May 1, 2023 — Cannabis Licensing Advisory Board Regular Meeting

Transcript

Captions from City of Boulder YouTube recording.

[0:06] Great. Okay, now that I was getting everybody's information, I don't have the agenda up on screen. But do you want to go ahead and read: the I can do that. This is the city of Boulder Cannabis licensing and Advisory board meeting for Monday may first 2,023 the time is 3, 13 Tm. We will begin with the instructions for virtual meeting and rules of decorum. Is everyone able to see my screen, or is it giving me fits. Again, it's working perfect public participation at beverage, licensing authority and cannabis licensing and advisory meetings.

[1:04] The city is engaged with community members to co-create a vision for productive, meaningful, and inclusive civic conversations. This vision supports physical and emotional safety for community members, staff and board and commission members, as well as democracy. For people of all ages, identities lived experiences and political perspectives. Where about this vision and the projects, community engagement process could be found at the link shown on your screen. The following are examples of rules of decorum found in the Boulder, Revised Code and other guidelines that support this vision. These will be upheld. During this meeting all remarks and testimony shall be limited to matters related to city business. No participant shall make threats or use other forms of intimidation against any person. Obscenity, racial epithets, and other speech and behavior that disrupts or otherwise impedes the ability to conduct. The meetings are prohibited.

[2:02] Participation Participants are required to sign up to speak, using the name that they are commonly known by, and individuals must display their whole name before being allowed to speak online currently. Only audio testimony is permitted online. Thank you. Want to go ahead and do roll call Member Anderson. I'm. Actually a meeting member Inerson right now. Oh, oh, Yes. certainly. We are calling role at this time. Member Anderson Prison. Kristen, or whoever is controlling things we need to turn cameras off for some people not sure if you heard that guys I'm here. Yeah. we did

[3:05] member Christie Member Daniel present Member Green. she said, about 5 min. Thank you. Vice Chair Keegan. present chair. Coonsman. President. Member noble. present ex Official Member Thompson. Present ex official Member Bailey. Cousin. We have a quorum moving on to the approval of the Cannabis licensing and Advisory Board meeting minutes from April third, 2,023.

[4:01] I was muted Was there anybody who had any comments, corrections, or suggestions? And if none, I will take a motion to approve. move to approve a second on that Brian seconds anyone opposed or obtained. Okay. and then Robin has some speakers coming, and it worked out that they are able to come. Now, Oops, Michael is calling me. Surely I can manage this portion portion for you. I can't answer. So the way things Robin had things set up is that they're going to arrive, or they're arriving virtually now.

[5:00] And so I put a message to Staff and Brian about changing the agenda a little bit. billing the elections of chair and Vice chair and general public comments on the board, and the policy suggestion forms until after the discussion of cannabis hy premises. Syndrome we already Ethan, already weighed in was okay with that that correct even Brian, I didn't get your input. That's okay with me. Okay. And where is he, Evan? How do you feel about that? I'm: totally fine with that? That's fine. Stacy. I'm: just getting on, Tom. So you'd have to repeat the question

[6:05] here or arriving personally. That's fine by me and my apologies for my late arrival. Oh, that's okay. Okay. So, Robin, Our. Do you have a quorum of speakers. The session? So okay, great. Thank you so much. And I'm: so glad everybody's here. I've been dying to talk about this subject really, ever since I joined Clap 3 plus years ago. So we're going to talk about cannabis, hyper emmesis syndrome. And this is a condition that my kid experienced. And the interesting thing about cannabis hyper-mesis is that the misunderstandings of this condition

[7:06] can really cause people to suffer for much longer than they have to, and it can cause families to spend gobs of money on emergency room visits for our family. It was close to $100,000 because my kid, he was a young adult, but he was in the er 11 times over 9 months, and he was just so convinced that he that there was no way cannabis could be causing this because it's medicine, and it makes me feel better. And this is what we treat people for who are getting chemotherapy when they're feeling nauseous. So I think i'd love for Cloud to hear from our speakers. I'm going to introduce them right now they are just a really bang up group of experts, and the first person who's going to talk with this is Alice Moon, and she is a cannabis industry

[8:04] Comms person really, and she also does consults with cannabis companies. But she experienced Chs herself. She's going to tell you her story and kind of her perspective. And then we're going to hear from Dr. Karen Randall. She's on. and Dr. Randall is an er physician, and she's going to tell us how she's seeing things in the emergency department. We have Dr. Richard Holdman. He is a He is the manager and medical consultant, first the Colorado Department of Health and environment. He's going to talk about this need for a code, a billing code for Chs specifically. So we know more about how much this is happening, because I can tell you, a Bazillion anecdotes. But a lot of anecdotes does not equal data. And then, finally, we have Nathan Dewey from the responsible association of real retailers, and he does a lot of educating around Alcohol wants to do more on cannabis. Wants to be more connected with our board.

[9:08] So i'm going to stop talking, and i'll hand it off to to you. Atlas. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you so much for having me, and Thank you, everyone for your time today. So a little bit about my background. I have worked in cannabis for 12 years, and in 2,016 I started getting really sick every so often like once a month or so I would just throw up profusely, and then I would feel better the next day, and this happened frequently, and it started becoming more than just once a month. It became once a week, and then it started becoming every day, and I was sick for 2 years before doctors diagnosed me with cannonoid hypremesis syndrome. I saw numerous doctors. I was poked, prodded, had every test done that you could imagine spent. like Robin said, a lot of money on my medical bills, and doctors couldn't figure out what was wrong with me, until I finally saw a specialist who diagnosed me with Dhs, and at first I was skeptical as somebody who works in cannabis. I didn't necessarily believe that it could be cannabis making me sick.

[10:08] So I wanted to have one last infused dinner, and so I went to that, and then that caused me to throw up for 12 days straight non-stop all day, every day for 12 days, and so it made me realize that it was indeed the cannabis making me sick. So I took a 3 month break. I tried to reintroduce Cannabis into my life again, and then, unfortunately, I got sick. Then I took another break, and I tried to introduce Cbd in my life, and unfortunately that led to a 16 day episode, and i'm talking all day every day for 16 days. It was a near death experience. I was down to £105, and i'm 5, 6. It was very, very scary, despite all that i'm. Still 100% pro cannabis. I just believe that we should be researching it. We need like Robin, said, a medical code. We need to be keeping track of this in our medical care system. So we know how many people it's affecting, and we can work towards finding some solutions for people who are suffering from this.

[11:06] Thank you, Alice. That's great. If you can hold for questions, we'll have the other speakers talk about their background, and then we'll come back to the board for questions. Okay, Dr. Randall. I hope everyone can hear me. I practice in Southern Colorado. So I practice in Pueblo and I work at the third busiest emergency department in the State perfume. and when all this started I really didn't know a lot about cannabis, but I knew we were seeing the harms pretty frequently. I did get my certificate in cannabis, science, and medicine to have a better understanding. I have spoken as far away as the Parliament in Australia and Portugal, and pretty much to multiple senates here. So a couple of things about what we do know is it's impossible to predict who's going to get it? I can't take a room with people and say these people are going to get Chs, and these aren't

[12:00] the patients. As you said, Robin, are very reluctant to admit that it's a drug that they love, that's causing their illness so much like smokers with cigarettes, although that's more normalized, and people admit it now, frequently and probably greater than 90% of the time When I see someone with Chs, they again don't want to believe it's the medicine or the drug that they love. We know that cannabis. Some frequently they'll say cannabis is using chemo, so it helps with nausea, and that's why I took more. And I get sick, and actually the chemo doses that are recommended are remarkably lower than what is recommended, or what people are taking recreational. But there are several case reports currently now in the palliative care literature that many Hospice patients are now experienced Dhs and have to come off their their treatment plan. It can be seen with both Cbd. And Thc. And now there's a report that you can actually see Chs with Navalone as well.

[13:01] The cost for Chs alone are exceptional, as you said your costs were greater than a $100,000, and i'm just gonna ballpark These figures for you an er visit with medications and a doctor's fee in a facility for you and I, not including Ct's, not including admission. is roughly about $5,000. Billed. It's not what we get, but it's built. We see a Chs patient, probably at least minimally, one a day. and and probably more. But if we go conservative, we say, I want to see one a day, and the cost is then 1.8 million dollars just for our facility. There are 25 facilities in Colorado, some probably less than others have Chs. But if you add that up, it's a cost of greater than 40 million dollars to the public at large. and then I can. I can sum up chs what I see. The youngest I've seen is 13. The oldest I've seen so far is 63. But I just like to sum up this case, because this is what we see. And not only do we lose money Medically we lose the person

[14:13] we lose their livelihood because they're sick so often. If it's a younger person, they lose their education because they're not able to go, and i'll sum it up with this case. I'm going to call this patient, Zoe, and so we started cannabis. When she was about 12 or 13. By the time she was 14 she was using regular daily. and she was vaping. So she was using concentrates. and she started coming into the er, and it will come in clusters. So him people seem to get sick and clusters. and the first year i'm going to guess that she had probably 30 visits to the er multiple admissions, but probably 30 visits the next year, which is last year, when she was 15 she had over 70 visits to the er, and at this point she's a not in school. There's no way she can be in school and be in the emergency department 70 times in a year.

[15:09] and that doesn't include admissions, and it doesn't include being ill at home, and she's 15, so she's not in school. She's losing her education, and the costs are phenomenal if you're taking one person with 70 plus visits to an er every day. but it's sadly not the exception, and when I practice medicine Detroit 10 years ago Chs. Was so rare that it was like a case report, and now I just came from a conference in emergency medicine, and I asked my colleagues if you see a person who is vomiting between the age of 15 and 60. What's the first thing that comes up on your differential diagnosis, and pretty much everyone will say it's exceptionally common. Dr. Randall so much.

[16:00] Yeah, I would just underscore that it's become so common that I know somebody who was misdiagnosed as and had an a different problem. So it's like the pendulum has swung in the other direction, which is kind of concerning as well, which brings us to Dr. Richard Holdman, from CD. Phg. The Colorado Department of Health, in a public health and environment Who can talk about this hospital code? Please go ahead. Dr. Holman. Yeah, thanks for the introduction, Robin. As she said, I'm. A project manager and Medical Consultant for the State Department of Health, and I currently oversee the the retail Marijuana Public Health Advisory Committee. So underneath that we have an ongoing systematic literature review, and we also monitor the health data from various sources like the hospitals. And so over the years we have developed an evidence statement for a Chs that has strong evidence behind it for at least a couple of years now, and it is proving that there is a evidence out there that long time a daily or near daily use is associated with Chs.

[17:10] and we also have, from from the evidence that marijuana users who stopped using marijuana have found a relief from this illness. So we have both those public health statements out there. We are constantly trying to meet them on committees like this, or do presentations. Last year I was at public health, and the Rockies talking about this, just trying to increase physicians and anybody's knowledge about Chs, as we do see it in our data that people are going to the Eds and staying at hospitals, at increasing rates almost every year. We monitor the inpatient and outpatient through the emergency department. And how we do this is through billing codes so for those that aren't aware anytime you go to the hospital. Anything that's done at all. You're gonna receive a billing code, whatever it was just talked about. If you went through a procedure, things like that.

[18:06] So there are currently some marijuana codes. However, these are limited, as they are just simply stating that there has been a use. abuse, or dependence in this patient, so they could have simply stated that they used marijuana, or they could literally be there for that visit. for their marijuana use. For example, Chs. Related. However, we have done a few preliminary studies. The State did ask us to basically do a report saying how we can identify marijuana related cases in the State of Colorado, and unfortunately at this time it's pretty limited, as we're not sure why these patients are getting these codes, as they are not very specific at this time for anything related to what the symptoms are that they experience over. Then simply that marijuana use has been documented.

[19:02] So there have been a few studies that we also use in collaboration with our data to show. One of them, for example, is by Dr. Sam Wang, now to the University of Colorado, and he attempted to show how they could combine these marijuana codes with vomiting codes and see if that could identify these cases. However, his results came back basically stating that it greatly underestimates the case load of Cfs. So these codes, while they will identify some patients, it's extremely limited at this time to identify those Chs patients. And that is why, as we've heard already. so many people go for these extensive workups as they're not identified right away from that from that differential diagnosis of gastrointestinal problems. So where this has led the State of Colorado is, we are currently working with members from the Cdc and also the Council of State territorial epidemiologists to try and come up and influence the Icd people to add a code specifically for Chs.

[20:13] So those requirements will will be developed. But basically, we're following the literature and just showing that it is that long time daily cannabis use that heavy cannabis users can develop this syndrome of vomiting. And so through that raised awareness we're hoping to raise awareness for this code that will one day be implemented. And that way we can actually track this syndrome through the surveillance data and know how much it really is impacting Residents of the State of Colorado. There'll be some follow up questions on that, Dr. Holdman. That's really important, not only to try to understand the big picture, but I mean. you know, for my kids 11 visits. Nobody ever wrote down anything about this that added to his confusion, he was definitely coded for Cannabis misuse, disorder, but not it. Wasn't related to this vomiting thing. So again, you know, Facebook is what helped us there.

[21:18] Nathan Dewey is joining us. He is the director for the responsible association of retailers, and i'm so glad Nathan's here because he's interested in helping licenses, educate consumers about what they need to know. And the thing about i'm gonna let you talk, your Nathan. Let me just t it up a little bit. The thing about Chs is that resolving it is easy you stop using marijuana. and if you have a use disorder, it might be hard to stop using marijuana, but that's another issue. The big issue is to stop using marijuana. So if you find yourself vomiting very very frequently as a user and you get relief from a hot bath or a shower.

