June 10, 2024 — Police Oversight Panel Regular Meeting

Transcript

Captions from City of Boulder YouTube recording.

[0:00] All members this any communication? Just do it in public. Don't type things on the zoom chat. Just speak them out loud. Anything for the group should be set out loud for the record. and we have a co-host, if needed. So welcome to the June meeting of the City of Boulder police oversight panel. We acknowledge the Arapaho youth and Cheyenne tribes, the traditional custodians on the land of which the police oversight panel and Border Police Department operate and pay our respects to the elders, past and present. like to welcome the public and any press to the meeting and welcome to our panel members. Thank you everyone for being here and acknowledging anything that was in the moment that may have been challenging for you. Lynn, I do see your hand. However, we do have a QA. Function during the meeting, so we will answer a small questions in the Qa. And then, if there are bigger things

[1:03] up for the panel. You can please save those for the public comment which happened in the second half of our meeting. If you wish to submit a complaint. You can go to our website, Boulder, Colorado, Gov forge, slash services, forge, slash police oversight, or you could send them directly to our panel, email which is police oversight panel at Boulder, Colorado, Gov. These meetings are public and are posted to our website. And with that we I also like to acknowledge the agreements that we made during our retreat the agreements we made for ourselves on our conduct, and hopefully we'll be able to post those or just a snapshot of those but just the way we treat ourselves, the intentions. And you know the reasons for all of us being here.

[2:06] And with that I just want to jump into the agenda. and the 1st thing on that is the approval of the minutes from the May meeting. You have a motion to approve those. I'll move Victor. Nice. Approve the minutes. I can. Second. Okay, thank you. The next item on our agenda is an invitation to communicate through proper channels. So there may be times even for the co-chairs. but if you get a request or something regarding panel business, let me send you a text message. If they really want to get a hold of the panel and get our attention. The email address I just mentioned is the best way to do that right. So please use your official city emails for panel business.

[3:14] You know. maybe someone important wants to get a hold of us and they send you a text. And it seems super important, you know. Just encourage them to use official channels to get a hold of us that goes for city council members and other people in other places. But using those official channels, you know, is the best way. So I just wanted to emphasize that for for everyone. The next item is, we have a request from city counsel. Can you share some light on that sherry? Yeah. So in the study, a recent study session on Public safety, there was a request for the panel and Ipm, so the civilian oversight aspect to provide some updates. So there is not any sort of actual date. But the expectation is that sometime, probably in late 2024, we'll get on the schedule to

[4:21] provide some updates and information status for city council. I don't know if it's going to be at a regular council meeting, or if it's going to be at one of their study sessions. but keep you posted. and one of the things to know is this gets done pretty far in advance, so it won't be some situation where we only have a few days lead time before we before we go before council. Thank you. I know that's something we had mentioned before. And so, you know, setting this up. So we do have

[5:01] a chance to present, but also to answer questions is also one of those ideas behind that as well. So any questions or comments before we go to the committee updates. Alright, so. I have too many screens open. So community and engagement and Communications committee. We didn't have a meeting last week. And so it's been postponed. We don't really have anything to report at this point.

[6:00] Thank you, and your next meeting is. I was trying to look for it. I haven't found it. So, Lenna, maybe you can help me. We haven't rescheduled it. There's a few people who are gonna be out on and off, and so I'll I will send out a reschedule hopefully soon. so yeah, please be on the lookout for that. Okay, thank you so much. And then our next committee update is from the legacy committee. Legacy. Liza and I met on the we met on the 23.rd We're looking through the data that was provided by the Bpd. And I'll hand it over to lease. Yeah, thanks. Chico, so, as Chico mentioned, we did like a sort of initial exploratory analysis of the data that we got from Dpd, it was really interesting. We are working on getting it into a sort of dashboard tool that you all will be able to use to explore it a bit as well.

[7:14] We were gonna share that tonight. But we're working on some sort of technical issues with getting into city infrastructure to allow us to share it. So just know that next month at our meeting we will plan to take you through the dashboard and then share out a link for you all to explore it on your own as well. That's the only update from us, for now. I just wanna say that I think Lizzie is also being a little modest because she put the data in a format that yeah, Chico, smiling. She put it in this format that allowed her to do like real time manipulations of the data. And I think both Chico and I were quite impressed. So. We were we. We were in all great job. Please. Well, thank you. That's nice to hear.

[8:03] Thank you, Liz. Yes, that is exciting. We have always wanted to sink our teeth into some large chunks of of data. And so, just being able to make that digestible for the whole panel. and you have some expertise that we all bring. So it's good to see that coming in. So thank you. So next we have an update from Farrah. Farrah. Thank you for joining us again. And she did send out some slides. And, Farrah. he's going to update us on the Bylaw working group. Thank you. Hi, everybody good to see you. Hopefully, you did receive my email on Friday. It was just a very brief update but I do have a few slides to go over to give you a little bit more substantive detail on the work that we have been doing on the Bylaw subcommittee. So then, if you could help me out with that.

