September 22, 2022 — Police Oversight Panel Regular Meeting

Transcript

Captions from City of Boulder YouTube recording.

[12:21] to join the board Simultaneously George Floyd was murdered, and I did not want that to happen to my son. I still haven't been able to watch that video. but that summer of George Floyd I did not go into a single protest. I didn't have post a single thing on Facebook. I know good. I do not go to a single march. But I said, Hey, there's something I I can actually do in my community. Besides this, take you know, social media warriors I can actually go out and do something, and and the area where I come from. I used to live underneath this library. Right? I have it. I've been homeless on the boulder streets for 7 over the 30 years that I've lived here and there's only one other person I've know who has risen up from those ashes and also advocates that jennifer live with those people so i'm one of the

[13:10] only 2 voices I know from the unhouse community that has gone into the position to have a cake for bold accounting housing services, to advocate for different venues for me to actually walk into the police station, i'm driving arrested 13 times what a great what a great way to advocate, and no one else here. How's that experience? Thankfully, You didn't have to go through that. I do right. So I have a unique experience to share, and it should be wild upon my voice. It's not easy to get up here It's not easy to do all these meetings. It definitely. Takes a lot out of you But it just felt to me the the best opportunity I have right now to to really make it change And so I'm here for 3 years just to try it out.

[14:03] Thank you. Sorry. That was beautiful. Tisha Adams. I join because I come from a family of service, and I believe that democracy is a muscle, and I believe that community policing is possible, and I believe that chain starts in your backyard And it also gave me an opportunity to connect with my fellow panelists which has been incredible, experience to learn from such a diverse group in all of the ways racing and ethnically education, geography, language, it's really been something and you know it's not. Easy. These are hard and heavy issues, and these are people's lives. Both the people who submit the application or complaint, as well as the officers who were detectives, who, maybe on the other side of that, as well as what's going internally.

[15:04] And so I'm just really grateful to have this opportunity. I've had both negative and positive policing experiences at. Least show up when I've been, you know, in just domestic violence situations or sexual assault situations. and I've had Police do not break things to me, and I would love for everyone to have a for oh, quality experience! I was particularly struck. I want to talk about the training that we receive. there is an extensive, almost 6 months. I feel like training, and one of the ones I was able to go to in person was the use of force, and I remember when they were talking about the level one which is like the lowest level and the person the example they showed us was they went over to the person and they were like, How are you? Is everything? Okay, It was just like I was like. Is that possible? That way? That is, on the table? That is an option that should be the I.

[16:05] Because I've seen it as escalate, and just in all kinds of ways, and to know to be able to get an inside. Look how our police officers were trained, and to make recommendations there as well, was also something I wasn't expecting right I wasn't expecting the policy recommendations I wasn't expecting these other components, but I love building systems. I spent my career building systems and programs and and programs, for people and planets, so that can take up too much space, because I want to bring in our voices from online. So Joe, we're gonna do the we're gonna do the exchange. yes, I I'm Martha Wilson. I. It's a complicated question. And how I came to this way. But I I guess I'll just start with from a young age. It was very clear that I was treated differently by law enforcement.

[17:05] at age 6. I can remember very vividly my first encounter with law enforcement, and it was having just been in an accident with my African American father driving 3 cars total where the middle car there's a car in front of us and a car behind us and when the officer got to our car. It wasn't. Are you okay? It was pulling him out and throwing him on the hood, so I did not understand certain things. my mom, who is very like complexed Hispanic woman, did not receive the same treatment from law enforcement. At age 10. I entered the door, and the police had the wrong apartment, and they held me at gunpoint. So there's there's not an association with safety there, and they're they're really hasn't ever been as an adult.

[18:06] I work with law enforcement quite often every view a lot of police reports, and my work with child welfare, investigating child abuse for many years. So there has been the opportunity for some partnerships and investigation opportunities. but because of my skill set, I actually investigated various people, including police, who get calls on them for their team, of their children, or for domestic violence. Situations that were happening in their own homes, so as much as there is relationship. There that ability to not necessarily associate police with safety has allowed the opportunity to question and to be able to see them as people, and provide some scrutiny there because people are capable of anything I of course you know, every day I can turn on the news and there's a new person.