[22:04] You should stop using cannabis that that's a that's a message that I think our retailers could help us with, or we could ask our Bud tenders to understand that a little better. So, Nathan, I thought if you could tell us about your group, and how you might liaise with some of the folks that are out there, and i'll let you talk now. Sorry about that. Obviously just sell cannabis. but also to go a step forward. We are actually a youth prevention and wellness program. We were originally with a a a nonprofit called team for cons, which is kind of famous in in Colorado for helping to shut down the cannabis industry up in Fort Collins, and at the same time, when I was hired on. We rebirthed it and helped the the retailers up in in 4 cones, join their own kind of cannabis retailer association. So just really what we do is we hold our

[23:19] retailers on the cannabis and alcohol side to a code of ethics, of morally and ethically serving and selling alcohol and cannabis to the community members with the idea that really what they're buying into by joining us is prevention for youth and the wellness of youth, and to making sure that you know it's only used for adults, and we don't even use recreational use. We try to PIN adult use, and that is something we will be looking at for moving forward. In the bolder community. We have been doing cannabis work with retailers since 2,015 Rr. Has been working with alcohol retailers since 2,004. Unfortunately a gal over consumed out in the community at the time, and are joined with Csu and the local law enforcement to create their alcohol chapters. And again, as I said, in 2,015, I was hired on to kind of

[24:09] reinvent it for the cannabis industry since that time just a little background, so you can understand where I'm coming from as well. I sit on Governor Pulses Meok committee if you're not familiar with. That is the Marijuana Education Oversight Committee for the State of Colorado. I sit on on that board with Dr. Holdman's Associate Ali Mafi. We also sit on there with C dot with anti marijuana groups, pro marijuana groups, industry groups, so it's a real big mix. And this is this is something I'm going to. I was going to approach them with last week, but unfortunately the meeting got postponed. But this is an issue I will be now confronting them with, because it's not something we talk about a lot. But after talking with Robin, and really doing some more research on my own, and and connecting with the CD. Ph. As well. I think it is an issue we need to talk about within our community.

[25:00] So what does that really mean? Just so, you know I am a but certified bug, tender trainer for the State of Colorado through the Me. D. I routinely and monthly provide cannabis trainings for these folks, and this is something that I can educate them on in these trainings during the trainings. I already educate on things like press feeding, as as we all know that's a danger for for the little ones who are breastfeeding. You cannot smoke marijuana and breastfeed. So that's something we've put out into the community actually through the retailers. So I was really happy when Robin approached me, because a I wanted to be connected with you, as Kristen knows i'm. I'm heavily involved with Bla, the boulder licensing authority. I've been working with them since 2,019, and I've just had a hard time getting into the cannabis industry. But it's something now, that is, we're granted through a substance education award through the city of Boulder and the county of Boulder. So we have money. We have money to get these retailers on board, and we'll get more into that later. My main mission with this now is even as a person

[26:03] who had cancer and has seen a lot of people use. Really, isn't something that's in the public knowledge. I don't think Chs is something people are aware of. If they are vomiting like Alice Moon mentioned earlier her, her experience and just hearing her experience from someone who was within the industry and then developed the Chs. There are probably so many people out there that we can help just like Robin sent her kiddo. They didn't really know what was going on. We don't need to have them go 11 times to the emergency room. Let's get that information out there, and ourr is a vehicle to get that out there. And what do I mean by that is, I will literally be. And then I am actually now working on some literature that we can release up, and for Collins dispensaries, so that with every single sale we're putting out this information just like we've done with press feeding. They will just they will. And I'm telling you, at least my members now will voluntarily hand out this information, even though it may be detrimental to their sales, detrimental to their business. Really, when they join, or the the

[27:04] greatest cause, the bigger cause of the community and education. And they really don't want people suffering like that. They wouldn't want their I from the majority of the folks. I know they don't want to make a sale over someone's personal suffering. so I think this is going to be a really good vehicle for me to meet all of you, to be able to communicate with all of you, and sort of voice my opinion on what can we do, because it's not just through that sales that we can do it. But we do like in the city of Boulder. We do have some of that funding for grants to actually put this message out. maybe on to bus stops and things like this, or whatever we need to do, or at special events in the community concerts these sorts of things. We can kind of get it out to that community. Maybe if there's a 4, 20 party, we put that out there where where it is in the 420 party, and we advertise. So really we're a vehicle for the community. We're a resource for the retailers, but for the community at large as well and like I said, this is something that's a little bit newer to me. When Robin approached me. I knew about it. but I didn't realize after the research I did, it was such a serious problem. And so so many people are being affected by this, and and that just shows you when you've been a guy who's on the Miyak Committee. I've got my ear to the ground on a lot of things concerning marijuana and side effects. And you know we did a big thing on psychosis and things like this

[28:17] with marijuana, and how that can be triggered. So I think this is just our next evolution in helping the community, and the retailers also educate their folks, and and really just getting the message out to the community that hey? This exists. It's proven. It's medical. And let's show you what you can do to get away from it right? Either help find them the resources to get the help they need, or actually just say, hey, you need to stop that kind of thing. And so again, we're not a pro marijuana. We're not anti. We're here to embrace the legalization of it and make sure that it's the safest possible thing for the people who are purchasing it, and the people who are surrounded by it. So yeah, I guess that's it in a nutshell. Wow, that's that's great. Thank you so much, Nathan. That's super helpful, and I hope we can collaborate in some way, shape or form to just get this some simple messaging out there. So, folks aren't confused.

[29:10] Okay, I wanted to open it up to the board members, and maybe we just go around the circle. But if any of you have a question for one of the panelists. Please go for it. Anyone Okay. So I just have a just a questions from a medical public health perspective, just like what are risk factors or anything. Is anyone aware of the risk? Factors that are predictors are correlated with yeah on cannabis consumption with the cannabis Hyper and my sister and John. I don't think we actually really know that there are defined risk factors. The biggest correlation that we have is the more you use the higher concentrate.

[30:02] the more likely you are to have an event or develop Chs: I don't know of any particular identifying risk factors. Yeah, I think I would echo that and say, You know, the data, unfortunately, is a limited, but we can look at our data to see if the groups that are using daily the most etc. like that, and and kind of make some assumptions. But I don't know how well that will translate into the medical findings great. Thank you. Thank you for your presentation. Stacey. I have a question. This might be also directed more towards Dr. Holman, but i'm, you know definitely. It's very clear we need to get the public health education on the ground, like everyone's talking about. And I think that's beyond important. I'm just curious to what extent are we chasing provider education, because from what you're describing it, it really sounds like that's the biggest key, like with other disorders, especially ones involving

[31:14] substances. I would use it's hard for patients to self identify, so that, and for a variety of reasons. But then it becomes in my mind this major concern of provider education like, how can we get Ingi clinics, ers, etc., with that type of information is what's on my line? Because I feel like that's probably gonna give us even more bang for our buck. Sure, we absolutely need the public health, and, like you know, people to have this awareness. But I still feel if we don't chase the provider education even more that we're still not going to get the data you're referring to, hoping, you know, to get and collect, and then be able to analyze, etc. So I guess that's on my mind like, how do we do that?

[32:02] Yeah. And you're absolutely right with that, Even if we had a code, You know. How do we? How do we get them to know? It exists, and to use it and identify, and that that's definitely one of our big pushes, and unfortunately, at the state of Colorado our prevention Services sister program lost a lot of their funding, so they're currently in the rebuilding phase they're rehiring and all that. So it once they're back together, it is one of our main goals along with a few of of our you know what the data shows of of who's being impacted the most by these health effects. So it's definitely going to be one of our driving points, and that's why we always try to take it to and present at random conferences and and get publications if we can. And those are a little slow moving, unfortunately, but it's definitely. You know. How do we? How do we reach the physicians best? And there there's a few ideas out there for sure. So and I would second that for sure, and for the last, probably 5 to 7 years. I've been speaking at multiple conferences, because I really, literally am truly amazed at their physicians here in Colorado.

[33:11] who don't know that who are primary care, and Don't have any idea. and and and even emergency physicians, even though we think, Chs: they don't really have a good idea what it is, how it's happening, and how the patient needs to treat it. So I've been speaking at conferences. For quite some time we've been publishing, and there's Isaac's. one.org is a physician group that publishes about medical problems associated with cannabis, and I know many of the doctors there are also speaking. The information now seems to be getting out more readily, and there seems to be more acceptance in this. but it had been limited in the past. Do you think this is replacing a lot of what was being diagnosed, or could as cyclic vomiting?

[34:03] Oh, 100% in the in the early days, like prior to the concentrate screens. So the potency increasing so much it was probably cyclic vomiting that just existed, and it's also probably a close tie into like diabetic Gastro, Paris. But it it may have been that diagnosis, but the issue that I find is very difficult. So I know that from the public health perspective that it's very difficult to say this is Chs right, because what I found clinically is the most of people like, I said, Don't want to admit that it's the drug they enjoy causing their illness. So what I say to them is this is basically like your body's allergic reaction to it. and you need to stop. But when you put that diagnosis code in that code isn't always the 9, it will follow the patient. It's in their medical records, and it's listed there, and the only complaint I ever got to the medical board in 25 years

[35:07] was I put Cannabis use disorder, and a lady who admitted she was using 5,000 milligrams of cannabis a day, because she just didn't think it was a problem. And so a lot of physicians will just code these patients is nausea and vomiting, as opposed to saying Chs. And when you're looking at this diagnosis from a person, a perspective as a position these patients present, and I know you saw your son, and I know many of you have these symptoms that they're pretty profound. and they're pretty acute. And so when you first see that you're like, well, I gotta get some blob work. I got to give them some Ib fluids. Many of these people get repeat cts. and a lot of times when you see this patients the information about i'm using cannabis isn't forthcoming and and a lot of times. Then the Docs don't even ask, although we should we ask about other substances. So I think that's part of the problem.

[36:06] Get that level, provide our education because we need to be asking as providers. If If everybody is using a substance that has potential health effects right, we ask them if they drink usually so it same idea just it. It feels like that would likely be a bigger bang for our buck, based on what sounds like the objectives for Cdpg. I think I think that will be a good place to start, which is. when I speak at, like the academic emergency medicine Conferences, or other places. I usually include that in my lectures, so that the providers know and understand. But also there has to be, I think. what Nathan is saying, with education, and maybe a pamphlet in the in the shops, so that the patients are the the people who are consuming actually. Look at and say, you know what maybe that is me and the Facebook the Cannabis, I premises. Facebook group has been like tremendous cause I now actually have some patients coming in, saying, I think I might have this. so that that's been so, I think, getting the knowledge out to the public that this is a a problem, and having the buttenders put a brochure or speak about, it would be awesome.

[37:19] So I worked with. I worked with the Institute of Safe Medicine practices Canada to come up with a brochure that they distribute through emergency rooms throughout Canada, and it's a very patient, friendly brochure where it's not fear mongering about cannabis at all, where it's just straight to the backs, and they've been distributing that for a few years now, and it's available to be licensed to out other hospitals. I think it's just like a couple of $100 to get the brochure, and then it can be distributed wherever we'd like. That'd be great thanks, and one of our big pushes is to get doctors to screen cannabis very much like tobacco or alcohol. But that is a massive ask

[38:05] big process. But you know we gotta start somewhere, so I think this will. This will help get that at least discussion going for sure. Well, thank you all for your time. I appreciate you answering my questions. and I would echo that each and one, each and every one of you. and I appreciate Alice. You're telling your your story. It reminds me of. So I was the medical director at the Student Health Center on campus here, and not somewhere around. 10 to 12 years ago, I remember, I had heard about cannabis, hy premises syndrome, and and there was a student that came in. I think it was a male. and I wondered. I suspected I sent them off to the gastro neurologist, who had never heard of it, and thought I was, you know, crazy for suggesting it, and the and the patient, you know they didn't want to hear that they didn't want to hear that. You know it's time to give up our in time to cut back on cannabis, or.

[39:02] you know, stop cannabis for a short period of time, and but in the end that's what it turned out to be is probably one of the earlier at least known Colorado cases way back, when but I remember kind of fighting a battle to get it from a primary care provider's point of here to get it diagnosed. And so I I have questions I don't know if you want to comment about that, Alice, or or I mean. I mean a lot of people in the cannabis industry. Don't believe that Chs is real. I've been bullied non stop for the last 5 years by people who work in cannabis, or who are fans of cannabis, who don't want to believe that this is real. A lot of doctors don't know about it. I've gone to urgent care, and you know, educated my own doctors when i'm getting an Iv. Because i'm so sick. and it's really unfortunate that there is this. you know Anti-chs commentary when I have the lived experience. I know that it is real and it's unfortunate, and you know, even secondhand smoke makes me sick, so I can't go to cannabis events. I can't go to concerts. I can't go where there's ever public consumption allowed, because it will make me extremely nauseous and potentially throw up. So

[40:15] I am all about, you know, educating people about this syndrome, because I don't want anyone to suffer as much as I did. I was, you know. extremely sick for 2 years, and it was really really scary, and I just. I I want to do as much as I can to help people, and I've done a lot of public speaking. If you Google Alison, in Washington Post, you can find a really detailed article about my experience. They did a cover story about 2 years ago. and I've done a lot of other pr opportunities, and i'm spoken at a few medical conferences, because i'm that passionate about helping educate people about the syndrome. Thank you for Thank you for your passion and keep keep up the good work. Question for questions for Dr. Holman and Dr. Randall, I believe. Right.

[41:01] You don't have your last name up there, so on the coding thing, especially for the er doctor, I mean there's been a discussion. I'm just going to take it away from Cannabis for a second that if you're trying to keep track of bicycle injuries you You some er doctors are supposed to add a an add on that this injury like this broken bone occurred because of a bicycle. Now, so it's kind of like an add on code. Where are we at? In terms of just adding a marijuana code? And I know that as best I know I understand the Us. Is not using Icd. 10 or 11 Yet 37 Countries around the World are but but we're not and how it how likely is it that we can get a code added to Icd 11. That would just indicate that cannabis was used, and then it would. When Dr. Wang, I guess you said would be looking at his data, and they saw this nause and vomiting in the Cannabis code

[42:02] that would take care of the problem, right? That's that's how I do it right now is I try to put nausea and vomiting, and then cannabis use, so that hopefully when they do a search, it comes up as canvas who is not in vomiting, which is a key to Chs. But again, like I said, and I think it has to do with the fact that Cannabis was considered a legal or illicit for so long. And even though now it's, it's legal, and it's recreational people still think i'm not going to tell the doctor that. and and I can't tell you how many people with withhold that information. There's also a cannabis presentation. It's like a stroke mimic, and it's mostly an older people and a 100% of the people that I've seen with a stroke mimic from cannabis withhold that information until the very end. And they've had cts and Mris, and they say, well, grandpa ate like £42 of cannabis butter. Do you think that was it And so I think there's still a stigma in a lot of people's minds, so no one, I mean.