[9:01] Sure thing, give me one second. Alright. We can go to the next slide. Just so for the publics. The obviously the panel knows, has been involved. But for the public. Our subcommittee has been working through updating. The bylaws includes the coaches solid, Ed Diaz, Abigail, Frankie, and myself. We've had 3 meetings so far, and we've confirmed our schedule. And we'll continue to meet weekly through through the end of the summer. So we have, I think, through the end of August we have our meeting scheduled next slide, please. And so we primarily started with giving some structure to what we think the bylaw should look like that was kind of first, st and then the second was really

[10:01] updating the obvious changes in the in the current bylaw, so that they are consistent and compliant with the new ordinance. So, for example, you know, terms are different. We added. We updated the section about roles and responsibilities of the panel. we're going working through training. We added. Obviously the purpose statement. And just it was just if you go through the bylaws. You'll see some of obviously for me it's a lot easier because I I know the ordinance really really well, so it was pretty easy for me to pinpoint the areas that were inconsistent and essentially what I did was like a side by side. Comparison and analysis of the current ordinance with the bylaws, and made sure that the language in the proposed bylaws is consistent with the ordinance. We don't want any inconsistencies, so that that was pretty much what we started out 1st and foremost to do, cause that. It's it's pretty easy. And it was quick for me to do

[11:06] the areas that we are working through right now. We have some draft language, but it's not. it's it's it's nowhere close to being final. So our our approach has been a lot of conversation and brainstorming and writing down our thoughts. And then, as we get further down in our process, we're, gonna you know, roll up our sleeves and go more in the weeds of what we think the content should be. So essentially, we are talking about the panel's rules, duties, and responsibilities. A lot of that was taken from the ordinance. There are different documents that talk about cochairs responsibilities. So we have the current current bylaws. That was slightly different than what's but not inconsistent with with what's in the ordinance. And then we have been looking at other examples of in other cities, their bylaws, and then also other boards and commissions within the city of Boulder Boulder bylaws, just so that there was some consistency in terms of the responsibilities of co-chairs.

[12:12] Order of business. This is something that we're probably gonna talk about a lot. And we're also going to ask, signify for your well, obviously, we're gonna ask for your input a lot of it. But I'm gonna flag this one specifically for the panel members. Because we want to delineate the order of business for your meeting. So, for example, today, you started out with your landing acknowledgement, your community agreements. and you talked about approval of the minutes. So one thing that I want to put kind of in everybody's front to know was to think about. you know, the appropriate place for public comment. I've been in this conversation a lot. There are pros and cons with the different options, and it fundamentally gets resolved with what's a best fit for the city? So there are some cities that have public comment right in the beginning. There are some cities that have public comment at the end. And so this is something I just want to flag for the panel to get for you to think about, and I would want your opinion about it. Just so that you, you know, just give it some thought in terms of the order of business. And also efficacy of your meetings.

[13:20] I. The next thing that we talked about, and this is actually solid. Dad's recommendation was to put some language there about. I put in your executive session, but I changed it in the draft and called it close session, because that's how you refer to refer to it. So to be consistent with how you refer to when you go into your private sessions. I change it in the draft to close session, and so I drafted some language about your procedures, and how we do that. It's a very preliminary we have to tweak it a little bit. But I thought it was a very good suggestion from Solar that we put something very clear because you are guys are consistently go. You know, every meeting you're going to be going into close session. And so it needs to be clear in your bylaws what the parameters are of that. And so we added that section. This is a section that is not currently in your in your bylaw. So it's it's it's an important addition.

[14:08] Conflicts of interest. We added some language. About that. And then we received some suggestions from Lizzie that I kept and wanted to make sure that you know we incorporated them. And so we are working through her suggestions. But we included a section in the draft that is basically titled official statements of the of of the panel. So it essentially delineates kind of that process and the expectations of you know, when we're making statements on behalf of the panel, when we're making statements on behalf of ourselves and what that means, and kind of the scope and the parameters around those. So those are the main kind of high level things we are working through again. Nothing definitive. We're really just kind of putting everything out on paper like that. We're talking that we're talking about and talking through. And then we're going to go line by line and make sure that we fine tune in the language reflects kind of what we're recommending and what we think is appropriate.

[15:08] Next slide, please. So some things that we still have yet to discuss, and this ties into some of our public meetings that we're going to be having is our the committee structure. I don't know how many of you knew that there was, and it's supposed to be an Education Committee. I was kind of surprised to see that in in the bylaws and so we wanna talk through kind of the purpose of the committees, the need for them. And if there is a way to maybe streamline them a little bit. But obviously this is, I put this 1 1st because this is something. Again, I want to flag in addition to the order of business, of something that we really are going to need your input on, and what you're what you're thinking or what you would. You would like to see in terms of. And the committee structure how they're set up and what you think actually makes the most sense for the panel.

[16:00] There's a section in the current bylaws. That's called Complaints and Policy Review. We are working that through. We're on the fence a little bit on whether or not it is appropriate in the bylaws. But we haven't gotten there yet. We really wanted to focus on the the stuff that I talked about in the last slide first.st but this the reason why I'm flagging it is that this is a conversation that we know is coming and then just we did a general format for the bylaws, but we might tweak it a little bit. Because one of the things that we all had the same impression was that the bylaws were a little bit difficult to follow. And so we wanted to make sure that the flow, and the format and the order of what we were discussing in the bylaws make sense, and that it's easy it should be a document that like, if someone's in the middle of a meeting and you have a question you should be able to turn to. Oh, I think that's article so and so you know what I mean, and be able to turn to it pretty quickly. And so we want to make sure it has that ease with it. So that's another thing that we're going to be talking through. And then what we decided to do at the very end. Because, again, this is very similar to the

[17:08] how we drafted and recommended the ordinance. This is a recipe very specific to the panel, very specific to boulder. So we're waiting at the very end to kind of do a compare and contrast with other other bylaws from other cities, and then also bylaws from city of boulder wars and commissions, kind of more of like a side by side comparison. So we're waiting to do that last. Once we have a bit more meat on the bones of our working draft next slide, please. and so just flagging this. Obviously the panel already knows, but flagging this for the public, that when we 1st came on and we're talking about how we were going to do this process. It was important to the panel that we had a public component to it. And so those meetings have been scheduled. We have 3 they will be posted. They'll be open to the public. It'll be a very similar.

