, as of Monday. is 9 cases that is going to go up because Psu is pushing several cases forward for me to classify So that is my paste report. So this is obviously always. It's going to be open, for you know, panel members, thoughts and comments on this process versus me reading the the cases aloud.

[82:04] That one reason that we were specifically reading cases aloud was for accessibility reasons, and so that was one of the things to have them visual. This verbally spoken, and not something that you have to read. and that is why we made sure that the the document that posted on was posted online, met the criteria within the programs for people who need audio assistance. Wonderful. So they'll be able to like click it and it'll read it to them. Thank you. I think I'm probably gonna maybe play around. Or I'm thinking about playing around with the format just because when these cases go on multiple slides, I think it adds confusion. So I might play around with the format. But these did meet the accessibility checks.

[83:03] And then that's on our that's on our website. Yes, and it is currently it's a little different. My understanding is that some of the other, the panels and boards and commissions. But in in terms of where to find it. But that is something that when I talk to the Communications Department they anticipate the other boards and commissions moving to the same system that that we have. For accessibility reasons wonderful. Thank you, Shane. And I don't know does anyone have any questions or any comments they want to make about any of the cases.

[84:03] and I don't see any. I can't. I can't see the entire the entire panel, so Because I don't hear anyone I'm going to assume. The answer is, no I also do want to say in the Well, actually, how could I stop sharing my screen. and since the last meeting I have been starting to try to do some outreach of my own. So I've met with a representative. I reached out to the Naacp and met with a representative from them. I also reached out to the University of Colorado Boulder Police Chief To make contact in case we have cases that involve joint response by See you police and Bpd.

[85:03] and apparently there's a case that I need to review that actually does so. Now I have some contacts over there, and and I also reached out with a with the the executive director of Boulder County, nami So I also have. This is sort of technical, but I'm really excited about it. News from the the police department. which is. they recently agreed to my recommendation that they begin entering all complaints into Axon immediately upon receiving those complaints. Currently they register those complaints only after they've determined that it doesn't, in fact, involved a boulder police department member, and when they actually have enough preliminary information to to begin their a preliminary investigation of those of those cases.

[86:05] So that was something that when I realized, that's how the process went. II figured we needed to change that pretty quickly. So the the police department agreed. The beginning. In january first of 2024, they will begin entering complaints as soon as they receive them, in which case I will have access to be able to to view them from their from their inception. I think it's better for transparency. It's better for data and tracking of of issues. In the meantime we are working with Axon to figure out how exactly we will resolve these cases in the system when, if it turns out that you know it's a Boulder County sheriff office or a Cu police officer. or we just don't have enough information about the situation and can't contact the the complainant to get follow up. So we're working on that. But regardless of where we are in that process, it's going to roll out. The first of of 2024. What this means is that

[87:11] we will expect that in 2024 the number of cases filed is going to be significantly higher. So that's something that I need to make sure to mention in the the 2023 annual report, so that people who are paying attention to this will not be surprised when the the number of cases complaints filed is significantly higher than it is for 2023 in preceding years. but, like I said, I was very, very pleased that the the police department acted on that recommendation as as quickly as they did. Also. As as I'm sure no one is surprised. And a big task that's happening and is going to happen is the panel recruitment selection.

[88:06] So today was the final day for people to express interest in joining the advisory committee. We identified many organizations in the boulder area to reach out to them. And then it's expected that by this Friday Maria will have selected the people who be on the Advisory Committee and also on Friday the applications for new panel numbers should go live. and that is between that that application period is between December fifteenth and the sixth of January. and I'm on on Friday I plan to send out to all of you the press release and links for the application so that you can share them within your networks for people who you think you might be interested in becoming panel members.

[89:06] and yeah, we expect to have those people selected by the middle of February. and I believe interviews are anticipated to take place on january twentieth. Yeah. anyone have any questions or thoughts about panel recruitment. So we already have our panelists that have volunteered to be on that Selection committee. Correct. Some people have have volunteered. Yes, but like I said, we it's expected that Maria will have of selected the selection or the advisory committee on Friday. So then, everyone who is selected for that would or not should here on Friday.