[43:04] if if I put alcohol, use it, or tobacco you so like. The Government, asked us to code tobacco, abuse for a long time, and those people who had tobacco abuse, no matter what they came into the er for. and and so people get used to that, and people accept that. But I don't see that acceptance yet with cannabis. So if somebody comes into the LED and I put Cannabis use, and they happen to work for c dot, or the Department of Corrections. It affects them, and and it's like more so than if I just put alcohol for some reason. And so again, the public is reluctant to admit that to me, and I don't know how we change that. But with Chs I think it would be really important just to get one diagnosis so that we could put it in there so that these people may not have to undergo endoscopy or see repeated C teams. because we can say it. Chs: and the treatment for Chs and the emergency department is really different than just someone who has vomiting and nausea.

[44:07] Yeah, going a a period of time, you know, one to 3 months without marijuana is a lot cheaper than getting industrial for most people. And, Nathan, we we need to have responsible association of of er providers. I guess we need to educate the er providers as to order and all providers really as to how to code or how to evaluate things better, I guess. Yeah, yeah, I think that's even something you like. I just mentioned that brochure. I would love to see that just normally I would develop. I develop it on my own. I have a promotions and marketing background. So I can do that. But I much rather use something that's you know, scientific and and codified, and it's been legitimized, and that's something I would not mind reaching out to local emergency rooms and and distributing, and the other thing we can do is distribute it out through schools, Your youth programs and things like this, maybe not for the elementary, but for the high schoolers.

[45:03] I think that might be something that would be valuable for us to do as we do something called brain wise for these kids where it's a wizard brain, lizard brain thing. I I I don't want to speak much on it. I don't know no enough, but that's just actually just gave me a great idea. We could actually disseminate this information out into that, into the public that way there. So there's a lot of outlets I think we could do this with we'll. We'll get a copy and we will send it out on our in our next packet also. No, no, that Kristen. And then just real quickly. I'm sorry for taking so much time. But Brian asked a really good question about positive factors, and I keep forgetting Dr. Randall's last name. You know she mentioned the you know the length of time, maybe, that somebody had been using cannabis or the concentration. There's some data that appears to be coming forward that suggests genotypes.

[46:00] maybe a factor, 2, you know, different types of side of Chrome P. 450 enzyme that we we all have different genotypes, and that may be a A. A, a factor that leads some people to getting chs versus others. I don't. I mean I don't know if it's all going to be that simple. But anyways I do. You give me a thought to that either Dr. Holman or Dr. Randall. I wish that cited chrome people factor identifications would be available with those I can't see that being readily available to me as the guy in the er see these patients. So I think if there's a way to come up with identifiers that are. you know, a little bit more clinically oriented, because no one's going to come in with a side of Cytochrome P. 450 essay. Yeah. that's true. Definitely Agree with that I have read the article that I that you're probably referencing that that identified. You know certain people are more prone to this, and I think that at least leads into the education of knowing why these people get affected by differently than other people when they use the same amount. Some people are gonna get Chs Overs Aren't.

[47:16] And I think that's the answer for that. But unfortunately, yeah, that's not a way to identify in the LED. I know. Yeah, it's it's it's something in the future. Millions of people have gotten their genotypes done through 23 and me and ancestry.com, and if we could talk those 2 companies into adding a genetic test. Then that would be great, Brian. Go ahead. I think it was in front of me. But oh, was she okay, Sorry, Kate. I I hopped back. Brian, you go ahead. Okay. My question was just again from like a public health perspective. It is zooming out from Chs. Specifically. Are there models that any of you are trying to have seen, or that you're trying to emulate right so like smoking cessation, you know, back in the nineties and early 2,000. Is that something that's worth trying to explore pursuit here, like what's like, appropriate? Because, like policy levers your interventions for around education or policy change

[48:20] that you're looking to where you're trying to emulate and say like this worked before we should be doing more of that thing around to you just like, what are those other things that have been done in the past around education around testing other kinds of things that it'd be adopted for Chs. Yeah, I think I think one of the first places to go is we can. We can copy. You know what we have learned from alcohol and tobacco prevention efforts targeting the most at risk users. So we already know that people that get Chs are using a lot more than the average. User you know, typically have a pattern of daily use or very close to it. So I think, targeting that population with the facts would be a helpful prevention campaign to do.

[49:07] since we know it works for tobacco and alcohol, and and, like Alice said earlier, to just come out with the facts, not the fear mongering about Cannabis use, and just simply stating that some people are at risk, for it may help reach those customers right, and anyone else want to respond to that or no. I really think education to the general user in public about that. If I, somebody said it that the people who come in don't want to believe that Chs is. you know, real or don't want to believe it's caused by marijuana. But if we can get the education on a brochures, which I think is a great ideas of warning. And the other thing is, we ended up teaching the public that smoking was harmful. And now, like if you ask anybody, they'll say smoking is bad

[50:04] or harmful, and I think we get that message out associated with the only way to really effectively treat it. That we know is to stop with that message along with the information anyone else want to respond. And if not, Kate. Yeah, Obviously, I also want to say thank you to everybody for the presentations, and you know. But, Robin, thank you for bringing this disable. Obviously I know that You've been wanting to talk about it for a long time, and I think the biggest part about this right about anything is education and awareness, and that's what you're doing, and that's what you've done through this conversation today. So just a huge, you know. Thank you for that. I think you know I I do want to talk about educational materials because we've talked about it before, and I just want to make the the comment that you know from a a a buttender perspective. I I hesitate to want to have them talk about it at all. But tenders are not medical providers. They are not doctors. We talk about this all the time that don't use absolute. It's not treating something it's.

[51:14] you know. I think, talking about for me. It's always been. You know it. Cannabis is medicine right? And in a medicine has different side effects, and can affect everybody differently. And so we talk about kind of that kind of realm of of education, right? But in terms of of Chs it it makes sense that there'd be something from CD. Phe. Something from the Med for responsible vendor training like there's a lot of a lot of things that need to happen, and I think a pamphlet is a perfect way to do that. That's at dispensaries and and and available to the public. I just really want to say that I'm i'm very hesitant to like have buttenders be the ones having the discussion without through understanding to make sure that we're giving the information accurately and without bias. So I think that it just wanted to kind of put that out there. I also think that people are probably reluctant at this partially right. I can't say, you know, for all of the people that come in because everybody is different, but

[52:12] a lot of people are reluctant, but because of of what you said Dr. Randall about. You know the fact that maybe they work for C Dot. Maybe they work for an organization that does charge screenings that that aren't that don't allow them to consume a a a legal state product right? And so they're reluctant to to have anybody put that on there. So they don't give that information, so that from a policy standpoint from a Federal and State perspective like those laws need to change that people can be honest about what they're actually doing, and not feel like they are kind of put in in in a box, or put in a position where they can't be honest about what they're consuming. So this is totally multifaceted in terms of what needs to change in order for this to be something that the public is educated on, and I think that this conversation in this panel, and is just one step towards all of that. So obviously. Thank you all for for your time, and I don't actually have any questions. It was more just a a thank you, and a comment about kind of the the global sense of let's. Let's kind of keep talking about it, and all of us have conversations with

[53:15] X. Y. Z. Number of people every single day, every you know part of our lives. And then this is something that that we can help people with within our and like our immediate lives. So thank you. Thanks, Kate. Any of the panelists want to respond to that. I think, like one easy way. If we wanted to avoid the buttender interaction is that if we do put pamphlets up. something like, is this happening to you? Describe Chs. And then maybe there could be a link at like Cdhp that says, Here is what it is. Here's the syndrome with some referrals for patients. for medications and treatment resources, and that way you you eliminate the bud, tender conversation or ownership of that, and it's just on a for sure.

[54:05] absolutely. And and so I mean, I think the education for buttenders is about showing the data right, and showing that this is real, and showing that it exists, so that, like the conversation, if there is one. is like, hey like? Consult this, you know, if you have any issues, and not talking about whether they agree or Don't agree with what the content of that pamphlet is, that's the education that needs to happen is that. Look at your resources, believe your resources, and and it's up to the the patient, or the client, or the consumer to decide how to take that information and giving them the resources for sure. right. And I think we could be better at doing that on the medical side, too. for a patient. Yeah. And so I just want to say we did make a pamphlet with the Marijuana Enforcement division about concentrate use and the potential side effects of that. So I think something similar for this could definitely be developed. That would be, and it would. It's exactly that. It's just a pamphlet that as somebody buys a concentrate, they're supposed to be told. Oh, take one of these so you can learn about it.

[55:07] And that way. It's not the buttenders saying, you know their opinion or anything like that. Anyone else, or I'll go to Allison. Hey, Go ahead, Alison. Thanks. Yeah. Just want to echo a lot of what Kate said. I really appreciate all of you being here insurance information, and, thanks to Robin for pulling it together from so many different perspectives. What's coming up for me is how. yeah, how to partner to get the information out. I I agree that with the stigma associated with with cannabis use and the quick interactions that folks are having with providers. It is really hard for people to say what's going on for them. There's all sorts of things that we know that folks don't share with medical providers. And so thinking about how to get some education out to the provider, so that they're They're asking the question that that it's coming up for them

[56:06] in conjunction with getting more information out out to the public. So I would be super interested in anything that's coming out of of Cdp at, or thanks, Alice, for sharing the resource that you have to see if that's something that we can get out through some of the you know our local er because we have a bunch of in Boulder County that folks are using to see how on it some small steps that we that we could do so. It's just a to a comment to the folks who are on the call that I will be following up with some of you. Also see how we can get some of that information out, and would love to to bring some of that work with anyone on collaborate or get get that information out and definitely on the the sort of public information side. I think there's some some opportunities to do that through some of the existing education that's happening to parents and young people about Cannabis, making sure that this is information that's shared at the same time to

[57:12] even. I heightened that awareness, because I I have also notice with folks to that. It's just not something that's on anyone's radar. So thinking about how we can integrated into existing education and materials, I think, is is really important. I just want to quickly echo that Allison, because there's another side to stigma. That's really important here, and that is sometimes even our providers are scared to speak up about C hs because they're scared. They're going to be viewed as anti- cannabis. and that's a really spooky place to be in this particular community. It's it you find people trying to. They're trying to be very very careful. They don't want to be perceived as anti- cannabis, and especially, you know, there are some medical providers who use cannabis.

[58:05] but there there has to be a so a safe way for them to be able to talk about it, and not be accused of, you know, being prohibition, as, so to speak, so the more education they have about. Hey, this is real, and this is what your people need to know if they're experiencing it that that's the place we need to get to just is really black and white. Go ahead, Dr. Green. You pretty much just took the words out of my mouth. Robin, I think like this needs to be as simple as as a position like. I know i'm able to ask questions about alcohol and screen for alcohol related disorders, and I don't worry about doing that at all, as far as you know, getting stigmatized for being anti alcohol. I think we just need to get to the point that this is the same thing, and it it could be that simple like we don't need to make it complex right if you're asking a question, and your patient says yes, they use cannabis right there, and they also have this other, you know, constellation of symptoms

[59:08] that should just be on the differential. Then I think it needs to be that, and, like you said it's very black and white, and it doesn't mean it is Chs. It just means that needs to be considered rather than it like we've heard running up $100,000 in medical cost. That's just insane. And so yeah, I I think that is like, I said earlier, the biggest thing for the back, at least in my mind, and you know where maybe it would be a good focus. And i'm curious myself if there's a way to do that, because I I just don't feel like how far into Cannabis in Colorado we are, we should still be at the point of worrying about asking our patients about using it, or or as a provider having to worry about that. That's awful. And so and then, I think Kate had mentioned something about like

[60:00] patients shouldn't have to worry about admitting to it. But that's a whole nother bag of worms is my understanding. That's already been to the Colorado Supreme Court, and they voted, and somebody, please correct me from wrong. But they voted that it's an employer's right thing, so as an employer, you have the right to discriminate to some extent against your patient for using cannabis, or say, i'm sorry you can't do this job, and I I don't actually have issues with that like to. In some ways I do. But in some ways they don't like for C. Doc. To me that seems clear. Okay, like we're gonna have to just make this black and white, right? If you're driving trucks, you probably shouldn't be using canvas while you're doing that. So you know i'm not really feeling like it's worth diving in there as much, because I feel like that's happened in the past, and yes, to some extent we want to de-stigmatize. But at this point this population with Chs is a smaller group. That I Don't think, represents the whole story like this? Is it kind of separate from that in my mind, I guess, is what I'm saying.

[61:05] and there should be a way. We could do this without really even having to worry as much about that as my hope any of the panelists. Was there a question that at at the end of there I don't think so, right? Any of the panelists want to respond to. Yeah, I just had a comment saying that this this stigma conversation is huge and something that we're we're going through a lot with. We're trying to come out with a breastfeeding and pregnancy guidance, and it's specifically for physicians, and how they bring up that conversation even just to ask. So it's. And especially as you look at the different populations of who's using cannabis who was affected by the war on drugs in the past. More unfortunately, a lot of those users are the ones that are still using heavily, and they're the ones that are at the most fear of having a consequence of their cannabis, so they're not going to admit it to a physician.