[18:06] maybe even more brief presentation like this, and then more of an open conversation to get feedback from panel members and the public on them. And so I wanted to make sure that the public was aware of the dates ahead of time. So our next one is our 1st one is June 25, th then July 30, th then August 20, th all from 6 to 7, via zoom. And then obviously, it'll be posted on the panels website so that people can access the general public can access the link. And then, just obviously for awareness and potentially a reminder to the panel, you all have, calendar invites with the zoom link in there that Selena sent maybe last week or well, I guess today's Monday. So wasn't really this like probably last week? So just as a reminder that you do have those calendar invites and I will generally probably give you a heads up on what what we plan to talk about like I did this Friday or last Friday. So that, you know, if you can make it, it would be super helpful.

[19:04] Next slide. So that's it. So just questions. Again, a brief update. But Abigail and and solid have been amazing to work with and really thoughtful in their recommendations. They've been reading everything that I send them. Which is always helpful. And so yeah, I'm I'm very confident we are all very confident that we will get this done, and our goal is to have the panel vote on it at the September meeting. We're we're really confident about that. I mean, obviously we have the October meeting, but we're really aiming for to wrap it up and have a good draft to you in August, so that it could be voted on, and this will be a little bit different, because you will be familiar with the content as we get closer. And so we do think. September a September vote is is realistic. so I will pause now, and happy to answer

[20:02] any questions. The only thing I will. I want to defer to the Co. Chair if you want to hold off on some of the things that I flagged to talk about on the 25, th or if there's a few minutes to talk about it now. I'll defer to Victor on how, how he wants to handle that. But other than that, I'll answer any questions. Yeah, we do have some time. If folks have a question or 2. Alright. Okay. Well, if no questions. No problem. But if you think of something, please, just like Lizzie, send us an email. I obviously always read it and want your feedback. But the 2 things I again I would like to flag for you. To give some thought is the order of business, and particularly if you have a specific opinion about where public comment should be on the agenda beginning, middle end. You know, whatever I would really like your perspective on that. And then number 2 is how you feel about the setup with committees right now. Do you feel they're valuable, efficient like, do you have recommendations of doing it a little bit different? Because our goal is

[21:21] with the bylaws. Obviously you have much more flexibility to make edits as needed right? This is not like the ordinance, but my goal is hopefully to give you such a great document that you won't need to amend it as frequently. You know what I mean. So the committees is a big piece of that and so if you have suggestions about committees, order of business and obviously anything else. Please send them. Because, you know, we're reading them. And we're definitely taking them into consideration as part of the reason why we included. The official statements of the panel in the draft is primarily based on the recommendation we got from Lizzie. So we are listening, and we do want your feedback.

[22:04] So thank you. Everyone. Thank you. Thank you, Farrah, and and thank you, Solidon Abigail, for meeting every week, and you know, continuing to work on this and I think June 25th was the 1st date with a public meeting, so save the date for that as well. So the next item on our agenda is where we go into a closed session to discuss our upcoming case reviews, and since there is sensitive information that we may discuss, we want to keep that information confidential. We won't make any any decisions in this closed session, but just a place for us to discuss. It should take 20 min. So for the public or those attending hopefully, we are back by 7, 20

[23:01] or before then. and so I know we need to make a vote for this. So someone want to make a motion, or do we just vote. Motion to have a closed session. I second it with wrong paper. But just okay. So. Sorry I didn't hear that. There's just a motion that was seconded to go to a closed session. so it would just take a moment to set up the breakout. Okay, we said, 20 min. Right? Yes.

[24:43] Okay? Bye.

[25:22] Alright! Welcome back! We did forget to vote to approve the minutes from May. So do we have a motion to approve. The minutes for me. Is there any corrections needed before we do that? You then. No sorry I was already voting so. Never mind. Okay, so do we have a vote to approve the the minutes by show of hands.

[26:00] Okay. so now is the time that we take a short bio break So we're going to take a break, and then we'll come back at 7, 25, or 7, 30, all right. Welcome back. So before we do the case review voting. I'm just going to remind everyone of the current status of case reviews. and where we all stand.

[27:07] So you can see your name. The cases you volunteered for some of these case abuse have already happened. Some have not. Just think about maintaining a balance for the next few months and see if there's opportunity there. So I just want to share that again for the full group so that everyone can see where we're at before we add on new things to our plate. Okay? So the next item is the case, reviews assignment for the new cases. But 1st we have to vote on the cases to

[28:01] select. Is that correct? So I'm just going to read out the name of the case. The charges and then need some assistance on taking the vote. The 1st case, MI. 2, 0 2, 4, zash. 0, 2, 7. The allegations are a rule, 3. Violation. a rule, 5. Violation, a rule, 6. Violation for officer, one. and then for officer 2. We have a rule, 5. Violation. Who would like to vote to take this case, by show of real hands or virtual hands. See 2 votes for votes, for No. Was 6 votes for? No.