[90:08] when we've been the past, the panel did we? Am I remembering right? We voted to approve? Our representatives can't remember how that went. I think it was just whoever had the time based on their committee assignments and all everything else. Okay, good. So we don't need. We don't need to vote. Okay, wonderful And thank you. Whoever is volunteering for that. I just thank you. Yeah. definitely. Sherry. I'd like to talk with you. I told you I would be willing to help

[91:03] get you activated within the community. Whatever I can do to maybe help facilitate expanding your involvement, and the thing that immediately comes to mind is, is having you come as a guest, speaker, or presenter at one of our meetings at either the general membership meeting, which would be everybody within the N double Acp or maybe we could do both the Executive Committee. We can talk, offline and and decide what you would prefer to do. That would be a way to hit a lot of bases at one time. So we could talk about it. Yeah, definitely, definitely, I will support. I'll whatever I can do help make that happen for you. Awesome. And

[92:06] Selina, do you want to? Talk about meetings in person. Yeah, sure. I guess there have been a conversation about potentially moving our all panel meetings for them to be in person. And I know that we had maybe something in mind of using council chambers. So I guess I just wanna let you guys know that council chambers is actually booked for Wednesday. Specifically our Wednesday for all panel meetings. Offer 2024 there is other rooms that we could use for well, in penfiltate but again, like sherry mentioned earlier, there is very limited rooms outside of Penfield, specifically like AV restrictions. Being able to, I guess.

[93:18] have this live is gonna be very difficult in other areas. So I guess I just wanna know, like when we expect to. I mean, just kind of have an idea of like when we wanna have these in person meetings. If we, wanna, you know, have 1 1 one month. Be in person, and then the next month be hybrid. Just kind of have an idea of like what we want to do. So then I could reserve. Reserve those rooms for you. Prior, it is a process that I have to do. And some of the rooms are already booked cause you can book them a year in advance. But I just wanted to. Kind of have you guys

[94:00] keep in mind like like when W. What we want for the future. and if that's still an option just to kind of let me know. So then I can do that for you guys as soon as possible. so would the idea be. Not every meeting would be in person, but some sort of system of alternating that's up to the panel. I would just say that if I think in person meetings are are better, but obviously less convenient for people and their other personal responsibilities and commutes and things like that. So I would say, any meetings that we do have in person what that panel members really intend to attend them in person unless they are out of town, or there's some very serious other commitment

[95:11] that prevents them from being there in person. which is why I thought maybe every other meeting you know, remote in person, remote in person, might be the the best way to balance like convenience versus the benefits we would get from being the same room together every other meeting, or perhaps quarterly in person. What are other thoughts on on that? I think quarterly would be more convenient. Seeing as we have from the get go, we are having challenges of getting a room that we have or the gear. so I don't know.

[96:04] And then for the in person, we would need to potentially move the day right? Because Wednesdays are not available for the or just a different. They're not the city chambers. Yeah, there are rooms that would hold that would hold us. I don't know. Accommodate all of us. and those are available. There are some rooms available on Wednesdays. But I don't want us looking all you know, every single month, if we only intend on using it. You know, every other or quarterly as was suggested. So the same meetings you we talking about in person. So if members of the public wanna attend. they can attend. So that's something we have to factor in in. Right absolutely is it sounded like a couple of people were.

[97:01] Thought that quarterly is. The best way to proceed is is that what the direction should be for me and Selina? I like to see folks every month and get to know them, but you know we don't have that reality right? But I'd like to shake hands, and, you know, make some folks. But what are other folks think we haven't spoken up yet. AB: I have some meetings that we do quarterly and just like you, said Victor. You don't get to know one another. AB: you know, and some of those meetings are like so long AB: and AB: is, I don't know. I like the idea of getting together as often as we can just because of the work that we do kind of depends on us acting in community.

[98:02] Does that make sense? We provide some context? So are we looking. Are we wanting to have some meetings in person? That's kind of what we're thinking. yeah. And we can do it. We can do it monthly. We can do it every other month we can do it quarterly. or should I? Should I have? Should Selina send out a poll asking monthly. quarterly, or every other month. If that's easier for people to think about it. AB: If we're if we're meeting, are we meeting at this same time AB: from 6, 30 to 8 30. That, I believe, is what Selina had looked at, because that is the time that we're currently scheduled to meet

[99:02] again. This is something, you know. If there's if there is a if this time is no longer convenient to, you know the majority of the members of the panel. there's no reason that we have to, you know, stick with a system that was decided 2 years ago. AB: And right now, there, it's the meetings are on a Wednesday. AB: Okay. yeah. We had. They were originally Thursdays, but we moved them to Wednesdays because of City Council meetings were conflicting with the idea that eventually we would be meeting in person. So the plan was for everything to line up in terms of what would be available. But you know, I think. yeah, like, like Sherry said, we can make it adjust to what this group works best for us AB: and online would still be a possibility like it would be in person. But online in case people aren't able to make it.