[62:02] and so it's a lot of that. We got to untangle a lot of stigma, I think, with cannabis and it, and a great place to start is with the physicians and just making them a little more comfortable, just simply asking it and and showing the patients that it's not necessarily gonna result in anything. It's just a very screening question, just like alcohol or tobacco use. So I think I think that's a great starting place, for sure. I think education with positions is the most important part, because when I was diagnosed by my doctor, and I didn't believe them. It was because they were very unsure about the condition as a whole. They weren't very educated on it, and so they didn't have any resources or information to provide me with. And it was just kind of like a you might have this like it could be that, like we don't really know. But and so I think, giving medical professionals all the information possible about, you know. Here's the medicines that have been proven to work to stop this. Here's what people are doing to stop this like. Here's what we can do. I think that would be very beneficial in helping patients believe their doctors

[63:09] any other panelists. It's it's hard to just say like so for you. Maybe your doctor and say it because it's really hard to say. You definitely have it, because there's no specific test that says you have it. You have a Chs. It's just that You've had secrets of visits, and you've had repeated visits and your cannabis. User so we're going to associate that. So we always say cannabis is basically a diagnosis of exclusion where I've ruled out e colic or gastro, Paris, or other things. So it's hard for a lot of providers to say. This is what you have for sure, because there is, I mean, I can tell you. You have a heart attack for sure, because your proponents elevated. But I can't tell you You have chs for sure, because there's no marker anyone else, or i'll go on to Ethan.

[64:04] You, too. Yeah, First of all, thank you to all the panelists for taking the time to speak with us today. Dr. Randall, you, I believe, used to kind of an allergy analogy. Is there any suggestion that Chs is indeed an allergic reaction. There have been a ton of theories about what is Chs. What causes it? A specific genotype for P. Cytochrome for 50. There was also at 1 point a theory that the it was being mixed with culture scene that might have been the cost. So I don't think there's any specific causes that we know for sure. Maybe i'm wrong. But maybe Dr. Holman can. It's found on that. No, you're right, based on based on what the scientific

[65:02] literature shows right now. There's there's no specific theory as to what what is causing this. even just a quick anecdote. When my kid was sick there was a nurse who saw him, who said. Well, honey, you have to start using organic stuff. You're not using organics, and which doesn't make any sense, anyway. But it it was odd. I mean everybody has a different theory. There's just nothing specific yet. and I want to share that. I did survey 330 patients who have Chs: I didn't get the survey. Ir be approved so I could never post it to a medical journal. But I am working with an emergency room position in DC. Right now to do that. We just got Irb approval to conduct a survey. and with the results that I found there was no strong commonality between all the people, except that we use cannabis. It was a all ages most people were using for longer than 8 years before they developed syndrome, but some people were using for less than a year.

[66:04] The amount consumed varied all across the board, and some people did grow their own cannabis without using any pesticides, and they still developed it. So it was kind of all over the place, with the results that I found. But I am working with a doctor to get an Irb approved. Study out into the mix so we can collect some data that we can publish into medical journals. Thank you for that you see. Sorry I I I talk, and then I realize I'm on mute. I just from my clinical experience, working with this, just wanted to say on. You know, the public health education side. What's really interesting is I, when I suggest it to my patients like this could be the cause of your problems. The and I explain, you know. Well, there's a really simple test for it. You don't have to really actually it might even save you money, You know you don't have to use canvas for a period of time, and we'll know probably the thing I've seen most, and this just might be an important thing to be aware of is that people will

[67:16] stop using, for let's call it 2 weeks, 4 weeks whatever, and then declare it's. Not that. You see, I've stopped for 2 weeks, and I still threw up all the time. So it's not that, and my understanding, at least in just my anecdotal experiences usually, and I think this was already said. They need to be off longer. But I think, in whatever public health material we distribute, that point needs to be made like. You can't stop using for 2 weeks, and really be sure you don't have this right like this, like you actually need to stop. That's the true test for a longer time, and then, at least in my patient group. The question is, well, if you can't. well like, maybe we need to have another conversation right now. That's like another diagnosis and another set of issues right. So that's I think, a key for people to understand in the educational material like

[68:07] quitting for a week, quitting for 3 weeks. That's not. That's not enough. That's not the task, and I I've seen a number of patients and parents say, oh, he stopped using, and that wasn't it i'm like Well, you might need to stop longer, to be sure, and so I think that's a point that should be highlighted for the population. Anyway. it was 6 weeks, and I've seen that a lot in the Facebook Group. The other thing is that it doesn't resolve. As Alice was saying earlier. I know my kid is tried again because he loved cannabis and wanted to be able to use it again. and he has not been able to. This comes right back. I. Now, if you have more comments, go ahead. Yeah. So I think quitting for a minimum of 3 months is what people should do just to make sure they get all the Thc. Out of their system. Quitting for a week or 2 is definitely not enough like, you know. I mentioned I had stopped using, and I threw up for 16 days straight, and so I it's. T. HD. Stays in our system longer than people realize, especially if you're consuming edibles.

[69:13] So I definitely think a 3 month recommendation should be what is recommended moving forward in the literature. But you know there isn't any core suggestion in our medical field right now, of like how long people should actually quit for people think that a week is a long time, because they're so used to using cannabis that a week feels like a long time, but in reality it is not a long enough time at all, and, like, Robin said in the Facebook group, people will suffer for quite some time. And yeah, I I totally agree with you, Dr. Stacey, that we need to to suggest to people that they quit for longer than just a couple of weeks. when, in your experience with suggest that even trace, second hand exposure might trigger it, and it's not. At least, if you're on boulder, it's not hard to get that very second hand exposure, or and you also your experience with Cbd thinking people are probably going to think. Oh, this will be fine. It's not Tac.

[70:07] That's exactly what I thought. I thought. Okay, so Tc's: what's making me sick? Let me try. Cbd: and then, yeah, unfortunately, I got sick, and there's plenty of other people who have gotten sick from Cbd: as well. So yeah. And now we're getting case reports of people getting sick from other products in the cannabis plan itself, like their case reports in the Hospice literature about people getting sick with navalone and having the same symptoms by I. 100% agree. I think the recommended length of time should be 3 months. That's what it seems to me clinically, is that people, if they say they had it 3 months to have a full wash out. and then Brian could have suggested this because he's closer to these researchers than I am. But we have some of the Us. As preeminent cannabis researchers here on the older campus.

[71:00] and it sounds like you've already jumped through the hoops. You need to jump through. Sounds like You're on the cusp of getting your study improved, but you could always approach our cannabis researchers, and I just happen to be the chair of the Irb. But i'm not influenced by so anyways. Is there any other comments, or we shall move on. And once again, as everyone has said, we really appreciate all. all of your time today, and all of your testimony and and appreciate everything you've been doing. Yeah, thank you all so much for coming and sharing what you know and look forward to some follow up. I've got some notes and that sort of thing. Thank you all very much. Really appreciate you. You're welcome and i'm. I'm happy to help wherever I Can you have my email? Just

[72:00] send me an email. Okay, and, thanks to Robin for our ranging. Thank you, Robin. And thanks for sharing your story. I know you wanted to, but I also know that's not easy. So, and I i'm really sorry to hear what it cost you. Does that stress that blows my mind. I have to be honest. Thanks very much. And or, as Dr. Randall says, as a diagnosis of exclusion, so lots of things are done to prove that that might be it so. Allison. very totally off topic. I have to have off at 4 30, so just wanted to say that before we transition to the next things. I'm really glad that this agenda was changed. I was able to be here for for that panel. Thanks for being here. Thanks. Everyone. Okay, thanks, folks.

[73:00] because now we're going to go back to do the agenda As it was, which the last thing that we didn't go to on the agenda was election of new officers. Kristen, do you? Wanna Certainly. So this is a return to agenda. Item number one for election of chair and vice chair. So some of you. I guess so. I just wanted to share from our conversation. Turn them any meeting with Staff that, just using the beverage licensing board as just a model to think with that we have to emulate everything that they do. that I believe they fold an election every year that correct me if i'm wrong, and that typically the vice chair becomes the chair again. I'm not necessarily interested in that. We don't necessarily to emulate that. But I just wanted to share that information. I'll guide

[74:08] the contours of what similar boards do as well. Brian. Why, you're not interested, Are you willing? I guess I'm just concerned that we are taking up a brand new set of responsibilities, and that I have it all their full time. It has a lot of time, commitment, and things like that as well. So i'd be happy to be continue to serve, and some capacity as vice chair. Happy to also some pick over that as well. But I just I would take myself out of the running for chair. I guess it's gonna try and articulate. Kristen. Do you want to check and see you if there are other people who would like to run you, said the the usual process that

[75:05] the alcohol board is to like a vice chair first. No, that's incorrect. They it goes to the for the chair, and then the vice chair, and I can help with that, or you can go ahead and and do that if you were like. Well, I guess, still speaking as the chair is there anyone who would like to run for the chair position, and then I will tell you upfront that i'm willing to continue. But I also don't want to. You know, Hog or Bogart the position. and i'm pretty sure. I I know from Michael that he does not want to

[76:04] one for chair. I'm don't know what happened to Evan. He last I saw him when he was riding a bicycle. It looked like one of the things that I will let you know that the Bla has done before is, they have put off until they do have a full attendance in order to make chair and vice chair. So that is an option for you as well. Yeah, that's true. I' i'm gonna ask you. I'll just like maybe you suggest maybe you can hold off and matter one for until later in the meeting to see if we pick up another member to. I don't think we're going to see Michael today. Yeah. but we may see heaven again. I agree with Kristen. Not recommendations, but advice that it'd be great to have all the numbers present for this phone.

[77:05] I agree as well. likewise. Okay. that was a Yes, Robin. there it's unanimous. Okay. So if what I'm hearing correct is that the information that I provided that you may continue, this is what you're liking to do to is to move this. Continue this to the June meeting. Yes. thank you now. Next on the agenda which I it's buried underneath. Here somewhere, was public comments, and I have noticed that Mr. Guard has been intermittently, virtually in the room, and like. look like 3 or 4 times, and not in the room right now. and my guess is he would probably like to do public comment. But

[78:04] so i'm wondering if how people would feel about. Also i'm trying still trying to get back to the agenda. I can read the agenda item if you I mean One other item is the we don't. Do we have someone we we had on the agenda about maybe talking about substance, education, awareness. But is that something where we just lost Allison? And we don't have anybody in the room to really talk about that right? I don't have that on this agenda. the agenda that's on as posted on the website. it and it says, 10 to yeah, no. Does anyone have

[79:01] Mr. Garrett's phone number? I I think i'm connected with them on linkedin. But I don't know when you get that message on them again. I know a lot. I had it. Maybe if we could get in touch with the longest somehow. I mean, can't we just continue this thing, and if he shows up you could let him or I I don't really think that it's. I mean it's necessary. you know. I think it's your history. Forward. No, man. It's up to you all, of course, but I I don't want to. We've already stalled kind of the meeting in the beginning. Let's just keep. Okay. So then, let's go to public comments for those that are certainly general public comments to the board. The public comments will be limited to 3 min per speaker again. This is number 2

[80:01] on our agenda today. Do you wish to speak as a commenter? You can use the reactions button at the bottom of your screen, or if you are using your telephone, please use Star 9. This is a call for general public comments to the Board. Do we have any general public comments? I'm, seeing no one raised at this time. Would you like me to call for general comment again? I think they had an opportunity. You do not. I just give an opportunity before you would then close the the general public comment to the Board section of the meeting. I did send a message to Alana, as I think, Stacey suggested. Let's go ahead and go on to the policy suggestion one.

[81:06] We did receive one policy suggestion form from Jeff Guard of the Guard Law firm. This was provided in your initial reading packet. My patient. the reading Pack it's page 12 or sorry. The 4 starts in page 9. Yes, the form starts at page 9, and then there is in a an accompanying memo letter from Mr. Guard. As to that it was marked as the date received, the deadline date and the date of meeting. I have a question for Staff in particular, Sandra, that

[82:05] this would obviously need to be a recommendation that we pass on to the Council for them to act on. What guidance do you have about how we should approach the task, if this board one is to consider it recommending that you replace the current marijuana with the term cannabis and the city. and I would also clarify or ask you to clarify if the State keeps using an old term, or whatever the the same term, and we switch, how does that play out? Thank you, Vice chair for the question. So I guess First and foremost I These are suggestion forms, and I think the Board would need to decide whether or not. This is the topic that they want further discussion on, and then schedule it on your agenda for a future meeting.

[83:01] And then at that point you all can decide and have consensus on whether this is something that you would want to pursue or not. If it If it turns out that the board does want to pursue. Then then there would need to be some. I guess. Decision related to work, plan items, and where this would fit in within the work plan for not only the 4, but for staff, because it would require a significant amount of work related to the ordinance amendments. and you know, If there's any thought for movement by city council to make changes related to hospitality establishments, it seems like there would be an opportunity to combine those things into one rather than taking it as a separate matter. So there's quite a few steps that need to take place, but that's kind of the pathway with respect to your questions here. I'm not prepared to answer specific questions about this today, but i'm certainly happy to do so at a future meeting.

[84:14] Thank you. How you're muted. How did the 5 Board members, I mean just in general. or is there general support for the change? It's a thumbs up from Brian? I I mean I support the idea of the change. But the thing I'm sitting here thinking is we can do all this work with the State level. It's still going to be what it is. And then we're also not aligned language wise, and so I don't know if that's problem. I guess i'm just wondering like how much we can get done, given everything and all the challenges, we basically be the first right to be tackling. This is that true?

[85:09] Or is this down in other States already, or does anyone know? So it's my i'm sorry to jump in, but if I could just suggest as a procedural matter for the Board to decide whether or not you're interested in further discussion, and then schedule app for a meeting on a meeting agenda. And then, if if there are questions that you all want us to answer, that we can help with, you can provide those in advance, so we can have those ready for you at that discussion. That's why I wanted to gauge the interest in the room. and and we can schedule it for future discussion. The future research. I guess, too. I did. We add it to the list. Sorry I don't mean to jump in. I just did. We added to the future discussions list from last I I thought last month we talked about this. Does anybody have the list of topics to consider in the future?