[29:00] The next case, MI. 2, 0 2, 4, 0 2, 8. This one contains a rule 5. A rule one, and a rule, 6. Violation for officer one. and also a rule for violation as well. Votes to take 0 2 8 looks like that's affirmative on everyone. The next case, MI. 2, 0 2 4 dot 0 2 9, officer. One has one. Rule 5. Allegation rule 5 is police authority and public trust votes to take 0 2, 9 goes for yes

[30:00] and votes for no bill. And Abigail. okay, looks like the majority has it on that case. The next one m. 2, 0 2, 4, 0 3 0. There's a rule 5, allegation for officer one votes to take that case and votes for no. The next case, MI. 2, 0 2, 4, dash 0 3, 2. This one contains multiple allegations of rule 6. Violations

[31:02] rule 2, and rule 3. Violations against unknown officer. Am I off, or did we skip? 3? One. That was administratively closed. So you're right on. So MI. 2, 0, 2, 4, 0 3, 2 allegations against unknown officer. Those who vote to review this case. my show of hands and votes for no. And the last case, MI. 2, 0 2, 4, 0 3, 4, officer one has 2 rule, one, violations

[32:00] votes to review this case. Pachico votes for. No. Is there any other business that we need to do with case reviews. I mean, just, I think you know, assigning having people volunteer or be volunteered. I wasn't keeping track of the ones we voted to approve. So if you could help me on that. I have 2829, and 30. 2829, and 30. So MI. 2, 0, 2, 4, 0 2, 8.

[33:00] Do we have 3 volunteers for that case? Luna Chico in Abigail. Thank you. The next case, MI. 2, 0 2, 4, dot 0 2 9. Do you have 3 volunteers for that case? You got those sherry. I've got Milan, Lizzy and Jason. Nope! Jason's shaking his head. No, sorry. And Victor and Luna. Lizzie. Oh. okay. Luna and Victor apologies. Thank you for the correction. And then, mi, 2, 0, 2, 4 dot 0 3 0 volunteers. For that case.

[34:01] Kelly. Jason, Chico Bill. you, Lynn. I love their idea of there being 4 people signing up for some, so that if someone doesn't work in the schedule we can still proceed. You're okay. Thank you, everyone so our next agenda item is our next chief of police meeting, which is on June 24.th Was that a virtual one or in person. I think that one's in person, right or. That is my understanding. Obviously, if the panel wants to make it virtual, they certainly can. That's why this is on there as as an agenda item is so that people can

[35:01] you know, make it the format that they want it to. I mean with the understanding that we, you know, have to talk with Redfern again about making sure that his answers are condensed. And then Not being afraid to like. interrupt if they seem like they're getting to the purpose. I personally prefer in person. Are there any other folks you may want there outside of the chief. I think. Isn't sterling always. There soup. Sometimes there may be a question about swap, and they want a Swat officer, or we need to talk to the detectives, because we're not sure about this

[36:02] in previous meetings the homeless outreach team came to explain what the hot team does, for example. So there's a couple of ideas. Do we have enough questions and content for the meeting? Does everyone have like 5 burning questions that will just fill up this time, and you know, get it going, or is it just gonna be? Are you running out of topics or things that you want to talk about that you haven't had time for. I don't think running out of topics has ever been a challenge. I am wondering if if there's someone who's a good point person for the reimagined policing plan, or if the chief is. is a good resource for that.

[37:11] I could also send an email. If that's helpful. I think the cheap would be the the best person for that. Thank you, Sterling. I just uploaded a chief of police meeting questions into the June folder. So if we wanna add some questions in there? I guess those are. I guess that's my questions for you guys like, if we are wanting to submit questions beforehand. I guess to get further into the conversation about QA. Like public comment.

[38:04] more of the logistics. So then, we can prepare ourselves and I. So I can post them on the website and let the public know beforehand. So I guess just to open up the floor. how do we feel about QA. Or probably comment at this meeting on a regular. We don't have it but just thought I'd just thought I'd ask. Me, Lynn, let's see your hand. Thank you. I think in general I'm all for public comments. and potential. Q. And A would be great. Members of the public don't get to Ask the right questions to achieve to the interim chief. Another comment I would like to make just in general. Is that it? It's still interim, Chief Redfern, and not Chief Redfern. So I would like to make a comment that we keep that title until we have a permanent chief.

[39:15] But otherwise yes, I would be all for Q&A with limited time. I would like to second, but I think opening it up in some capacity, would be useful. I'm pretty sure the last time we had one of these, nobody from the public showed up. I can't remember if I'm confusing last time with it there before. I think we have had at least one member of the public

[40:00] having a lot of Q&A. Yeah, I can see. QA. Being, maybe something that we could leave open throughout the whole meeting like we do for this all panel meeting public meeting. We would just have to set up. maybe like a maybe the 1st hour. Just be. And this is, you know, kind of more what I'm getting into the logistics like if we do have public comment, how much time are you giving? Is there sign up required cause? I know that Council does have like, you know, are you? Are we. I guess. preparing ourselves to potentially have. you know, 10 members of the public, and how like 2 min each. That's 20 min. So I guess just kind of realistically looking at it. I think QA. Would be a great thing. And then, if we have time at the end, maybe about 30 min, or maybe less, if if possible, to then just open it up to the public and answer some Q. And a questions that

[41:01] I know that may potentially I wouldn't be, I wouldn't be able to answer. But just on some thoughts on that. Be Lynn, us your hand! I think it's it. We're back to the question of, you know our our meetings like done after 2 h or do we accept the fact that this is an opportunity for community members to have 2 min with the interim chief and ask questions, and then that can go on. If a lot of PE people show up, and I don't know, I mean I I would like that to be open and for us to discuss. But maybe it's not a good place here to discuss that. Maybe we can take it on email. If that's more efficient. I I don't want to lose too much time talking logistics, but I think it's important to consider. Thank you. Just my personal views. These meetings with the chief are our time to figure out stuff that we are unsure about, or things that we've seen.