[100:00] Yes, usually back and forth to Denver on Wednesdays, as you guys have seen me in my car before. AB: so I could make the beginnings, but then would have to leave Elon. So yeah, I'm wondering if we could do. I mean, it's it's hybrid, right? So I'm just wondering wouldn't need be easier to offer the possibility to be in person. If we have that availability, and if not, then we take it online and and do that every month, and who shows up shows up, and everybody else shows up online, and it gives us the opportunity to to be with at least some of us in person and still have contact with everybody else. since that's going to be. At the same time the members of the public can also come or be online.

[101:01] II would just suggest that we do hybrid for or at least we we try it out for a few months and and revisit. I think hybrid's a great idea. but maybe yeah, maybe we do want to send send a poll in terms of frequency of in person so hybrid monthly every other month or quarterly. any options. And then do we want to take a poll again in terms of this time and date or day of the month for people.

[102:04] II think just because I know we have some members of the community here, and we are getting rounding in on on 8 30. That this is, I think we're. I think this discussion should get switched over to email and or polls. It should, because it's just logistics it. II don't think there's any problem for this specific issue of you know, having, like a reply. All email system? I don't think that, or mind the way that I've been had it explained, is that would not violate the open meetings laws, because it's just logistics. Oh. yes. perfect and I did so, I think if that's all, then we can jump to public comment.

[103:08] There was one question in the chat. And I just kind of wanted to address it looks like you weren't able to see our answer. And so we just wanted to clarify that if there was a complaint that submitted. And you're wondering the current status you should receive an update from sherry in terms of. If that cases been, you know, voted on, and then, if there is a disposition, you will receive an update from sherry on that and if you have any questions, please do reach out to sherry, and she can give you the sort of the information in terms of where your complaint currently is okay. perfect. So let me. is somebody able to share a time? Sorry. Go ahead, hear me.

[104:02] I think that complaint was on the complaint that was prior to the establishment of the panel. So I don't think it'll be able to be reviewed a few years ago. Thank you. Selena. Can you let me share screen for the timer? Yeah, just give me 1 s. Sorry I was taking notes. okay. already. Alright. So we will go through. The members of the public that are in our meeting, and you'll be called upon. You'll have 2 min to respond. And course, panelists are great to respond. But you know, quick, short response, we don't have too much time. But let's see.

[105:14] Okay, let's start at the top. Here I have link you are able to unmute. If you have a public comment, you would like to share with us. Yeah, I want to see you when I'm talking just run out the clock. I suppose. II don't want to talk to a timer. I'm sorry. Okay, I'm sorry. I don't know how to to that. Is that something on our settings, or is that E. Usually someone puts it in one of the windows. The timer. I follow 9 city Boards City Council and 5 pop boards.

[106:00] And this is just like. doesn't work talking to a timer, doesn't. I'm sorry I'm sorry you don't want to hear what I have to say, anyway. So I'm a little confused, Lynn. I'm sorry we're if we. If we restart, I'll just keep the timer on my screen. If you want to stop sharing for this one, Selena and I can just keep track on my screen. and I'm sorry you can't see me. I know, Madeline. Is that how you say your name, or is it Madeline? II heard it said an unusual way. So then we'll go ahead and start now with your 2 min. So I was just talking to Madeline. I've seen her, and you can't see me so it's not very much of a community. Here, is it. Madeline? You'd go? Hi! And you'd hug me cause you're very sweet.

[107:13] Thank you. I'm I'm completely traumatized. This is not gonna 2 min. I can't even begin to get into this. I'm concerned about Elijah Mcclain case about Redfern, about my theft about the seventh of September, when I went and listened to 35 testimonies, and I've sent you tens and tens and tens of letters. and haven't heard any word back from anyone, and I've sent to many people in the community and to all the boards, and to the NACP. Because of concerns from my case. After the September seventh

[108:00] Council meeting the very next week. I had a theft at the Municipal Building from a city employee from the Children's Department of the Library. and they were not prosecuted. and Sherry tried to mediate with the person who was one of the perpetrators, the supervisor of the employee that stole my stuff. and she wanted to mediate with her. And even this this perpetrator was upset with the police, for how they handled the case, and I'm completely upset with how they handled this case. I've been completely traumatized from having my stuff stolen from me. I feel like I've been raped, beat, and kicked when I'm down. I'm 70 years old. I came down for a meeting with Nuria, I within 30 s.

