October 17, 2023 — Planning Board Regular Meeting

Transcript

[MM:SS] timestamps correspond to the YouTube recording.

[0:05] And I think we'll be kicking it off with. Our rules of engagement and civility from the Vivian unless I'm skipping over a step. Yeah, I can just jump right into them. I was in a meeting recently where they were called community agreements which I thought were a nice. Oh, I like that. Yeah, it's nice. Yeah. Okay. So thank you, Lisa, and thanks everyone from the public for joining us today. We appreciate Sorry, go ahead. Thanks for pulling up the slides. So thanks for attending tonight's planning board meeting. My name is Vivian and my role in planning board meetings is to facilitate public engagement, engagement portions of these meetings. And we have these community agreements or rules in place to help us achieve a balance between transparency with community members and security that minimizes disruptions.

[1:00] So we'll start once I've done reading these with open comments from community members who are with us tonight. And then there is one public hearing later in today's agenda. We want our community to know that the city is really striving into a vision that was co-created by city staff and community members for productive, meaningful and inclusive civic conversations and that these agreements were worked out with community to develop expectations for meetings. And the vision is really designed to promote free conversation and dialogue while also recognizing we want to make sure everybody is who's participating feels safe and welcome. And we also want to make sure we're making space for different viewpoints in our meetings because we believe it leads to more informed decision making. Next slide, please. And we have a lot of information on our website about the productive atmospheres vision. And I'm going to just focus in on part of that right now. That's relevant for this meeting. There are a number of rules of decorum and the Boulder revised code and we have some general guidelines that are advisory in nature to share with all of our Meeting participants.

[2:04] First, we ask that all remarks and testimony raised tonight be related to city business. We will not allow any participant to make threats or use any other forms of intimidation against any person in this session. Obsenities racial epithets another speech and behavior that disrupts the meeting or otherwise makes it impossible for us to continue in the moment is prohibited. And we do also ask that participants identify themselves by The name they are commonly known by. Next slide. We're in the Zoom Webinar format right now, which allows for participants from the public to speak at designated times and we will not be turning on video for community members because of security concerns in this platform. So we cannot unmute participants without the full name. If you're full name is not currently. Please go ahead and and change it and if you're not sure you can send it to me and if you're not sure you can send it to me in the Q&A and I can change. I'm happy to change it for you. So no pre existing list to speak so you can raise your virtual hand and you can do that by.

[3:07] Looking for the horizontal menu at the bottom of the screen with 3 clickable items and you can click on the hand icon and we will note to call on you. If you have an expanded menu, you can also get to the raise hand icon by clicking on reactions and looks like we don't have any participants joining us by phone so I will skip over. Those instructions for now. So that brings me to the end of this. Of the rules and this is the part of the meeting where we can take open comment from the public so if you Wish to speak about something not on the agenda. This would be the time to do so. You can raise your virtual hand and I can call on you and Each person would have 3 min to share their comments. So please go ahead and Raise your hand. Don't see any hands so far. Give people a few more seconds.

[4:05] Lynn Siegel would like to, to speak. So, Devon, you got the timer ready. Please go ahead, Lynn. You've 3 min. Yay, 3. This may seem unrelated to you, but it is not. I had something stolen by City of Boulder employees. In the municipal building? Right almost in front of my eyes 3 feet from me and that's a concern for me because for one this employee has a death after the 30 or $40,000. You know, investigation on the quote unquote theft. 12 page investigation. The the guy apparently has a designation of homeless unknown.

[5:00] They don't know if he's homeless or not. Any worse for the city could very well be. He's, you know, can't afford to be here. And so he's taking stuff. And now, I'm not alleging that he actually did, but from reading this 12 page report and corroborating all the evidence. To me, it seems like something's going on here. Something's not. Not clear in the investigation, not well done. So I'm very concerned. At the planning board because this further describes the wealth inequality that you have to deal with in your decisions every single day. The budget of the city, the efficiency of the city, the ability of the city to pay for the homeless that are here, the developers not paying, the developers getting subsidies. So I'm talking to you about this. So don't complain. Please, that this is unrelated.