[42:07] and we can really ask some just very specific or detailed questions. or we can ask them, why are the cops and whole foods right? So we can stay with the frivolous stuff, or we can get down to like some really nitty, gritty, tough questions that we only can get from that inside view. we've had 3 months between the meetings, and so. like part of our job is to talk to the public like, what do your neighbors want to ask, what do people that you represent want to ask? Right? So I think sort of opening up the floodgates like we are the floodgates like? Haven't you been asking people telling them what you do like? I talk to people, and they tell me what they want the chief to hear like I don't have to tap them on the shoulder like we're the ones representing the public. So we should already be having these conversations months and months between these meetings. So when we have this opportunity. I think that we could just fill up the list with things because we've talked to people right? We don't sit in isolation, and then pop out and say, Oh, now we're gonna talk to the Chief so hopefully, there's this steady engagement between these meetings.

[43:12] So that's just my view on that. and then I see your hand. I'm I'm gonna push back a little bit, Victor. But last time I had at least 5 more questions that were also coming from. You know, my neighbors and community members, and I didn't have time to ask them. And so I'd like to have the community able be able to. And I don't know the entire communities of boulders personally, and I I would like them to have the opportunity to to ask their own questions. And and knowing that I will never have enough time personally to ask all the questions that I have just. And Aaron. Quite. Eden.

[44:00] The chief also has other opportunities for the public to access him. So we're not the gatekeepers for that. Sterling. I see your hand. Yeah, I was just gonna say, if you guys are already concerned about the chiefs, like long winded distance answers. And the time in general, I think, having a public comment in this form isn't going to be the best to address that concern, or for that concern. and I agree, Victor, that you know. I think a lot of people see you guys as representatives of the community. So I think you guys can take questions from the community and try to ask them of Chief. And the last point is like a lot of people might have questions that the chief won't have answers to at the time, so it'll be better just like the format from the past for the he has access to some of the questions, so we can give you guys thoughtful answers as opposed to. Yeah, I'll I'll look it up or I'll ask. I'll ask somebody else later, cause he just won't know the answers to a lot of the quick. I could see you might not know the answers to some of the questions that the community might ask.

[45:02] Thank you. And Bill, I see your name. Yeah, I was just gonna say, I agree with you, Victor, and I wouldn't be for extending our meeting longer than the 2 HI think if there's community folks, they have other ways to access the chief. And after watching the city council meeting. I have a lot of questions about the stops, data and the use of force data. And you know, it seemed like we filled the whole question time at our last meeting, even without public comment, so I wouldn't want that to get in the way of us getting our questions answered either. Thank you, Bill. So it looks like we have some time to finalize this right? so hopefully, we can continue this over email sherry.

[46:00] I was actually wondering if you guys just want to vote whether to do some a form of coming form of public comment or not. I just don't want to get into, you know. Open records, act violations with or open meetings, act violations with too much email conversation. So the vote is, do you want to allow public comments in our next chief of police meeting. Question if we e vote shoot, I think I might be frozen. Can you guys hear me? We can hear you. I can hear you. or we could. Go ahead. You're muted, Lizzie. It. I think we just have a bad connection. Can you guys hear me now? She's. I think she's freezing a little bit.

[47:02] I'm gonna switch to my phone. I'll be right back. Serving. Did you have another. Yeah. Do you think it'd be possible to gather questions during like there from the QA. That we can thing be presented to the next meeting. You know, I know I know, 3 months away, but that way people can just type in their questions. The community can type in their questions, and then they can be asked by panel members during the next meeting. I like that idea. So things don't get lost. I know Lizzie's trying to.

[48:25] Okay, does he? You can try your question again. After you unmute. Alright. Can you guys hear me? No. I may have missed some discussion that answered this question, but if we go ahead and vote now, and we say we do want to allow public comment. If it becomes an issue with 20 people showing up for comment, I assume we can vote at a future meeting to change that decision. Is that correct? Like we can adjust any time right? Yeah. Okay. I mean, that's why this is a topic on the agenda, so that the this opportunity to meet with the chief is how the panel as a whole, envisions it.

[49:08] Great. And the last 2 meetings. We've had the public there, but not of it. Not given time for public comment. Okay. thanks. So just by a show. Any more questions, Luna. Yeah, real quick. I know that. in other places there's like a sign up. So if if people want to have like public comment or questions. I don't know if we have a mechanism for that, but then we understand, like how many people. Anything. Will be showing up. Selena. Do you know anything about that? I do. Yeah. I would have to look more into the the logistics of that mechanism. I know that council uses that. And so it's just about asking and learning that platform and

[50:04] just moving forward with that, I think, would be probably the easier thing. yeah. So I can. That makes more work for you. But yeah. No worries. loves. And the chief meetings are 2 h long, correct. That's what they happen. Okay. So the vote would we like to add a public comment section to our next chief of police meeting? And this public comment section could be anywhere from 15 to 30 min by show of hands. Who would like to do that for our next meeting? That's 4 4. Yes. votes for no.