[19:10] Of caller dying because I am mixed. I am affected by both the black and brown deaths that are happening on a consistent basis. So if there's any way that I could get involved, I was gonna be involved. So sometimes that did meet leading marches and going out and protesting as an outlet. But in in my respects I participate in events like this. so this panel can give the full breath of whether or not you you simply want to review, or if you want to get involved further by joining one of the 3 subcommittees that are available and it's been you know anything worth effort takes effort so there's been a lot

[20:01] of I get, I would say opportunities, and there's still more opportunities to come for that. and Martha. You mentioned our sorry you mentioned our 3 committees. Do you mind sharing a little bit about the legacy Committee? Well while we have you, then we'll go ahead and and wrap up the intra. That place and space of potentially getting the police to a point where they can be safe for everyone, and where everyone can have that availability to to experience safety when it comes to contact with the police Sure. So So the Legacy Review Committee was kind of my baby a a little bit, but it really gives an opportunity to take a hard look at those historical differences in Really, really work to ensure that the active societal trauma does not continue on into the future.

[21:14] So we are examining some historical ventures. We are examining things that have happened that need to change one of our projects, that we will be working on involves the policies for handling juveniles between law enforcement as well as handling effective community members who might be having a mental health condition. Those are very near near to the people on the panel, and we get the opportunity to really review hard data and we got our first data. Dump so we're going to be synthesizing, that soon so that if if you like, that kind of stuff this is definitely.

[22:06] well, well, Matthew, that was a good way to about our legacy committee, and at first of all, before we get to that, though I speak more than that I'll introduce myself. I'm wimpy. I just call one Chicago. You may call me Chico. So for me, like I mentioned earlier on my interests on this panel or my special area of interest, is on special needs and mental. Health. I have a 23 year old autistic son, who went through the Border Valley School district, and I call myself, or I try myself to champion or to be a voice for the voiceless, and that's it's very dear me and it touches goes to the call of who I am and who I want to

[23:13] be, I leave it. I live in the special needs. Well, that's my world. I live in and I've had instances where, for instance, just to give an example where of the both in State and another state, where my son has admin meltdown, which you know for for those that preview or no special needs they they they can't globalize some of them can't visualize or expression themselves is an issue, so they they tend to have meltdowns. And we've had instances some instances which so some interactions with the law enforcement have not been up to what, as a parent out, consider acceptable.

[24:10] So. It's such instances that drive me to see that they change, and also just a color to that is being a person of color and having it. Okay, Yeah, Yeah, young man, for his son, who, if if in a in normal circumstances, I've had given him the talk, I'm for those that I'm sure you probably everybody knows the talk Oh, I've given him the talk. But he doesn't vocalize. So it's difficult to to have the talk. So that's why I am. I entered this panel out.

[25:03] Okay, initially, I was an alternate member. Then I join fully in November last year, and together Math and I Hadasa. We are part of the Legacy committee, and, like Martha was saying, we are trying to reach legacy issues or issues that have happened with what I call the voiceless. awesome. we have some more questions, questions, questions but I wanted to open up just questions that you have oftentimes You never. Have time for questions, and so I just would love to hold space for any specific questions that you may have for us. and if you don't have any, that's okay. We've got some particularly. Why we want others to join, and what our experience has been.

[26:02] But if there's anything particular that you'd like to know about our experience, or what it's like serving happy, hold space for that. And anything? Several questions. Okay, And if you could just say your name, how hold on? First of all, you could just tell me how often you meet, and we'll go to a time. Commitment there is, and if you could just briefly do, and I mean briefly just touch on what kind of training is involved that would be very helpful. Okay, So we have monthly meetings. Those are about 2 h a month. We do case reviews. That's on the sign up basis, generally 2, maybe 3 cases a month. Make one to 3. This is what I will say, and Case reviews The meeting is usually about an hour, but depending on the case, you know, you might wanna spend hours reviewing the materials.