[6:04] It is intimately related. Because this is how the funds operate through the city. You know, we're playing 2 something 1 million or 2 to 6 million to clean up after the homeless here. And that's getting worse and worse constantly. And now I'm having, you know, I've got this crime if it is truly a crime, was done by the homeless people. I wanted to go in interview them under the the underpass thereby the it was taken in the municipal building by some by a guy that works in the library and on the auspices that he was getting it for his supervisor that she needed help. Well, she doesn't corroborate that. She says she didn't get it from him. She might have gotten it from Chrissy. But Chrissy, whoever that is, never got witnessed, never got interviewed. I didn't get interviewed. I have not been allowed to even see the surveillance. Footage. It's really quite remarkable that this is the way our police operations work.

[7:10] I'm meeting with Alistair tomorrow. I'm meeting with Alistair tomorrow from September, the seventh concerns at City Council on from September seventh concerns at City Council on placing. But you have an intimate responsibility Done. Vivian, you are muted. Sorry about that. No other hands raised over to you, Lisa. Thank you very much, Vivian. All right. Well, looking over the agenda and please correct me if I'm wrong, staff or full members of playing board, but I don't think we have any minutes to approve today. So next step as I understand it should be flowing into call-ups. The first item, the first call up is a flood plane development permit at 4,700 to rapid who avenue this is Excel energy doing some utility improvements.

[8:03] Would any fellow member of the board like to ask questions or like to call that item up? I am not seeing hands. Feel free to. Use the raise hand function or just unmute yourself at any point. It seems like I'm not seeing you. I'll proceed to the next call. This is a standard wetland permit. Boulder County Street Reconstruction and a culvert replacement at 90 fifth street to lookout road. Any questions for staff or call ups for that item? Seeing none, I'll proceed. The next call is a flood plain development permit. For Mile Kane Creek at Nineteenth Street Channel improvements and a bridge. Questions for staff or does to call up? All right, and then our final call up, call up item D. As a use for view to operate a tavern and restaurant concept at 9 21 Pearl Street.

[9:00] My understanding is that this was formerly Oscar Blues for anyone who's kind of trying to pick sure that is and didn't get the chance to look at it. And this is a routine call up for restaurant in that use and apparently I asked staff and there hasn't been any comment from residents or anyone else around there just to provide all the context I got. But anyone like to ask questions of staff? Or call up that item. Alright, I think that concludes our call ups. Which means our next item is the sole. Public hearing item and use for view for this evening and I will hand it over to staff. Hey, sorry, I'm just getting up. The parkland pulled up. Thanks, Alison.

[10:20] No. Alright, thanks for being with me and everyone see this? Cool. Thanks for the thumbs up. Alright, good evening everyone. The presentation before you tonight is a use review to allow a specialized instruction facility use in an existing office park on Irisav and an RH 4 zone. And tonight's presentation, I will briefly cover the information that was provided to you in the staff memo, including the purpose of the use review and process, the existing site conditions and surrounding context, a description of the proposal and a key issue for discussion. Specialized instruction facility use is allowed in an RH 4 zone but must first be approved through a user view.

[11:06] Those applications are reviewed by staff to evaluate the proposal and confirm of the proposed use. We'll leave the conditions set for in the user view criteria. One staff has reviewed the impacts the recommendation is made to planning board. In this case because the application is for non-residential use within a residential zone, a decision is made by planning board at a public hearing. The project completed the necessary nose requirements for the code written notice was sent to the property owners within 600 feet and assigned posting was also posted on the property. Staff did receive a comment from one neighbor who expressed a concern about the additional use in the traffic impacts it might have on the surrounding area that feedback was provided to the applicant and who provided a response and is also included in the demo packet.