[51:05] and that's for for now we do have some members not present. So maybe they can chime in via email. Is that possible? Abigail. Not in the bylaws yet. I would like to have their opinion. Yeah. sorry, Abigail. I don't think it would be a violation of the law. but we don't have anything in our bylaws against it. If we do want every panel member to ban. Really.

[52:00] Okay, well, we're stuck at a 4 4 vote. And we need to get some input from other panel members. So. We'll just continue this behind the scenes. Okay, we can. I can send out an email, too. Okay to them. Or I don't know if you'd rather. Yeah, I'll I'll put it on the list. And then our Independent Monitor report is next. Let me share my screen? Can everyone see the screen. Yes. great. Okay? Well, the June 2,024 boulder police oversight panel meeting. Independent police monitors report.

[53:07] So the case file review data for May 2,024. I think most of you are not surprised about this. but we did 3 case reviews last month. So it's great to be doing that again, and I would also like to share that every new member of the panel participated in case reviews. So it's great to be like back on that They were done at the end of the month, so they are still all waiting for Vpd dispositions on those 3 and as of before. We just voted to review 3 more cases, we have 13 cases that are will be up for review as they move through the system. and cases that have been completed. Since May 1, st 2,024.

[54:06] I can't see my screen, because all of your lovely faces are in front of it. Just give me a little mute. Okay, mi, 2, 0 2, 3, dash 0 1, 8 2 officers responded to a call from a mother. She alleged that her juvenile son had threatened her via text message and she did not want her son in their home. The officers attempted to speak with the juvenile, he ignored their instructions to stop and brush past them, to enter the home. The officers grabbed him to prevent him from entering the home, and all 3 landed on the top platform of the stairs, and the mother complained about the use of force used on a juvenile sun. The allegations against Officer one and 2 were rule one. Compliance with values, rules and general orders. General order 2, 25. Use of force that they use force against the juvenile for both officers. I recommended that the allegation be exonerated, and the Department agreed.

[55:19] For MI. 2, 0, 2, 3, dash 0 2 8 officer, one during a camp cleanup operation, encountered the complainant who refused to pack up her campsite or provide her name sergeant Juan arrived to assist, and the complainant continued to refuse to cooperate. When they reached to grab her she struggled against their attempts to control her, and through Sergeant One to the ground, and fled. She returned, and was apprehended by additional officers, and while handcuffing her officer, 2 referred to her as Bro. And sergeant. One used a mail pronoun while instructing officers. The complainant objected and shouted that she had been misgendered, and several officers on scene use male pronouns in reference to the complainant when they spoke amongst themselves.

[56:11] So regarding the allegations for officer, one rule, one allegation, violation of general order 1 0, 1 unbiased policing gender identity display transphobia. During his interaction with the complainant I recommended that that allegation be exonerated, and the department agreed. A rule. 6, th allegation props to one use of force. General order 2, 25 used force on the complainant, and I also recommended that that allegation be exonerated, and the Department agreed for Officer 2. Rule 4. Respect for others misgendered the complainant officer. 2. That was exonerated. Based on my recommendation and the Department's determinations.

[57:00] For sergeant. One allegation of rule, one compliance with values, rules and general orders. General order, 101 unbiased policing, gender identity display transphobia. During this interaction with the complainant, I recommended that allegation be exonerated, and that department agreed with that for the sergeant, one's rule for allegation, respect for other misgendered the complainant. I recommend that that allegation be not sustained, and the department agreed with that recommendation. and for rule 6. Use of force for the sergeant. General order to 25 use of force, positioned his arm or hand around the complainant snack, and my recommendation was not sustained, and the Department determined that it was an exonerated finding for Rule 6. Use of force, general order 225 use force and or threaten the complainant with a taser. I recommended an exonerated finding, and the department agreed with that

[58:02] and I, when I 1st classified this case, and then again, at the closure of the case, I recommended that the Department look into providing additional training and support for their officers regarding gender identity, and preferred pronoun usage. The Department agreed with that recommendation, and the interim chief recent, recently shared with me potential training module created with out boulder to address this topic with the department members for Case MI. 2, 0 2, 4, dash 0 2, 0 officer. One was assigned to investigate allegations that a man sent threatening email messages to a car repair shop officer. One contacted the complainant who admitted sending the emails, and during their conversation the complainant voice concerns about the service he received from the repair shop

[59:00] officer wanted, formed the complainant that his complaints against the repair shop were civil in nature, and eventually arrested the complainant for menacing and harassment. The complainant alleged that officer, one did not conduct a sufficient investigation. The allegation against officer one was a rule, one compliance with values, rules, and general orders failed to conduct a sufficient investigation, and that was My recommendation was that that be founded in accordance with general order 1, 21, section 8, and the Department agreed with that recommendation. and for MI. 2, 0 2, 4, dash 0 2, 3, A person submitted an anonymous web complaint, alleging that officer. One ignored their request for his business card. Body worn camera captured the interaction, and no request for a business card is heard. and that allegation against the officer was a rule, one. Compliance with values, rules, and general orders and general order. 200 discretion, arrest, standards, and enforcement action failed to provide a business card upon request.