[27:11] it really depends on the size of the case, as well So what do you mean by a case by Kate? So the the complaints that we get so when somebody submits a complaint, it goes to Psu: first as a police standard associate so citizen will submit a complaint regarding a police officer, or it could be an internal police officer. they do there, and complain first. Joey categorizes it in terms of like what we think that complaints is a violation of which specific rule police investigates it. They get all the data we get the information. If we decide to review that case, we didn't look at it up. Look at it, and then give our recommendations based on that. And so you know, some months, it's like 3, 4 h, and some months.

[28:02] It's more like 8, 10 h, and then we also the training. So for us we did probably about 6 months. We did like Saturday sessions. Couple of Saturday sessions. We don't have our formal training program for new people coming in yet, but we're working on that right now. So we anticipate something similar, probably like 6 to maybe 10 Saturdays. Here and there, just to cover different topics, and oh, so it's about 20 h a month, 20 to 30. And again this piece load. The committees are optional, so we have some players, some panelists that are not in on committee, and they take on more case loads. you know, We came in initially. We were thinking, Well, we're all gonna do the case loads, But then you realize, wait. There's these other components. We didn't have any bylaws. We didn't have any way to determine which ones to review, when which ones that we didn't So it was just like wait a second, and when we went to check there were a ton of the governance committee did a heavy lift investigating, and collecting other, bylaws and ways, of procedures from other

[29:11] police panels across the country, but I can't remember Martha. I feel like they were like, maybe 6 or 7. There weren't A wasn't a deep bench and they won a ton of reports on Yeah, fairly recent phenomenon. I feel 5 to 10 years. And so that did take. I feel like it was a much heavier lift to get to this point, but now that the things are established and we've kind of got a rhythm, you know, once you've been through a few case reviews you kind of get a rhythm I've got like a little spreadsheet. That I use to make sure. Hey? Gonna Put all little stuff in it. yeah, I I was just gonna add on the training piece that like, I remember, just speaking. I'm sure the other panelists went through the same thing as Well, they were about 8 training sessions, starting with the history of policing and oversight bold up or least department values and ethics use of force stop and the risk procedures crisis intervention homeless outreach so

[30:25] this there's a lot of training, that is there that's undertaking as well in both in person. and we also have a couple of sorry. We also have a couple of cases joining the Oh, We went to the Nicole Conference, So that was the National Association for Civilian oversight of Law enforcement. And so. Okay, it was incredible. So there we're people, not just from all over the country, but all over the world.

[31:01] And that was super powerful to see the way that some countries are structuring. It from the bottom up, right? So they're saying we want oversight from the feather level all the way down to the local. so that was cool, But then also like, okay, cool, we're in a different boat. So how we kind of cobble things together. they start a large hour, so, and just again. So we had our set trainings. But then there are also. These other ad hoc trainings that in opportunities to not only learn, but also to engage with other police oversight, panelists in other cities. And the last piece wasn't mentioned. We also have early meetings with team, so that add on to that 20 more questions so Oh, yes. I'm radical. That's

[32:05] Yeah, startups I'm just curious with you'll say, all situation like, Yeah, no. So okay. So the one hand, but no way. Oh, it's good. Yeah. Did you want to take that? Yeah, I would say, there's a lot of education to be done, So sometimes options don't understand our role. and maybe us in a different light. And so this. So that, like relationship piece, we had a some of the training was right among you all an option to do a ride of on. Not everyone did that but again was a great opportunity. So still that relationship piece is part of that. We have a officer who joins our team. What's his title like the please. On.