[12:03] The site is point 8 8 acres and is located at the southwest corner of Diagonal Highway and Foothills Parkway. The subject site is 38 25 iris and is located within the Iris office park. And is made up of 1 3 story office building. The office shares a circus level. Perking lot in a parking garage with. 2 other lots that were approved as part of the original PVD, including 3,700, and 75. Iris to the Northwest, which is another. Office structure and 37 35 iris. Which is a daycare. The site is zoned RH 4, which allows for high density residential uses. Particularly attached residential and it's usually apartment buildings and also for complementary uses. The majority of the site is surrounded by RH 4 zoning with a portion there to the east. It's own public includes the, the ramp in the highways there.

[13:03] And while the site is surrounded by the high density residential zoning district, the surrounding uses are buried with. Commercial uses and residential the uses immediately to the south include touch residential units and other mixed density residential developments. And then further west on the northern side of Iris there are some other commercial uses including the diagonal per dental offices and the diagonal park building. And that brings us to the proposed project. Staff received a business license for the Boulder massage therapy institute to operate at the Iris office park. Well, staff is reviewing the history of the site to verify that the uses compliant with the underlying zoning as we do for business license review. We noted that the, the site is subject to a PD that allows personal services and office uses. The PD did not include a specialized instruction facility used and so the current zoning regulations apply, therefore the applicant is applying for a use review to allow the inclusion of a specialized instruction facility within.

[14:13] The existing office park in an RH 4 zone. And written on the slide is the definition of a specialized instruction facility. Boulder massage therapy suit overlaps with them typically be considered personal services use but is considered the specialized instruction facility use because it offers courses and curriculums in order for students to obtain a license to practice massage therapy. The proposed use will offer clinical hours from 8 a. M. To 10 PM. For students to offer massage services to the public at a discounted rate. Those late office hours will actually kind of offset the typical 9 to 5 h of this other office uses which will help alleviate parking and traffic concerns. The institute has one full time employee with 10 contracted employees. Depending on the class size and depending on the time of day.

[15:09] And there are no proposed changes to the fiscal building form, as the tenant will utilize an existing office space. And therefore function much like an office. And last the site has a hundred 57 parking spaces where a hundred 54 are required for the 3 other lots that showed that working. The existing office park was approved through a beauty and special review in 1,971 for for lot office development including the shared parking the original approval included just at general offices which in our current code definitions would include personal services and office uses. In 1983 the puny was amended to expand the building envelope and build a parking structure that is currently existing. And then finally in 1933 site review combined 2 buildings into one larger building which is now 38 25 iris.

[16:07] A lot line elimination was also approved to combine those 2 lots. And the key issue for discussion is, is the proposal consistent with the use review criteria set forth in section 9 215. Staff finds out the proposal is consistent with the applicable use for new criteria, specifically the use is compatible with the character of the area as the site is an existing office park and that is not proposed to be changed. There are several other commercial and non-residential uses along Iris to the to the west that was shown in that previous slide. And additionally, the use provides a service for convenience to the nearby community. To those residents in the zone districts at a discount rate and the inclusion of the specialized instruction facility will youize existing parking and tenant spaces and their goal will not create any additional adverse impacts.

[17:04] In fact, the offset hours means that traffic and parking will not all consolidate. At peak hours, but will be more spread out throughout the day to help alleviate that traffic and parking demand. And that wraps up my presentation and I'll open up for any questions. Thank you. ML, I see your hand up and the mark. I'll have you go next. Thank you, Lisa. And thank you, Ellison. Brief but very complete little presentation. I have. A question actually 2 questions regarding the rationale. So my understanding is that the rationale is that this provides a direct service or convenience.

[18:01] To or reduces adverse impact to the surrounding uses in neighborhoods. So we didn't really hear on the neighbors. As to whether it's providing a direct service or convenience so am i to understand that That conclusion was strictly based on the applicant's statement. I think in value in evaluating the proposal that was brought in that it essentially does function like a personal services use which is included in the original approval for the PD and the only difference is that they offer classes and curriculums to obtain a license. So that was kind of the biggest factor we did here from the, one neighbor and the applicant provided a parking study to kind of show how many available parking spaces are throughout the day and there's plenty of parking and so.