[60:08] My recommendation was that keys be closed, unfounded in accordance with general Order 121, section 8, and the Department agreed with that. Regarding the case statistics for the month of May I classified 8 cases. 7 of those were classified as missed contact allegations. 0 serious misconduct one community inquiry, 0 community feedback, 0 conflict, conflict, facilitation process. I observed 5 interviews. There were 0 critical incidents, right? Requiring a seam response. and I determined 4 cases to be deemed throw in complete. and the police department closed 4 cases during that time period.

[61:02] So our open docket, as of June 5, th there are 37 cases 32 of those are classified, and 5 of those still await classification as of June 5, th and given our 2,023 cases that are still open, there are 3 of them at this point, and they are all in chain of command. Review, and MI. 2, 0, 2, 3, 0. Dash 3, or dash 0, 3, 4, and dash 0 3 5 will also be coming to the panel when chain of command is complete. The update I have regarding the December fatal officer involved shooting is now. I have been given a hard drive that includes all of the all of the evidence for that case. But currently the Force Review panel has not been

[62:05] scheduled. I anticipate that it's going to happen sometime in July. but I will keep the panel apprised of any developments and timelines for that to review for the month of May. The community engagement. That I did was 1st of all Victor King set up a meeting with the Boulder County public defenders. So we went and we spoke with them, gave them some information about the work that we do, and answered questions. And I thought it. I thought it went reasonably well. It was great to hear the questions that the members from the Public Defender community had also on May 18, th I Co. Hosted a public safety listening session with the center for people with disabilities. And that was,

[63:07] really amazing event. Where? Members from the fire department and police department were able to hear concerns and begin to workshop some ideas, to make sure that we are putting in place the the policies and training and options, so that we reduce hopefully eliminate communication barriers and really can address the the concerns of that very vulnerable population. So since then we've had some follow up meetings also. And it it felt like the beginning of a really good relationship that's starting from a place of how can we do this as best as we can. So I received a lot of words of appreciation from that community. So that was really that that that was the highlight of my month, and and

[64:03] I mentioned this to some of you. But I went to the police department myself to do roll call briefing trainings to patrol officers to help them better understand the the civilian oversight system? And answer questions that they had. So that also was I thought very helpful for everyone involved. and that's my report from. or the official reports. I also wanted to share that Nicole Annual Conference is open for registration. So

[65:05] I move that I think we can send up to 2 panel members. So, and it is on the agenda. The dates will be October 13th through the 17, th and that is going to be held in Tucson. So if you're interested or you want to learn more, reach out to myself. And Malen and Solen Dog went last year. who went the year before. I think Hadassah was one person. Yup pados one before we'll need a new co-chair, right? So if you're interested in being a co-chair, then going to the conference may help or not help but you know we have enough to send 2 folks there, so check your calendars, and let us know if not, I know some folks may want to go again. So.

[66:07] I. We do appreciate that taking an entire week out of month schedule is a really serious lift and commitment. so let let us know, though, and I've gone probably 4 or 5 times. So I can. I can definitely answer questions. And it's it's a ways away. So we we have time, but I wanted it to be on people's radars and also reminder that we are in budget season. And I I think it's due at the end of the week. So panel requests for budget. Please get them to me as soon as possible.

[67:01] Can I ask a question about that? Is there a like a document that's organized? Or do we need to start that process? Has there been any sort of like gathering around a list of requests. No. I mean, there's like things we do for community engagement. We've hired ferret to do consulting. There's food for the events, like some of those things are included. And then there's also like. Well, what do we want to do in the next year, you know, thinking about have an event where a hundred people could show up versus 10 people. Sometimes we have to rent venues, or sometimes we use county spaces. but it's really just a broad nothing that's been written down on paper before. Thanks.

[68:04] So as big right. Ask for 30,000, and you'll get 15 right. Don't ask for 15, and then always go big. Are there any items that folks want to talk about, that they didn't get a chance to submit. for they want to add to the agenda. Now is a time for that anything that's come up during the meeting. You, Lynn. I have a quick question. I I think we if you ever said as or it was brought up somewhere, somehow. response to what was said at the last. Was it the last City council with the police report? with the chief of police and some of the comments. That were made at that time.

[69:03] I would like to hear. Maybe maybe this is the right place to respond, maybe to some of the comments and expectations from the panel that were voiced that didn't seem to be in alignment with what the panel is for I'm just curious about how people reacted to that. Does anybody have anything to say? I'll just okay. Yeah. Go ahead, Lizzie. I was just gonna say, maybe you wanna kick us off. I'd love to hear what what you're. Yeah, I I'm just I. There are 2 things that I would like to address is one

[70:01] when we have 2 co-chairs. So it'd be good for the city council to remember their 2 co-chairs. Victor, and solid. Add and 2 I I'm having a little bit of an issue, and maybe it's a misunderstanding on my part. But what Why would the? It's a question that I have for all of us is why should the panel Contact City Council members? Is that a role? Or it seems to me I sorry I saw I watched this a while ago. So it my memory is a little fuzzy, but it seems to me that it was asked that the city council, the police of a side panel, panel, report back or contact or talk to the city council members. And I'm

[71:00] a little troubled by that, because I think that we're independent from the city Council since we're under Noria now, so I would like to have clarity on what we are supposed to do. With that. Does that make sense when I'm asking. Yes, it does, and I think I heard Victor say at the beginning of the meeting, that all communication should go through the co-chair. so would that include if city Council as well, Victor, from your perspective like, I don't think it's wrong for the City Council to want to talk to the co-chairs. I just wanted to talk to them as a member. But that was more about like city Council members, texting panel members to to get our attention versus like sending us an email, you know, to get our attention.