[86:02] I'm looking at the the the reading packet. One moment. I don't know if it's less mostly in the last months it was yeah any luck there, Kate. I'm pulling it up now. Well, she's pulling that up. Do you want to go ahead? And it was it was on the very end. It was the very bottom of the list. I don't know if you were ranking them in order of most to least important.

[87:09] I don't think they were right. They were just in order of when we talked about them. Okay. all right. Oh, you're mute. Thank you. So I would like it. Our board to make a recommendation on this right encourages to act to make a condition to recognize what interesting that we should certainly assess that staff can come prepared. I just wanted to balance the interest to sort of pursuing this important, but change with the there are other important matters before the sport as well. So I just want to make sure we we calibrate that we are picking up our regulatory duties and trainings and things like that, and moving forward. If there are other public health and safety concerns that we brought to this board that we're prioritizing this as well. But as we leave this kind of hospitality discussion, I think perhaps we might have bandwidth to take this up in future month. So I would encourage us to do so.

[88:11] Okay, Robin. Yeah. I I actually agree that it's worth a conversation. I think the priority is something we can consider when we discuss it more in depth. and if the staff is coming prepared, One question I would have for this conversation is the word cannabis. It's, I mean, I have the same concerns that Dr. Green brought up, but also cannabis. What is it? A parallel meaning to the word marijuana, or does is it? My understanding was more of an umbrella term, and might encapsulate more. But I don't know. I think that'd be worth understanding as well. So just the word itself, if we're looking at that. But I would put this a little lower on the priority list of some of the things that are on that list. but very happy to look at it. And I appreciate that the suggestion form came through because we don't want to be insensitive to anyone.

[89:13] Okay. Sandra, do you do? It sounds like there's a kind of a consensus among the people that are here now. We'd like to even even a lower priority to move forward on that. Well do we need to vote. You don't need to go, but I think it'd be important for you to provide direction to staff. As to when you want the schedule. well, how about we? As as we get towards the end of this meeting we'll talk about future topics. and then we can prioritize future topics. How does that sound?

[90:05] We got a thumbs up for a few thumbs up alright, so, Sandra, if i'm not mistaken. You're next on the agenda, and I want to ask you when you want to start and then take a break, or do you want to take a break and then start. I can do either, or whatever is the when we loosely put it that you would start. Then we'd have our break sometime around. You know more determined. Break around 5 30 it, you know, depending on how many questions there are. I I think I can work with that timeframe. If that's what you're asking. Okay? Well, do you want to go? Does that? Well, let's okay. I think I got some thumbs up. Go ahead and start. Okay, I'm just gonna need a little bit of help, I think, from

[91:00] Staff. On pulling up the presentation. Oh. i'll be right here. Are you able to see my screen. Yeah, but if it's not in preview or it's this: I got it in a. Pdf. Okay? Well, it's it's fine. I don't know. Okay, to be able. I am not in computers to me, so I couldn't tell you how to get it out of that moment. All right. Thank you so much is everybody? I guess it's Tom back. Yeah, Looks like it comes back all right. Great. So let me go ahead and get started, and.

[92:00] As you all know, this board was created to be responsible for both advisory and licensing duties. It was anticipated that initially the Board's duties be limited to an advisory role with licensing duties to be faced in over time. The face-in period was intended to begin 2 years from the day of the Board's first meeting after formation. The timing of the phasing, however, is to be determined by the Board. To recap Cloud will determine what type of licensing matters will come before the board. and which will be handled administratively by city staff. The Board will also determine the timing and scope of its licensing duties during this transition phase. and as a reminder, all licensing duties will continue to be held by the licensing manager until the Board from formally determines otherwise. So, in preparation for the eventual transition Today I will provide some additional information to this topic in terms of the legal aspects

[93:07] of conducting quasi-judicial hearings related to licensing matters. Next slide, please. It was a judicial hearing is essentially a mini trial. It requires action by the Board that adjudicates the rights of a particular person or legal entity with respect to licensing matters. Next slide, please. before you embark on conducting clause our judicial hearings on licensing matters. it is necessary for the Board to create rules of procedure that will clarify the roles and responsibilities all involved. The beverage licensing authority has a very nice complete set of rules that would be helpful to use as a guide for cloud.

[94:00] It includes rules regarding the type of evidence that can be accepted and considered. Clarifies that the rule of privilege are recognized, allows the chair to exclude incompetent or unduly repetitive evidence. and the chair, in fact, plays an important role in making determinations of competency, of testifying witnesses. the materiality, relevancy, or compensate competency of their testimony, and other evidentiary matters. However, the chairs actions may be overruled on all questions of evidence of procedure on motion, sustained by a majority vote of Board c. Ao also provides legal support in these matters, but the decision ultimately lies with the chair or the board in terms of evidentiary or procedural questions. Next slide, please.

[95:01] under the constitutional principles of due process of law, the Board is required to consider a set of facts presented at the hearing which is otherwise known as evidence, and apply the criteria and standards codified in the code to the facts presented. The concept of due process is really important, because it prevents arbitrary arbitrary decision making by a public body and provides for a fair and impartial process. Testimony must be taken in the form of a public hearing through the presentation of oral and documentary evidence, specific findings of fact and conclusions of law must be written. I'll talk more about that in a minute. There's no logging allowed as a traditional decisions, and no ex parte communications, which I will go into more detail here in the next slide. So, by way of example, State law and city code set forth legal requirements related to an application for

[96:09] a a new marijuana retail license. An applicant would have to submit an application with supporting documentation to the clerk for a preliminary determination to ensure that the application is complete before it moves forward to a hearing at the hearing the applicant presents evidence of compliance with city and State code. The Board would then consider the facts that are presented to them in the form of the materials in the packet and testimony at the hearing. and then apply the criteria set forth in the city code to determine whether a license should be issued or not. Next slide, please. So let's walk through a typical hearing in more detail.

[97:00] First, the clerk calls the matter on the agenda, and then the clerk swears in the witnesses. The clerk asks whether there are any ex parte communications to be disclosed. You'll need to disclose any communication you've had with the applicant or others related to this matter, and whether anything about that interaction would keep you from being fair and impartial. it is really important to avoid ex parte communications as much as possible in order to avoid the appearance of impropriety or any actual complex. so the motor, or vice versa. reads as falls, as it relates, to exparte communication. No exparte material or representation of any kind, or any other communication outside the hearing shall be considered by the agency or hearing officer conducting the hearing.

[98:03] unless it is fully disclosed on the hearing record, and an opportunity is given for comment at the hearing case, Law provides a lot of deference to the legislative body. In this case it was the hearing officer customary. It's customary to ask the applicant whether they have any objection to any of the X-ray communications that have been disclosed, and that so that they can preserve their right or on appeal. The applicant can then then have the opportunity to make a presentation to the board, and the Board may ask questions. You'll also have a packet of materials relevant to the completed application or consideration parties and interest. So under the liquor law there are people that have rights related to hearing participation. They are typically the applicant that adult resonance or business owners in a defined neighborhood, and any school located within 500 feet of the

[99:12] proposed establishment parties and interest can present evidence and cross-examine witnesses. Then the public hearing is opened for public comment, and the Board also has an opportunity to ask questions at that time. The applicant may also provide rebuttal evidence made in response to public remarks. And then, lastly, the public hearing is closed. and the Board goes into deliberations. This is when the Board will discuss whether to grant or deny the license based on the evidence provided by the applicant, and whether it meets the legal requirements of the code.

[100:00] The law provides a lot of deference to the Board's decision, and as long as there are reasonable facts in the record to support the decision, the court will side with the board, and not find an abuse of discretion or overturn the decision. Next slide, please. So, after deliberations, the Board must take action by either approving or denying an application. By making a motion. An affirmative vote of a majority of the members present is required to authorize any action by the Board. The motion must state the factual findings and conclusions that support the decision. and, as is in the case of liquor licensing, and I imagine that would be the same here. Written findings would be provided by staff within 30 days. That's hearing decision. and lastly, a recording of the hearing is kept by city staff, and that preserves the record for any potential appeal. Next slide, please.

[101:11] and that is the end of my presentation. Happy to take any questions. Questions. Thank you, Sandra. you know. and we question Sandra. Is there a it is any time you would to tune into one of the beverage licensing, or would we be able to watch one of these? Do they do it by zoom, or how does that go? Yes, they do. Kristen could probably tell you more about it. Kristen. You're mute apologies. It's the theme of the last 3 plus years, right? So yes, all of the meetings that they

[102:07] do since the video posting became available. You can see before that it was just like you had where the audio is available. so you can listen to and or view them for years going back. I feel like that might be helpful to the whole board that your presentation was great, Sandra going through it, but just you know, see it play out. I think it'd be very helpful. And in in the exhibit that was provided for last month from Licensing Manager Chang Garris. I do believe we provided links to some meetings for you to to listen to. If if you were one or 2, and then, of course, they always happen. The third Wednesday of every month, and you're more than welcome to tune into those as well.

[103:01] It's on page 42 of the meeting packet from last month. You had your hand up, but then you took it down. No, the discussion of I was finding examples just to my question, so I just wanted to find examples to look at. and and please feel free to reach out to me directly. If you have questions that you think about later on. I'm happy to try to help. I don't have your phone number until now. I'm sorry what we can do right. I I see that Jeff has entered the room and has this hand up 9. I did figure that he did want to do public comment. but he may have missed the discussion about Oh.

[104:02] that we've already had about the suggestion, the policy suggestion form. I'll let you folks decide. I mean, i'm i'm willing to let Jeff talk. I didn't get a chance to Let's just stay focused on the awesome that I was thinking it'd be a logical place if we were going to insert an additional public comment for the brain. One question for Sandra. I guess this is. Get back to finding examples. So good examples are what I want to orient towards, but are bad examples, too, I guess, for things called into heartache and heartburn, and things like that, like what are just like practices that one themselves to heartburn for staff in your office regulatory boards, Aren't doing their homework, or are prepared, or or just like bad examples for us to be aware.

[105:07] Yeah, thank you. I appreciate that question. I'm trying to think off the top of my head for definitely coming. Prepare. you know, paying attention to the testimony, asking them good questions for sure, you know, reading through the materials and being prepared for the hearing. I think. in addition to that. having kind of a robot, Robust discussion during the deliberations is, is critical because you you're creating a record, and it's providing background on the resting. And how you came to the conclusion on your decision. And so it shows that you consider the evidence it's in the record. And then also, whether or not you know, if there's a particular area where you're not sure whether or not

[106:05] they have met the statutory requirements. It's good to to make those connections and and have discussion that is connecting those facts, and the evidence that's being presented to the actual requirements in the code. and I can't think of anything else. I you know, I think. just kind of running up an orderly hearing where sometimes they can. you know, depending on how many folks are involved? It can get really messy, and you just want to make sure you have a lot of structure in your hearing to make sure that it that it works efficiently, and that you're providing folks with the opportunities to participate when they are supposed to, and the law allows for it. And you know, I think, just using the city attorney's office as a a resource is is helpful, like. I think that

[107:09] the boards that I've supported, the ones that have worked really well. We'll review the material ahead of time, and if they see issues they'll flag them, and then reach out to the attorney and have a conversation about it just in preparation for the actual hearing, and so that kind of thing. The preparation is super super important just to follow up on that point, because every you guys are really good kind of procedural sort of element that so we receive a reading packet. If we sort of raise issues we should communicate that with the licensing staff and cognitive attorney. And then I guess we wanna make sure that we're not having public hearings that aren't public, but like, just how is like we have been very sensitized to like only email staff and not to each other, and things like that. Thank you. I appreciate you clarifying that what I met was just you directly to Staff.

[108:12] and you wouldn't copy, like the All or definitely not. So it would just be direct communications. You don't want to have any discussions about the matters with other Board members prior to the hearing. Okay, thank you. So thanks so. And then those concerns that individual Board members raised that communicated to staff with those be synthesized in the report, or there'd be. I guess it varies on the context like a very poorly formed question. But, like what often happens if a board member races because concern about a regulatory matter to staff. Does that come up in the meeting? Does that handle via email? It's just it really depends on what it is right, but like as an example like, let's say you said, you know you reached out to me. You said Well, you know I had this communication with this applicant about a year ago, and this is what we talked about, but I don't think it's going to keep me from being fair and impartial.

[109:08] What should I do about that? And I mean, I would probably say, Look, I think it's important for you to disclose, and I don't think it's conflict, and that I would recommend that you raise it at the beginning of the hearing, when when when the clerk asked about export to communications, and then I would ask some questions and follow up to the interaction that you described. and then the applicant would have an opportunity to object if they disagreed, and thought that in some way that they created a complex. So so there'd be some preparation ahead of time. But then some advice as to how to bring it up at the meeting, but it doesn't always need to be brought up at the meeting, either. I mean it's just kind of. I think. Sometimes people just have questions about. Well, how

[110:03] you know. How How do I? How do I need to to evaluate this in order to decide whether it complies with the requirement and the code, and and so we can provide some feedback and some guidance on that. And that would just inform the way that you analyze your conclusions during the hearing. and it, you know it could come up as a question. You could share what you information that you had learned during that. Thank you. hey? You had a question. I was just gonna follow up and just say, like I, I I presume that, like anything that we can do to prepare the the attorney's office to to like, respond. If we have a question that maybe something that we're confused about about whether it's like, you know, like it conflicts with, you know the code, or whatever, so they can look into it beforehand, so that we raise it during the hearing. But

[111:02] or during the discussion, they're prepared to actually respond. Yes, that's really helpful. Yeah. And then I was gonna just ask kind of like understanding the facilitation process like Obviously, i'm gonna watch one of these right? But like you're talking about, you know the clerk, the city attorney's office, the chair, the board, the parties of interest like Obviously, that's a lot more participants than we have Currently so. Can you just speak a little bit about kind of who leads that? How do you? How do you, you know, like, how does the person ask for advice, or like in the process similar to this? You know where Tom would say, You know what's the the you know process for this, or ask questions what they're going on? That's a great question. So I I definitely think you should watch the the only hearing they have it down to a science. You know the clerk typically, you know. cheese things up and

[112:04] and and Kristen feel free to jump in, because I actually have been to a meeting. But I can say that yeah, that there are lots of different folks involved, and it is kind of a dance at the cadence right like you. You. You know you folks really shouldn't be speaking, or you know it, unless there are past 2, right? So it, and and there's it's usually the chair or the clerk, the licensing manager that does that. And you know we would provide a lot of training with the chair and the vice chair, so that they have. You know they have scripts. Right? So it's not just like it's on off the cough. They actually have scripts that they can follow, so they can stick to a very a structure. And so it's not easy to kind of bear off, but in terms of like questions that you, you know. If if something work come up, you know, and you're not sure about the procedure, you can say.