[33:07] So we have a police officer. He doesn't vote, but he's part of the panel, and so that position is vacant right now. But that also helps us understand the culture and the ins and outs. But I think overall we have been, you know, we've made some cases where officers have, you know, lost their jobs right? And so we've had definitely stepped up. And it's also been nice to see the way that the achieved. And that department has really embraced us on the leadership level and bye, bye, I've seen that in the way that they, as you see the reports in the Quarterly report, you can see, was it staying exonerated but oftentimes the department is almost at lockstep sometimes with our you are able to volunteer as much as you want I didn't hear the full question, but if I'm picking up, what from what Victor said, who I could hear, I would say that you know like anything people are are conscious when they're being scrutinized but I can say, that I've had the impression that you know good cops don't like bad cups, either, so they're open about what's going on.

[34:31] what we've heard from other other people from all over the country. Right? one thing that is unfortunate is that in general you're not gonna have these these panels created. You're not gonna have anything, We're not gonna get this far. The city isn't open to it, and if it's at this point to get us to the table to get the ordinance created we're in the room, city was in the room, City managers approved. Like we have quite a bit of support; whereas in cities, where there is no ordinance, panel, they're not.

[35:06] They're not even entertaining the box, right? And so we do have some some support that way. Obviously it's still oversight is is going to be That's the I mean nobody. Bad actors don't like. Oh, accountability! Right? And so that's been always creates intention, and there are by nature we are civilians versus police. And so what we think should happen might not always be the way that things happen. But, like Victor said, it's very few and far between where we've given a recommendation, and police. So no, definitely. And I think there are also this E. There's this ecosystem outside of the department that I wasn't aware of, around like arbitration and stuff like that. So you know there are these really strong systems that even if we do our best here, there might be another gateway. And so recognizing that you know So how do we kind of thread the needle?

[36:02] If you will, and those are things that I hadn't considered. But and I would also say, you know, having the support of the city has been really helpful So you'll notice the increase of the panelists from 9 to 11, as we mentioned, that's a lot of hours we need more people. and so, you know to have that, And also there was an increase in the stipend, because they recognized how much time we were able to share. You know that this was more Then what we hit initially barking for, and so making sure that you know, we create a pathway where everybody can serve was Also, critical. yeah, I I was just gonna add that with it we saw work. what we're trying. It's it all hinges on. What? What kind of suicide do we wanna leave in so that stems from there, and whatever we are doing as a panel.

[37:00] We'll need a lot of community support community support because our power was as a panel, are all enshrined in the ordinances. So, if if the community feels that, you know they are certain things, then need to be done. we'll we'll need a lot of support from the community to maybe even change the ordinances. I I also, I guess a final note would be. that's the beauty of a living document like you. You have the opportunity to help shape it, to help mold it, to help guide what should happen in the future. and that's one of the but most beneficial to me personally, because it's gonna take tempering.

[38:32] sorry sorry. It is much understanding that we receive the same access to all of the files as the original, as they do. There is no, there is to be. No, it's full transparency. So, and the reason that going back to the hours is all right, You got a cosine, but you know those hours because we get all of the police camps, so anybody who shows up we get their full cam so that took 2 h and that's 2 h, of video I mean access to all of those Joey do

[39:01] you have anything to add I could see panel when the panel gets the file I can check right now. Thank you. So? How do you maintain confidentiality in this? In this process, hey? Well, sign confidential. You get assigned a city email address and all the businesses done through the city emails, so that kinda great's a record of any interaction anything you received from the or from the city or the police department goes to that city email so it can be

[40:01] monitored Anything was sort of shared, but a third party or someone wasn't. and we have not had any issue like that. With this, with the panel, everything insecure. Yeah, sorry. Yeah, Well, our meeting meetings. So do. You need as a group who need to do a case review. We need a room. Yes, and that one is important. What do you mean? We need virtually usually for now and one. Yeah, yeah, on more in person. But I believe we're waiting until the city council meets in person again. We can't meet until the city government starts to meet in person again. So once that happened, we'll create hybrid opportunities. Is, that Question: So: Okay? Yeah, great idea.