[109:00] Then I got to the Municipal Building. I took my computer out of its bag, put it on the chair right next to me, and this person took it within 30 s and a surveillance camera that I paid for with my tax dollars evidenced this, and he's not prosecuted. The DA. Wouldn't prosecute him. He invoked his Miranda rights in the middle of the police interview. I don't know how you're running this whole department. but I can see why people have. Why, Daniel Leonard left was Lisa Sweeney Moran. Why, I can see so many problems. And yeah, there. So I'm speechless. I'm just so so upset. Just forget it. You don't care, anyway.

[110:00] Bye. thank you. Would anyone like to respond from the panel I just wanna acknowledge that we heard what Lynn have to share, and if if there's any letter that we haven't seen, I'm I'm happy to take a look. I, at least myself. I haven't received anything, but I just wanna express that we we're hearing, and we're listening. And and I'm sorry, Lynn, that you were upset. I hope that there's some way that we we can support you. I'm with you, Solidad. with whatever we can do. I don't know what that is, but we can do is try.

[111:02] Yeah, I code that when sorry you're you're so upset. Echoing the response of the panelists to speak. This is a complicated situation, and certainly everyone involved is is very aware, and feels a feels Lynn's anguish over this over this situation there is a as she alluded to, there is a another case that is going to be. It's still at Psu, so I have so in in some, when there's going to be some time in the future, I don't know when when it will be coming to the the panel to take a vote on.

[112:11] Thank you. Osc. okay, we will unmute or we will move on to Michelle. Here, let me option. Victor, do you wanna screen share this one? So Michelle can see the timer. Okay, Michelle, you are able to unmute. If you have any public comment for us today. Hi, guys, I was just, I guess, wanting to reference what Sterling was saying. I'm not sure if he was talking about my case and my question about whether or not it was gonna be reviewed, but.

[113:00] in fact, wanted to make it clear that that my case was never reviewed by the panel before and that, in fact, it was only investigated by Alistair magnib magnivenin. not once, but twice and it was never submitted during Joey Lapari's tenure with the the police and the police. I mean the police as a police monitor until 3 weeks before he resigned. and at that point it was submitted only to be documented never to be investigated by the panel. So I just I that was. yeah. My my question was to get clarity as to whether or not things would be followed up. I know policies and procedures are are changing. and I just wanted to inquire about that. and about what Lynn said. Lynn. I was there that day, and it didn't, in fact, happen in the 30 s that you were there.

[114:02] And I know that you've been mishandled or your property was, but it didn't exactly go down the way you're remembering it. and I do hope that she'll get justice, and and I think everybody deserves to be heard. And thank you guys for all your work. It's not easy. And the the police chief is a delightful lady, and I think if you guys get a chance to meet her, it'd be nice to be able to get on common ground. I just wanted to say those things. Thank you. Thank you, Michelle. Do you have any other thoughts or questions? I think maybe, that I'm not we're about. Maybe we can look into the that particular case. Sherry, do you have access to like history of? Especially like Joey Lapari's

[115:05] cases that were opened or closed. It's been a while since II looked into that specific case. so I'm a little reluctant to say something, because I don't want to get the details wrong. But my I know that he I know that he had made comments on the case, and Or had handled it in in in some ways, and that the police department, I think. reviewed it not not just once, but then that I think due to Ms. Rodriguez's complaints. I believe it was opened up again for review. and that this is a this is an ongoing concern of Ms. Rodriguez. and that it has been looked at multiple times by the the police department, at least, and

[116:04] I'm II think I think Chief Harold looked at it specifically. In response to some of these inquiries. Okay, so it sounds like, there may be more information. But we can have you guys connect and and follow up on. Sort of you know what stacks is on? Alright any other questions or thoughts comments before we close out today. Thank you all so much for being here. Happy Wednesday, and we'll see you at the next meeting. Thank you, Hadissa. Thanks for leading this meeting. Yeah, thanks. Everyone. I'd like to say happy holidays for whatever people celebrate in the upcoming future.

[117:03] Hi, everyone. AB: thank you.