[113:10] you know I have a question for the city attorney, you know X. X. Y. Z. Right like it would have to be in in the meeting, and and then, you know you can provide guidance that way, but it's for preferred. Obviously, if you see issues flagging them ahead of time and bringing in front of the attorney so that they can. But I think through sometimes it gets complicated right? So in yeah. you you put that really well. Sandra. So thank you on that. Yeah. So as you'll notice occasionally with bla hearings that we do this the the when they refer to the clerk they refer to the staff member like for this rotation. I'm the clerk right, or it is caitlin in her or John in his rotation. And so when you, if you haven't already looked at a beverage licensing authority, hearing. We are the ones that are calling each agenda. Item out, we're the ones that are swearing in. We're the ones that are usually, and we're creating that that flow. And part of the reason for that is because we're creating a legal record.

[114:25] And so we have to literally have every single agenda item carved out into its own piece and part. And so sometimes you'll hear us trip over when we need when we're calling out an agenda. Item, it's because we're so used to doing that, and by keeping track of rather than sometimes the ebb and flow because you guys aren't in a quasi judicial fashion yet. And so that's part of what we do. And we also do like Sandra, said the swearing in. and and a lot of those different items. So it's really would be very beneficial for you to see the ebb and flow of.

[115:02] There was licensing authority, because that format will be basically what you know will be very similar then. That's because it will all become part of a legal record, and the scripts, like Sandra says the Bla has scripts. They pretty much have those memorized, and part of the reasons, because they're calling out specific legal citations sometimes. And so that's why there's those scripts in those you know are are followed, so that the right information can get provided to the license, the applicant, and then that also needs to make sure that it's followed. Exactly. So that becomes part of the record. Correct me, Sandra. If I am wrong. you get a thumbs up for that. and then sometimes there'll be questions that are directed to the city attorney. There'll be sometimes. There'll be stuff that is answered by staff, whether it be the licensing clerk or the licensing manager and things like that, and it just depends in the hearing but anything that you guys notice beforehand that we can answer beforehand or be prepared for if we have to do a little bit more research is always appreciated.

[116:16] Great? Yeah, thank you. Another question I have is about. So we we've talked a little bit about like facing it over in over time, and just talking about new licenses, and you know what, if we like. I don't this is just be throwing an idea out there just to see like what level of of engagement we can have with this. What if we said we wanted to do one per quarter. I mean. Obviously, we can't choose when a license e come up comes up. But could you say that like this would be very hard to to logistically do, but like if we wanted to do one, and then like we did one. And then the next month there was another applicant, and we had a topic that we were covering from an advisory perspective. Could we push that? Or would we just say, hey, City Staff.

[117:04] We're not going to take that one. You take that one like can. That is that even a possible like part of this to like phase it in? That's tough, because I wouldn't worry about so one you'd have to kind of write 2 different sets of rules, the procedure right, and that would be kind of hard. But but also I would. I don't know if there would be any legal basis for this, but I would worry that somebody would try to make some sort of argument that well, someone still got a hearing. They got the attention of the board, and we didn't get that kind of attention, or you know, just sort of treating different people differently. I guess I would be much more comfortable with. for with you guys choosing just a type of license. and then, you know. being able to consider, and just those licenses

[118:01] every month, or whenever they come up. we could just do dispensaries if we wanted to. Right. Yeah, I just I just curious, because I know there was some hesitation last time, and I was just curious whether what options we have right one. how many different types of licenses are there off the top? We I won't hold you to it. Sandra, do you want me to do that? Yes, please, because I just Don't know. So we have both. We have recreational cultivation. mayor, medical cultivation, those your grows. We have recreational dispensaries. We have medical wellness centers. We have a marijuana infused products. Yeah. Now my brain's going out the door. Yeah.

[119:03] that 5. That's fine. But so those are just like new licenses, right? So that there's also renewals. There's minor modifications, major modifications. Then we also have for each type of license the out there. Then we also have corporate owner and officer change. Then we could have issues with like, let's say background checks. That would mean that maybe potentially come forward. I know we do that with liquor. Yeah. And assuming for the moment that the application is complete. What's the time differential between new versus renewal renewals? Well renewals are considerably faster if we get a legally complete renewal with all inspections

[120:00] done, and the inspections are legally complete. Those are considerably faster. There's not really much to those, but the problem with those are is, that's an annual everyday thing. We have 70 current license marijuana licenses, and we have a bunch of waiting in the wings, so that those you know are going to grow, so that would literally be some months. We send out 5 marijuana renewals some months we send out 17 marijuana renewals, so that would That would be a big impact at different times back to Kate's question. What if we chose to do a certain number of categories. what? And and by categories. I mean the 5 that you listed. And then there's new versus renewals. Currently, the staff does it all right. And what if we chose to do new under certain categories.

[121:03] And so. you know we do renewals. Is that Sandra? Is that a way to move forward? Well, I mean. it probably would be that you would choose new licenses, and I don't know if it's all of them, or a certain category, and then Staff continues to do the rest. Right? Yeah. is it? Did we not decide in the last meeting that we are going to start with new applications and Staff would handle renewals? I I know that was the direction that we were going. I don't know that we there was no like motion right like I. I definitely agree that that's what I heard is that we weren't going to even touch anything beyond new.

[122:00] Do we need a motion for that? If we to do that. it was a general consensus. I: Yeah. So maybe even unanimous. So how many? I'm trying to remember what was announced in the past, either last time or 2 times ago. The approximate number of new licenses. If we looked at the past 2 or 3 years. if nothing changes which something could. But you know, just looking at the past 2 or 3 years. How many new licenses in the 5 different categories I would have to pull that up? I don't have that right at my fingertips Yeah, overall, Tom. There were 83 renewals, 33 maintenance, 6 on you and 5 transfers. But that was just. That was all license types, but so that's not broken down by you. Say 6, and we could say, you know we could say, Tom, we don't want to touch like if if hostility goes through, we could say all new licenses that are started, you know. Go through the city until we're quote unquote ready, or when we talk about it right, we could say, we'll do all current license types

[123:17] for new applications. Right? Is that is that correct? I think we talked about that last time, too. You could say that I mean that's asking the city south. Could we do that? Can we say all new license types that currently exist? So if if the City Council were to add hospitality, we wouldn't necessarily have to start that right? Yes, that's correct. I mean, that's that. That's where you guys. And that's fine. Yeah. Okay. So what decisions? I'm: just looking at the time and thinking about a break time. What decisions do we need to make right now? I don't think you need to make any decision right now if you wanted to set it, for

[124:00] you know, like for final discussion at the next meeting, or something, and then people can send out questions to staff in preparation for that, whether it's, you know, statistics related to how many licenses they approve or or process, or whatever the question might be, I I do think that you know it would be good to get some direction, and then, in any case, you know, there'll still be a quite a bit of work, and leading up to taking on that function. I think one of the biggest ones will be creating some rules of procedure which will take a little time. And so I think there, you know, there's still some time, but it would be great to get some direction from the board in terms of what they're interested in moving forward on the licensing matters. But again, it doesn't need to be a decision tonight. Well, one more preparation questions. If I out if a new application comes in. and the application is incomplete, for whatever reason you know, what could be a number of things

[125:11] making an assumption, but it's never going to do so. Anything Does the staff catch most things, and would, you know. reconcile that before it actually goes out to us absolutely. The city's licensing packet is very thorough, very robust, and very detailed, and before a an application gets presented to the Bever's licensing authority, for example. and I would assume would be similar to you. We have our duty bound to make sure that we are presenting you with a legally complete application. That's not to say that we cannot make a mistake. We try our due diligence to make sure it's not our application packets and our packets, our licensing packets before they get to a board are gone through by 2 sets of eyes.

[126:01] So. But when we and when we're looking at an application packet coming forward in a board for the beverage licensing authority. For example, we have a a deadline where a legally complete application must be submitted to us by X date in order to make it on a certain hearing into a certain hearing packet, and I would presume, based on you know, things that are going to kind of transition. Well, with your licensing activities and the beverage licensing that we know that works well. Now I would presume that some of the would transition forward, and that would be one of those things that I can legally complete. Licensing application must be submitted and gone through and done by X date in order to make it to the X date licensing packet for whatever meeting that you know. down the road for you guys so. But you you would have a legally complete application packet at hearing.

[127:02] I need to roll on. Okay. Yeah, thanks. Kristen. My, my, my, I I was just gonna make a suggestion. Obviously, we don't have to make any decisions today. I don't make any decisions, anyway. But my my suggestion was just going to be that that I mean. Think about what you all know about cannabis and what you feel the most comfortable with right. So I would say, most of us are more comfortable with retailers than we are with cultivators or manufacturers, because most people kind of know a little bit more about that experience. I'm not saying that that's true. But i'm saying, like a lot like most public facing people, that don't know the industry or work in the industry. No dispensaries, because that's more public facing it. They can understand kind of the the ebbs and flows of like buying and selling, and Id checks, and all of those kinds of things. And so my suggestion would be, Think about what you know and then think about. Okay? Well, what kind of knowledge would you need to like? Compensate for in that to be able to add to this right. So if you, if we just suggested new

[128:10] dispensary or wellness center applications, then that limits. you know it's very small. It's a very small snapshot. We may only get like 2 a year. But just think about what you know and what you like. I think that when you guys decide what you want to do like. You know. we can phase it in, but at least like making a process and getting us to a point where we feel comfortable. I just feel like right now. It it it tends to feel, I think, overwhelming, because you think you have to take all of these things, and if you just bite off one and just say we'll do this one, and then see how that feels and watch the videos of the bla like. You know that kind of stuff. I feel like we just need to make take these steps. and I feel like you know this feels very similar to the conversation that we had last week or last month. And so we just need to figure out what our like official next steps

[129:03] are, so that we're moving forward. So maybe a homework assignment is to watch a Bla. yeah ring. And and I think that's a reasonable suggestion. One of us knows a bit more about gross than other others in the virtual room. But some of us have also toured that facility to that could be an opportunity to invite numbers that have not been to the, to, to the facility or future. What's a future education, or you know future understanding just hit hint. Ethan. Yeah, that's an excellent suggestion, and i'll bring that up to Ilana as well. I mean, we can't. We can't make that happen. There's other grows in town, too, of course, but so I still am in the interest of having a break

[130:10] that some of you might also. Is there anything else to? And so I said one of our homework. can I ask a question? Can I mean we're going to talk about what's going to happen at the next meeting. But is there. I mean, I'm. Curious about how do we create rules of procedure? And what do we have control over, and what we don't in terms of that process. Do you think that maybe you guys or y'all could put in the rules of procedure for the Bla in the next packet so that we can see that, or is it too big? And we should probably just. I thought it was included in last month's packet. But maybe not. But that's easy to do just provide like an electronic link. It's it might have been in the link.

[131:01] Yeah, I don't know. I can double check that we can provide a link definitely next month. If anybody is not interested in waiting, though it bla the beverage licensing authority has a web page just like you have your cannabis, licensing and advisory page. So you're able to view the rules of procedure under their agendas and meeting items. If you don't want to wait, but we can definitely make sure we include it in the next meeting packet. I'm: Sorry. Reading packet. Well, actually no. The next meeting packet. Thanks. Hmm. Okay. I was just looking at the La site. Hmm. Okay. Now back to something I mentioned earlier.

[132:00] Jeff is in the virtual room. I was gonna give him an option earlier, and I don't know what reason he was not here when we you you came in and out of the room several times I did notice, so he made attempts to try to speak to us. I think he would like to. He had his hand up. I think he would like to speak to us. Is there anyone opposed to letting Jeff have a moment hearing no opposition? And you open up to Oh, that's what it looks like. May I ask a clarifying. Are we reopening public comment? It's a good question. I thought of that, too. Are there? Is there anyone else who wishes to have? Because there is one more person in the room that wasn't here before to other other ones had a chance earlier. But let's see, go.

[133:03] It's not in the room right there. I think we should keep it consistent. I think if we're going to open it to one, we should open it to everyone. Okay. Well, let me. Get my timer up, please. and I will reread the public comment section. Oh, the comments will be limited to 3 min per speaker. There will be a timer showed on your screen. If you are interested in presenting public comments, please use the reaction button to raise your hand. If you're calling in, please use Star 9, Mr. Guard. You did appear first, so we'll be taking your name first. followed by Lynn Siegel on deck. Let me share my screen.