[72:03] But the meeting that she was talking about, you know we didn't know was taking place. No one had. Brother. Asked us any questions. We were just an agenda item sort of out of the blue. Connor. And in in general the idea that City Council is interested in the work that you're doing and that they want to hear more about the work that the the panel is doing and the way that the panel experiences. you know the work. I I think it's a good opportunity. Especially since we're do. We're back doing case reviews. So by the time sometime later this year that we're we're before them, I think we'll have a lot better foundation of the sort of cases that are coming in. More recently.

[73:00] Hi. Would that be your role to like? Give Victor a heads up? That City Council is putting this panel on the agenda like? Who who would alert us to it. Oh, I would I would, and like, I said. It's something that I expected once, because the agendas are done or the the city Council agendas are done far in advance that I expected. We'll have like 2 months, if not more, lead time. I think my feeling was that it was asked for us to make some. you know, to be available to the city Council, and I'm just feeling like we're volunteers mostly. And so the amount of time that we can spend is should be focused on case reviews and being community oriented rather than city council. That's that's my take on that, considering the amount of work that we're doing already.

[74:09] But I might be wrong. I mean, then that's why I'm opening this conversation, because I wanna I wanna hear what everybody is thinking, too. and their understanding. I may have misunderstood. Oh, I I think you're you're good. We all have, you know, entitled to our opinions. In the past the Pamela has never really come to city council to sit in front of them or give reports. So it's almost like. A 9. Now. Correcting misinformation, myth busting like they had. They have no idea what we've been doing. You know how hard it's been the only meetings they have with us have been like very contentious, or they're just not the best right. So. if we. Are able to talk to the city council, Nurias, in that same audience he sits right to the right of them, and so we'd also be able to reach her as well.

[75:04] And I don't think it's an obligation, but it's just part of the transparency and just letting them know you know what's going on? Versus seeing them once a year, or seeing them, never having some sort of frequency for that. Thank you, Victor. There are any other questions or responses on this one. Did you have something sherry, or anyone else? Oh, I was just looking to see if I thought Chico might be about to say something, but I couldn't tell if I was reading that correctly. No, no, no, I'm good. The next item on our agenda is a public comment. I do see, we have one member of the public here.

[76:02] Samina, can you help me out So. So when you're ready. I'm ready. Okay. do you have the timer? I'm sorry. And then, just just do a review about the public comment like rules and stuff like that. Also, every member of the public will get 2 min to so comment. and then the panel members, if they choose to, can also give a response. Okay, Lynn, you are unmuted. Yeah, I'm not very impressed with what's going on with the pop and and with the police in Boulder in general, going way back to John Bennet. Ramsey, like this is just. in my view, a corrupted police community. And I wanna cite a number of things. I'm really still upset about my stuff being ripped off by city employees in the Municipal Building. When I turned my

[77:13] head 4 feet from my property, and someone came and took it within 15 seconds of when I removed my laptop from the bag like this is outrageous, that one I didn't get to talk to the person I didn't want to prosecute him. I wanted to talk to him. I was not allowed to. I was never allowed to, and that should never be the case we need community policing in this community and restorative justice. Have you ever heard of the Maoris MAOR. I. From New Zealand? That's what we need here in Boulder. That is the kind of policing that really works. Well. Now, another situation, Alatore.

[78:00] I understand from Michael Daugherty, from the newspaper, the guy that saw the woman with the woman had again didn't report it to the front desk. The police came to escort her out. but the front desk didn't know she had a gun. Why doesn't our community know that when you're in a freaking Rec center you can't have a gun in there, and if you see a gun. You report it. That is a huge problem for your community sherry and everyone that they don't even feel compelled to report that they saw a freaking gun outrageous. That woman never had a chance. Of course she was justifiably killed. After that. The point is, she was humiliated into erupting. and if that's what the police do that is not de-escalation, that's provocation. I'm not saying that she was a great, upstanding citizen. I'm saying that this situation was wrong, very, very wrong, just as wrong as when I was thrown out of the courtroom for staring at Sam Carter after he shot the elk 3 blocks from me on Mapleton Hill.

[79:17] That's a problem. Seconds, remaining. There. There's a lot of problems with policing in Boulder. I can't tell you how many, and I sure don't hear about them in these short little narratives you do about a case review. You need to really discuss it. Bring it out. Bring the community in. Have a back and forth. you know I'm sorry that I have to be, you know, obnoxious about this, but I don't see anything happening after years. and then, when something happens to me. Oh, my God! I couldn't even talk to the person, and I didn't want to prosecute them, and they didn't get prosecuted anyway. Thank you when your your time is up. Would anyone like to respond or comment?

[80:08] I'll just say I do hear you, Lynn, and I appreciate. You know your presence, and you know your passion. Well, thank you. Everyone for attending this meeting. This brings our June meeting to a close. remember to check your emails for some things otherwise. Thank you so much and have a great rest of your night. I never heard.