[41:03] Didn't work working well. Okay, okay, okay, yeah, Seems like the work that you're doing is very transactional. and I'm wondering if yeah, you okay go from transactional more. Yeah. Right. Captured the right data from the Yeah. The maybe more broadly didn't pass cool right to the police department. So that's my observation. And those kind of a question embedded test as well. I need nothing absolutely. That's that's always the hope, right? I mean you hear one sliver of a situation, but also you. You worry about how many, how many other people have been affected by this that we don't know of, And what do we need to do to prevent it from ever happening again? So really, that's the task at hand that that we are are trying to grapple with, even when it's we're looking at a specific case.

[42:00] There absolutely is, and Martha is teed up as our legacy chair to respond Okay. So the ordinance give us the power to just review. Bye, the specific power is case by case basis for specific, but it also gives us the power to look at historical data, to look at history trends, and that is where we got a little bit excited. For that So we're like, okay, we can't. We can't look at old cases or old complaints that have been closed We don't have the authority to do that. What we do have the authority to do is Look at the list larger picture and then, make changes from that so That was and I just want to remember big recommendations Sorry Okay, but I do want to add, Here, This is where community comes into play, right? Our power is in line with your our community's willingness to extend that power to us. Right. Our city council and and our city council can also do that. And so again, you know, I think the other thing that I was surprised by in each case we do have the transactional but there's actually an analysis that includes policy recommendations that are outside of our authority to be able to implement the annual.

[43:10] Group is also compiled, so that you can kind of see those trends because we're also seeing trends within just the time that we case review. And so not only is there the legacy data, but then there's also things that we're seeing that led to some of the focus areas that we have now. Unfortunately, they're going to take us out of this library, so if you wouldn't mind Joey putting up the slides so I can quickly Okay, I didn't want to start at 5 30. I wouldn't have people have time between work to be able to attend this, and so and then just go to the next slide But very, very grateful to have you all here with us so Oh, oh, I forget!

[44:03] There, there is the recruitment process and timeline. So, as I mentioned the applications open next week. They will be open for 3 weeks so we are going to be doing lots of other opportunities to please hear the word ads There is The October seventeenth. To the 20 October that well, the end of October will start interviews and scheduling interviews into November, deliberations and selections will be completed. November the eighteenth, and we will send them a remote to the council. And then the council approves. In mid December, and it was my understanding The term starts January or February February 2023, so if you got a little bit of bandwidth there for and for students it is a one year term. But again we recognize if you're a senior. So that's something that you may want to be considerate of. And this is also mindful of. We may need an ordinance change, because again, if you're a senior, you wanna do it for a semester, that may be something that we would like to explore But But you don't have the capacity to do that we all have the computer.

[45:13] That's all right. So but the ways that to engage is obviously becoming a panelist. So please You'd love to have more panel members. But don't worry. There's you don't have time. I don't have time for that. But what you do have? Time for is joining a panel. It's the legacy Committee is your jam. If you are interested in getting deep into data into making recommendations, please, please. Those meetings are open to the public, and it's not sitting. Get like we just let you in, and we'll talk. We also have the communications and community, engagement. So we'll do to quarterly community events throughout the city. And so if that's something that you would like to get more involved in, we could certainly, would love to have you there, if you'd like to host, a a a community event we would I love that as well, obviously we have.

[46:01] Our monthly meetings online which you're welcome to attend. We do have a public comment section in every session, And then, of course, the quarterly meetings with the chief, and I'm gonna say those are juicy and they're not recorded. So bye, Hi Lee recommends coming any who, having said that, I think I just have a thank you. Slide and obviously we'll be around if you have any questions We're kind of setting things back up in the room. I want to thank my fellow panelists online. Martha in Tico Hadasa and Victor. I want to thank Joey for all of his work in supporting us, and also bringing all of these wonderful snacks. So please take a snack for the road. That's a less of hit things for us to have to carry around. and again. Thank you so much, and the best thing you can do for us is telephone and tell another friend. yeah.