[134:00] Mr. Guard. Are you unmuted? I am now. Yes, thank you. Okay. Your time starts now. Thank you very much. Kristen. Sorry I couldn't do this earlier. I hate going out of order. I know you have a lot of things to do, so I appreciate that I did have a client that came in that I needed to meet with, so I had to drop out the just the wrong time. But, as you know, I submitted the the suggestion to revise our ordinance to reflect cannabis as opposed to the term marijuana. the reason being, as it was discussed, kind of at length last time in the cloud Meeting, which gave me. The inspiration to do this is that Marijuana has always been a racially charged term that offends many people in the Hispanic community, and, generally speaking. most folks that are familiar with cannabis are aware of this controversy, and have sort of reformed there

[135:07] their their terminology. For this I I also spoke and meet with the advisor to the Governor, and they're going to work on this at the State level, as you can see. That's more of a sea change that's going to require the participation of the legislature. But there, that is actually on the agenda, not for this this this term, but next term. There was a comment made last time about. You know the fact that it's we're we're referring to marijuana based on things that are in the state laws that are referenced in the ordinance, and I put, I clarify that in my letter that we can continue to call the Colorado Marijuana code, and you know it. Things like that and anything at the State level refer to it by its term, but by making a a point to refer to cannabis rather than marijuana. We're also showing racial and cultural sensitivity over an issue that has been very significantly, racially charged for a very long time, and it's unfortunate that 12 years later, you know we're we're still living with this. But there's a lot more awareness that came

[136:14] in those 12 years. Which is why I suggested that that might be something that Council would want to take a look at. So thank you all. I don't need any more time. I have one quick question. Jeff and others may also. But are you aware of any other municipalities across the country, or let's let's just keep it in this country that have already made a change, or many. Many of the new States coming online are referring to it as cannabis rather than marijuana in their codes and in their regulations. Yes. I don't have a specific in mind that didn't do my homework on that piece of it, as you can imagine. But certainly that that awareness is being shared, as these laws are being passed, i'll, I'll get you. I can always supplement my motion to a little homework on that. See what other?

[137:07] If I can just bump it up. Michigan just did it. They were the the Michigan marijuana. We're the in the Troy Agency, and now they're the cannabis regulatory agency. So they just did it in March of last year. and they changed everything over in their codes, and they still have. They still have. They actually still have it in their their statutes. They still have the word marijuana, and they actually spell it with an H. And they they didn't change their statutes yet. But they did change all the rule, making from so like the equivalent of the And remember, Boulder was first before the State, so we could be first in making this change, and inspires change at the State level. But I know Governor Paula has this on his mind as well. Any other questions for Mr. Gar. Thank you. Oh, thank you, John

[138:00] and Lynn or Kristen. Do you need to read anything else, or can we go ahead. Lynn? Are you ready to be unmuted? I don't. How does she say how she answer? She's needed. Yeah, how could I say it? I? I just wanted, you know. Time will begin now. I just wanted to comment that I think Marijuana is ridiculous. I'm so ashamed that our culture, when we've got more important things to do starving people all over the world a huge war in Ukraine. Like all this money that needs to be spent. Instead, we're wasting staff time and city time on recreational drug. Now, as far as the use medicinally. That's for the FDA to deal with. This should not be

[139:02] legal. It should not be it an issue for the city to deal with monetarily, to take taxes in, to have anything to do with a a recreational drug. It's just revolting to me that our society has come to the level that all these people in this room are spending time on a recreational drug. That is pitiful. that is so revolting, and, believe me, i'll smoke pot plenty in my youth, and I'm. 70 years old now. But there, life's too short to do anything with anything to do with marijuana governmentally. certainly governmentally. and it's just It's just such a waste of resources.

[140:03] It's such a pitiful waste of resources for a bunch of airheads walking around town bombed out of their mind. This is just too bad that our culture has come to this level. and i'm sorry if that's your your lifestyle, you know, or pays your bills or something, but find something productive to do. because this is not it. And this is very destructive to people's time and to people's what they do with their life. It's just such a waste. It's worse than alcohol, practically. and I don't believe in alcohol, either. But you know, why do people W. What do you need to smoke pot for? What? What's the function? What's the usefulness other than medicinal? And that's a different thing entirely.

[141:05] and they're fused ultimately. So my advice is, just get rid of pot completely. To do with government anything to do with Government State level, national level. It's disgusting that we have this in our society still. and I hate to say it, but get a different job that your time is up when. oh, thank you for expressing your point of view. we will. We will take it into account all right. It is break time unless somebody did somebody have any questions for that. Okay, then, in that case, break time and let's come back at 5 43.

[142:05] That's my act. Okay. Would the chair like me to call that as an as the next agenda item. Let's see if there's any further discussion on bye first. Certainly. I can talk about some things as we talk about future meeting back at an agenda updates. Oh, and in as the item under agenda Number 6. Yeah. alright, Stacey, are you with us? We have 4. Can we ever? We did approve the right. Okay.

[143:02] I am here, Tom. I don't know if you were just calling, but I had a lord of the fly situation in my house, so I need another minute. Okay, alright. Great. What did you say? I Lord of the flies? Correct? Yes. yeah. Chair coinsman. I did go back through the annotated agenda and made sure we did hit everything that was on the agenda previously up until agenda. Item number 6. Okay. So any further discussion the quasi to additional hearings. and moving forward. I thought Kate had some very good ideas. I just want to make sure Kate knows that

[144:04] the city staff need any further suggestions or guidance. I guess I see a little no shape. I don't know what they have. Speak up, Christian. Come on! So. I have notes that you would like the bla rules of procedures link in the next. Pass it packet you have that you would like to to explore potentially just one license type. Only you discussed where to listen to the beverage licensing authority, and there was a discussion on s discussion as to heartburn examples. and I mean, I just found the I found the website, and I pulled up one of the meetings.

[145:02] I didn't start listening to it yet. But can we send that? You know some of the old meetings out before long before the meeting. I can do that, and then I would need to make that a part of the packet. Okay. I was just gonna say if you go to their website like Kristen was talking about earlier, and you go to their agendas and materials. It pulls up their like full set of documents, and if you don't go into the year. so you pull back out of the year. So you're just in the bla folder. It has the rule, the rules of procedures at the bottom there. So, Tom, I mean that that that's there, and then in terms of it's on the main website. You can watch the last one. That was on the third of April. It's on the main their main page. So I mean. I mean. Obviously, you can send it as part of the packet. But if anybody wants to do it in the next 2 weeks, then yeah, I found that pretty easily.

[146:03] Okay. Any further discussion on that. I guess I have a question about whether or not we can talk about what what the parameters of like the rules of procedures that we can like. Can we have a discussion next time about? I just. I kind of want prompts. I think that that that, like we have homework right to listen to a meeting to look at the bla rules of procedures. But is there Are there like things that we wanna like. I just I I just. We've had this discussion now twice, and we haven't gotten to the next stage, so I was like wondering whether or not the team has any advice or thoughts on prompts for like. Let's decide on a license type. Let's decide on this so new or renewals. Yes, like that's some yes or no questions, because I really I, for whatever reason we can't get there. I

[147:00] heard there is consensus on just doing news, not not renewables and not obviously great. It just goes. We're not giving them that direction. We're just. These are what we're we're just talking about what we may want to do. I'm just that's what i'm saying. We need like these black and white like. Yes, we're just doing you. Yes, we're just doing so. I just I i'm just asking the group, but not just you, Kristen. I'm talking to like the the board like, what is the board like? What prompts do you need, or to to make a decision. So can I ask a couple of clarifying questions? Maybe that would help us provide you with a little bit of information. Sandra, would that be appropriate? So. bye. Because the difference between what is entailed in a new license versus what is entailed in a renewal? And, Kate, you. You remember, through your your work with us, what those differences are, and and Ethan you're

[148:04] might be familiar with renewal with a renewal application. Our application packets can be found on both our recreational business license and our marijuana business license web page that might be a little bit overwhelming for you. So one of the things that we could potentially do is provide the application checklists as part of our packet. Now that's gonna give you a lot of information. What we do for the beverage. Licensing authority, for example, is, even though those application checklists are very, very detailed. We do a finding a fact document where we summarize a large portion of the application in about a 3 or 4 page document, and you can find those in the beverage licensing authority. hearing packets for each application. So like, for example, a beverage licensing authority, application, They'll receive the findings of fact which goes over a lot of the applicant information

[149:10] How long their least possession is any background check information that we're able to disclose. And they get that in a little bit different format because of the legal protected status of Cbi and FBI are background checks. We provide them with any operational characteristics and things of those nature, and we summarize all of that because an application packet can be very large. Then they also get a copy of, like their alcohol beverage service policies. In this case it might be a copy of, like their neighborhood flyer and their their kind of service policies, for example. And then they get a copy of their premises, diagram and any zoning documents, and then any kind of questionnaires as to how they're going to operate their business. So their their packet gets really kind of condensed into that, and you can see those in a in a beverage licensing authority, application, packet. And so we kind of really condense that down for for

[150:10] the authority to to be able to review and look over. They also then get a copy of the petitioning materials that gets circulated for a new liquor license. Now, as far as petitioning, we don't have that for a new license. for a new like dispensary, or a new cultivation, or a new manufactured and license. So we don't have those to to include for you for something like that. But we could provide you with what a packet is, as far as that as an example. So you could see what actually the beverage licensing authority receives as far as a new. and then that might help guide you in and seeing what maybe you would be receiving potentially.

[151:00] Would that help you to further that discussion along? Not me. Specifically, I think what I I was trying to get to was was, what questions. Does the Board need to answer, to get to what we want to do with this licensing part of the process like? We need to decide new versus renewal versus transfers versus modifications versus right like that's kind of. I just think that we're we're. I feel like we're stalled like we haven't we're not making decisions about where we want to go next. So I was just thinking if you could see what the beverage licensing authority looks at when they're looking at an application, and then what they pull out, you know from like a from the script to deliberate on that that might help you. Then narrow down some of those questions was what my thought process was, but obviously i'm off the mark. There, I apologize. No, you're You're okay, I I i'm you're doing great that I I think it will help, I think I think looking. I'm just saying like we're do. We gotta do the homework, but we need prompts in terms of making decisions, because I feel like we're not

[152:06] getting there, and that's not that's on city staff. I'm saying that the board we haven't been able to make a decision about what our next steps are. That's all i'm saying, I wasn't saying that you that you or the staff needs to tell us what to do. I'm just like we need to decide if we're doing new great if we're doing dispensaries, MIPS, cultivators like, what are our net, you know, like we need to move forward so like. Sure, I'm just trying to. That's what i'm trying to get at, like. What are those prompts that we I just figured, maybe, if you saw what a sample of what they looked at as far as like a new, what that might help you guide. This is what a new might look like versus you know something else. But yeah, I've I've already looked at one, and I know the marijuana ones are the cannabis ones. So I I think it would be helpful if people look through that information along with the the video of a hearing and all of that, I think it's all helpful

[153:05] and speak for others. But I think it'll be more lightning after we take a look at what the right now. The consensus is too focus on new. and I didn't even recognize the acronym you just used. So like you said manufactured infused products. Yeah. the bicycle. We're all that's a kind of helmet design that the texture rate okay from getting significantly in. Take your right. You can take your myths helmet to your Robin or Ethan or Stacy or Brian additionally. Do you have any anything else you want to say?

[154:00] I would just go and read for. So I think you're just doing the homework and watching some of these sessions will be really illuminating. I've been enough of it like we're trying to structure it. So we all it's a different one, and we can report back. It'll show me Intel, but it's probably too much structure for what we need, but I think that it feels like a black box right now, I think. Just like seem to be all I do. It be very clarifying. Is it something you know about, or you haven't been on the other side of the the client, or whatever most of my exposure is within the the cultivation environment. You know we have other individuals within the business that they handle all the the application paperwork itself. So from from my perspective it's it's it's ensuring that everything lines up with the paperwork. But what goes into that, you know, as far as the the MIPS facilities. I'm. Not as versed in, so

[155:06] I think I think. reviewing the Bla operations or proceedings will be enlightening. and and we'll go from there right. And as we noted a couple of times earlier, the specific bla packet, and hearing that was in last month meeting packet that we provided those specific links. Those were chosen because they do a broad range of license types in one hearing. So the bla her, you know. New renewal show cause violation, I mean all sorts of different types of stuff. So it it that one really encompasses the whole width and breadth and depth of of what they do. So there are 2 board numbers for not here, and I was thinking that

[156:04] I could take a responsibility for telling one of the Board members that homework needs to be in. Somebody else can take another. I can talk to my call if somebody wants to. What happened now. or maybe he's already experience it from creating the paperwork. I don't know I can check them with Evan. Okay, good. All right. Are we ready to move on to agenda. Item 6. Got to get it back up here here somewhere in one of these windows. I say the same thing at each meeting. I need another screen. Okay. Kristen: Certainly. So. Agenda. Item Number 6 is matters from the regulatory licensing office. Our first item on this is agenda topics for future cloud meetings.

[157:12] You found it in a previous packet because I didn't see it in this packet right right? Oh, I was just going to ask what's next in terms of training for taking up our regulatory duties. They're more training on the roadmap. and you look like you want to on mute. I'm not sure. I don't. Can't think of anything off the top of my head at the moment. That would require additional training. So yeah, I can't think of anything right now.

[158:00] And, Kristen, we. a new member, is appointed to the alcohol board. This sort of training do they get? So we have materials that they receive as far as scripts for each type they get a binders of the rules of procedure, different relevant memos and things like that as well, and then they will sit in on a couple of you know. We always recommend that they sit in on a hearing beforehand, and then they just kind of get walked through. We do have a couple of one on one meetings with Staff and with the Bla hearing attorney, we're in. We go through a lot of different things like that. And so there are those those types of meetings, and we do envision that there would be. you know, those types of of trainings happening

[159:09] with cloud as well. That's helping all right. You want more. That's helpful. Thank you. I'm hoping you're assuming that would be a virtual binder. Now, not a you know, Binder. and we do provide ours virtually now as well. But yeah, it used to be through ring binders in the old days. Yeah, that is alright, so, Kristen. What's it, you that somebody had pulled up the awesome that was me. Yeah, I do want to share your screen. Sure.

[160:18] Okay. So we had that great presentation today on community education, on Chs. and then it just kind of goes on from there. So we've got the health conditions in general. I don't know if you can. Half half highlight the transition a very light yellow.

[161:09] Okay, i'm seeing a a hand raised. But I can't tell problem. Thanks. One of the things that we've talked about. A lot is the Colorado School Public Health Cannabis Policy Research Group, and on April nineteenth they released their report, and that was a report mandated, mandated by HP. 2113, 17, it's on concentrates, and so the report is out, and I know many Cloud members wanted to know sort of what was in that report. We can certainly include it in the reading packet, but I know that there are folks from that group that would be willing to talk with us about what they learned, what the limitations to the research were that they they were up against, and those sorts of things. The other thing I feel like I've heard many times is a request for kind of conversation around concentrates, and both from former Member

[162:10] Alana, who wants to give a presentation, and Dr. Green, who wants to talk more about how things I have some concerns. So yeah, I think that Possibly those are the things I've heard bubbling up, but certainly open to everybody's input that's mine. Okay. So I will make a note that one of the things that we did have on the preliminary agenda for this month was the update from the substance education awareness fund that had to be pushed back, and they and our hope to to come back to us in June because of the timing of this. Okay. is that okay? Let's see. Well.

[163:03] Robin, I just tried to Google what you just said, and I could not find that publicly available. Yeah, it is. It's it's on the Colorado School Public Health website. I think the thing to look for is the Cannabis Research and Policy project. But again, Tom, I mean, if you I can send you the link that's all right now. And do you think. would you have any idea if someone is available to present? And do you think that was? That would be something that would be presented at the same time as great question. I don't know

[164:01] how extensive is it. Report? I mean my read on the report was, there's not a lot of great data. There are some there is. you know. They sort of graded the evidence for different impacts, and I think it'd be worth a 30 min presentation from somebody from that group to walk us through it, and to allow the Board members to ask questions. That would be My suggestion now is that given at the same time as Alana provides her info. I don't know that that could create some tension. I'm not sure. And and maybe, Stacey, you could comment, maybe because what you were asking about with wanting to have a conversation about concentrates last time, as I recall, was maybe a little different from learning about the different types. So I think we're asking a lot of different questions as a group. That was my read.

[165:06] Hey, you want to get money 5 lines. I I think if it's a bigger topic. that it's probably easier not to put them into the same session or meeting. If it's something we feel we could get through. you know. That's just more pragmatic, maybe. But I think if we try and do a lot of plus like whole thing on concentrates that I think that would sound like a lot or a presentation from the State. That sounds like a lot to mix to me, but I could be totally wrong, because I certainly did not be the person to ask about managing agendas and stuff like that. That's not my not my area. Ethan. Would you be? I? Would you want to go out on a limb and take a guess as to whether one of would like to present by yourself or with others. Not necessarily this

[166:05] state, whatever the comprehensive review. But we had talked about, maybe having more than one speaker. Yeah, I talked to Alana briefly about it. I know that she has some other individuals in mind that she knows would be certainly qualified to speak on concentrates. I think I saw it in the suggestions Page. That's being shared right now. You know Cinnamon bid well someone that has been mentioned in the past as far as speaking on that. But you know we can certainly follow up with her. Does. Do we know what the status is of the

[167:01] the motion to have her be able to present in front of cloud. So that is on our this section of the agenda as well. It was approved. Okay. yeah, okay. So a lot of not in February numbers there was a question whether or not it could speak to us. The City Council has address. I don't know if she has received that information yet, but I will follow up with her, and we can start planning something. Okay.

[168:00] Do you think it would be rushing things to ask her to do something next month, or or should we go ahead and ask the School Public health? I, since 1317, was just released? It might be worth moving forward in that direction. just to allow a lot a little bit of time to prepare and and get in touch with anybody else that she would want to be involved with that panel. Okay, give her a little more time. Yeah. And then, either, Robin. I don't know. Stacey. Do you have any interactions with anybody on this panel? Or Brian. Who was it that? Suggested John C. Matt, who's listed at the bottom under speakers, to come and talk about the report he's the first person listed there. I don't know John. I Somebody else must have suggested him. I think he was. He came and presented once before to us long before

[169:05] I don't know in the past 2 or 3 years. but I I did not presents his name to reach out and see if they're doing. I know they're doing comms around this, and probably would really appreciate the opportunity to come and talks and somebody to come and do something similar to what we just did with, you know. Just give us an overview walk us through the report. I didn't find it to be an earth-shattering report. I found it very interesting, and you all probably would, too. You can obviously read it on your own. But if you wanted somebody from the group to come, I don't know. Brian, if you know anybody in the group, or could maybe connect more easily with, since you're at Cu. I don't know. But yeah, happy to coordinate with staff if

[170:00] and just draw my networks and things like that. But there's no not top of my head. We did have. It looks like we had, you know, speak once before. or he spoke. He chose to spo it public comment, or something like that. I don't know if it's that something it's easily researching. I mean, his contact email is on the front page of the report. That's easy. or at least the contact name with the at least the the email address. Like, you know, there's a generic email address that could be sent to Cannabis Research at Cu. A. N. I'll see you and chat and and choos Edu. Okay. Brian, do you want to reach out, or you want me to? Or do you want staff to or staff? Do you want to? But that's staff you. Okay? With that question

[171:04] I'm: fine doing it also. Yeah, I just don't remember staff reaching out directly for speakers before Yeah, it's it's Not that we don't. I just don't remember Staff taking that on as a role. I didn't open the report. It's right there. Okay, You said. It's easily findable. It's not I it now now that I look at it, it's not his. Specifically. It's just the cannabis research at Cu. And you and it's dot Edu. It's the basic like. It's the general email address. If you wanted to contact somebody. but you could Still, I mean it, says Contact Jonathan. I don't know how to say his last name, but got you. That would be a constant Okay? Well, if I can find this email.

[172:00] Okay, so and then i'll let Kristen. No. as soon as I get a response. Hmm. sure. So we'll try for Yeah. So they have been moved to the June to make room for a a little bit more time for the panel discussion that we had today. So that's why they were moved to June. Okay. I just found his email that wasn't too hard. Okay? No, I got way. Too many windows open again. else is on the this for Item Number 6. Oh, so for item, here i'll stop sharing. So item Number 6,

[173:00] we're gonna sure. So in order to align with the beverage, specifically the beverage licensing authority and other boards and commissions we are transitioning to one packet only per month. You will be receiving that one week pro the week prior to your meeting, so you'll be receiving those on the Thursday one week prior to your meetings, and then, as far as the agenda that's gonna look a little bit different as well. Currently, your agenda has your mission statement on it. We are going to be taking the mission statement and putting it on your packet cover sheet. There will be the published agenda. which we'll have some information. You know our generalized information on it, and then there will be the a little bit different looking agenda that you will receive in your packet, and that

[174:05] can fluctuate based on what we have happened from the difference between the required deadlock publication, deadline date we have, and then the by the time that the agenda is in, and final version for what it reaches to you. And so that's gonna change a little bit about how that's looks for you. In addition to kind of what we talked a little bit about in getting you prepared for. Whenever quasi-judicial roles come about. we will start calling, having the licensing clerk call the agenda items at each hearing. So our each meeting. So when you listen to the beverage licensing authority hearings, you'll get a feel for what that's gonna sound like, and that's gonna start in June. And so all of these changes will start with your June

[175:00] cycle. Right. Does anybody have any questions on that? Probably just going to say that consolidation sounds brilliant. I love it. Thank you for all the work you guys do on these packets. It's a lot. Oh, thank you. Yeah, it's it's not gonna really change, You know the volume. You'll still be getting the same things that you get all the time. It'll just be laid out a little bit differently. and it's beginning one packet just like the like the board, the other ports and commissions to. So we're with all echo. I'm sorry we were at all. Echoed Robins Common. Thank you. Yeah. And you'll get you'll get used to us calling it. Just think of us, as you know. auctioneers behind the scenes. No.

[176:00] So Item Number 7, certainly. So, as you were told previously, this month was supposed to be where we transition to Zoom Webinar. Unfortunately, that didn't happen, and that will begin with next month. That's gonna be when we go into when the meeting dumps in, everything will become immediately on board. Everything is live. Everything is gonna be recorded. There will be no lag time. So we will just remind you that literally the minute you enter into the room everything is on recording. Everything needs to be, you know, all business save your discussion, for you know some other time. Does anybody have any questions about that? Okay. Great alright. And then moving along is your final agenda. Item matters from the chair and members of the board.

[177:07] Brian, did you want to take this up, or do you want me started or no? Oh, why you frame it up, and then I can take your hand off all right, so i'll give the the history, as I know it. as Ethan intimately knows, and I know that we both interviewed for position for a new position. I interviewed for continuing on the board, and at my interview some discussion came up with the city council person that was there. Which is Rachel, friend? She asked if we had if I had any questions. And I said. You know we're soon gonna have some hospitality recommendations. Are you gonna have a list of recommendations that are gonna come to the City Council? If you want to know anything about those before they actually come to you. And she thought that was a good idea.

[178:08] and then she consulted with Aaron Rocket, the mayor. and a I think, involved it over for a while, and then. like just before I don't remember exactly when it was Brian. But sometime in the last few weeks, just as I was going out of town. Rachel said. Can we do that meeting that you guys talked about? And I was gone? So Brian spoke with It's all there, Kristen or Sandra? Who else is there from the city? Yes. So on a Monday, April seventeenth, I met with Member friends, Mayor Rocket, I think Kristen c. Was there as well.

[179:00] and that was an opportunity for those 2 members of household to just share some feedback about the recommendations that we refer to them. and I would say there's 2 main points from that, the first being that this our set of recommendations arrived in a format or style that they were not used to like reading, and they're reading packets or digesting. And so that was one fee. That feedback that they got us was that we wanted. They wanted to see the kind of the recommendations that they that we provide for them be reported out the same way as other boys report things out to the To this. So a lukewarm response. I would characterize to like all the effort we put into sort of formatting and writing that cover letter and things like that. And then the second bit of feedback that they shared was that they already do. The city council has a full agenda for the remainder of the year. and it's not a tremendous amount of appetite for the the current Council to take up this matter. So again it would likely fall back to going on their January 2024 agenda setting kind of meeting would be the time to sort of

[180:19] revisit this for the city council to take this up so questions for either myself or Brian. Can I add some additional information? So I I wasn't at the meeting. But I just want you all to know that these are 2 council members right out of several, and so any decisions made would be made by the entire Council in terms of what moves forward or not. and I will say that there was a a request, I think, from Councilman, for

[181:07] during our scheduling exercise this morning that to to put something on a future Council meeting agenda or discussion by council, and they wanted to know. You know Basically, they have a discussion about, you know. Does Council on this move forward? When would it move forward. you know, Have an opportunity for them to ask questions about it, and so that will probably be scheduled at some point. I don't know when right now, but it will be something that Staff will take under consideration, and then set up for a future meeting in the near future, probably like this summer. And then the other thing that I wanted to add is just that I did reach out to those 2 Council members to get some more feedback in terms of

[182:08] you know the format. And what would it be helpful? And the feedback that I got was basically that it would be helpful to have a paragraph in the Executive Summary, that list of the successful motions in their final form. So there's like that motion that was superseded by another motion, you know you would only put the the final motion that would be considered so I think it's probably just. They probably found it a little bit overwhelming, and in their use more concise information being presented to them; and I think this board has an interest in showing all the different perspectives on the board, and I think that's all well good. But I think, in the interest of making sure that they receive the proper information. I think that those 2 at least would have appreciated a more concise executive summary that actually listed all of those

[183:12] clearly. And yeah, I get to to round out something that centrist product that that one of the examples they they mentioned is that they didn't understand like why motions it didn't pass for included, and things like that. So. So if we get a logic, I I stand by and that logic but that for ultimate audience they just want to see the motions that passed. I mean. So here, Sandra, you said this would be some time potentially this summer. What I said was that a Council member requested that an item be placed in a future council meeting, where that there would be discussion by council about it. So they would talk about the information that they received from Cloud. and presumably

[184:10] give Staff some direction on any work plan items. so that doesn't you know that's not asking us any further. You cut out. Say that again that that's not asking us anything further at this time. Not at this time. No. okay. But it is potential that they would. Monica like that like It's kind of like at the last minute they wanted to have us review. What like when Brian went and spoke with the 2 city constantly that could happen right. so i'm not sure. I understand your question. But here's how it played out. I think I was leaving, for I I do consulting work, and I was heading out for New York City, and I was leaving on Monday, and I get a message on Thursday or Friday that

[185:12] Oh, can you come and talk to the C. Or can you, you know, have a meeting with these 2 city council people? I couldn't. and so Brian was gracious enough to represent or not represent us to to attend as a member of the cloud. Yes, and what is your question? I'm just worried that they're gonna They're going to do the same thing again that they're going to say, oh, we need somebody from Cloud to come and talk about these, and we'll find out on. But at the last minute. Okay. I I'll just my explain that any one of the Board members can reach out to a Council member and have a conversation about this right? There's nothing that prevents anybody from doing that.

[186:03] And secondly, I would say that if there is something that does get scheduled in the near future staff would do their best to give this for a heads up about that, and of course we would ask as to whether or not they wanted participation from this particular board, and in what way? What would help them? What kind of information additional information would help them during that discussion? But you know it's it's not going to be a situation where the Board will be invited to come. Speak. bye. Okay. I. It is what it is. So so you know we'll do our best to give you as much heads up. but I mean just because they reached out to one or 2 of you to get some more information that could happen to anybody. And I think they're they're just trying to learn more about it. I don't think

[187:10] I would not view that as a negative. Okay. So anybody have any questions about that? Is it trying to think of how to phrase this? But I know there's word out there about our recommendations out in the public. There's this discussions going on. It's like from some industry people about some of our recommendations, and questioning it as to why we decided that we decided what we decided. So word is out.

[188:01] I saw a very good article by Shay Castle Boulder beat. She covered it. She covered it well. She covered all aspects. Really good article. I can. I can give it to Kristen to put in a reading packet if you haven't seen it already. It's really well done. I've not seen that one. I can do that just as a heads up the deadline for packet is the fifteenth. Okay. but just like the other thing, it should be easy to find that article on your own. Yeah. So okay. any other questions. Otherwise we can finish early motion to return unless somebody else has other items of information. There's one stay here till 7.

[189:00] Absolutely. Brian Bush is to a chair any second on that i'll second it. Alright. Well, thank you. All. 6, 31. Thank you. Yeah, thank you, Sam. Have a good month. I.