[19:01] As far as you know the traffic impacts you know we have with the offset hours there are visitors that come throughout the site. Oh, hour, until 10 PM. But the space is still gonna function like an office. Yeah. And so that office is already existing. All those tenants are already existing. So that was kinda the analysis that went behind that. Okay, so I. The fact that it provides a service, direct service of convenience was kind of a conclusion. It will. Oh, sorry. Based on everything, all the circumstances surrounding it. That's fine. So the other thing that was mentioned in your presentation was that the discount, there was a discount rate being provided. Is that only for the neighborhood? Or is that for anybody? I believe that is for everyone. I'm not, I think the applicant is on the call and they can maybe speak more to that. Okay, yeah, I'm just trying to figure out if there is a you know, how direct a service or convenience for the existing neighborhood.

[20:10] This is providing so that's why I'm asking these very specific questions. Thank you so much for answering. Okay. Thank you, Amel. Mark, you're up. Thank you. When we when staff determines that a use review is required Was it ever an option? In this case for staff to make a determination and then put it on a call-up list. Rather than as as an agenda item or is that not an option? It wasn't an option in this case because it's an on residential use in a residential zone even though it's existing in the. In existing office work, but that was their only option.

[21:01] And then in reviewing. Briefly, I make no claim to really delving into it at the moment. The use review criteria in, in Title 9. I couldn't find any. Transportation demand management requirements. 4 approval of a use for approval of a use. Am I missing something or is it is it actually not there isn't really anything there for a use review. Yeah, I'd say that there isn't specific to, you know, like maybe like a site review. Criteria that includes TDMs or other access and mobility criteria both for use review and look at it. As the as like a larger whole like the impacts. Would probably be tied into that as far as the traffic is concerned, but nothing specific like a TDM requirement.

[22:03] Okay, great. Thank you. I have no other questions. Laura, go ahead. Thank you. Just a quick follow on to Emily's questions. In the use review criteria where it says, you know, for the rationale, the use provides a direct service or convenience to the neighborhood. Does that is that intended to be an exclusive benefit to the neighborhood or can it be a wider benefit that also benefits the neighborhood? Second question. I'm not as familiar with kind of the history of the writing of the used to be criteria. I don't know Charles you have. Any thoughts on that one? That's an interesting question. I don't think they're mutually exclusive. You know, certainly the criteria talks specifically about benefit to the neighborhood, but if there's collateral benefit that, you know, spills over them. You know, I think that's probably fine too. If it's more of a regional benefit.

[23:02] Thank you. I don't have any other questions. Alright, does anyone else have any further questions for staff? Okay, I think we don't have a formal presentation from the applicant, but they're perhaps going to briefly speak. If I'm not putting them on the spot and I'm correct about that. So this is the opportunity for the applicant to weigh in if they would like to. Do you know Allison if they're planning and hoping to speak I see a They're there. It looks like they're hands up. They may need to be approved. Hi. Hi. Can you hear me okay? Yeah, I'm Melinda. There she is. No. Okay. Yes, yes, go ahead. Okay, wonderful. Well, thank you so much, Allison, and thank you board for your time. I'm Melinda Bessie and I'm the owner of Boulder Message Therapy Institute.

[24:05] So we're 625 h massage therapy licensure program. And we are approved by the state of Colorado. We're actually the only massage school in Boulder County. So I just wanted just touch briefly on who we are, what we're doing. We have some of the best faculty in the industry, really rich curriculum. And so far, 100% pass rate on the national exam. So I'm very passionate about all of the talented and professional and holistic practitioners that we are bringing into Boulder and and really kind of regionally and everywhere. But we are also grateful to be able to provide the economic or economical massage massages for the local community. So, 91 h of the 625 h licensure program the students are seeing the general public.

[25:07] And we have such a thriving community. I would say mostly local to where we are at, but coming from all areas of Boulder County to come and see us. But they're all super grateful over there. We have, it's only $42 for a 55 min massage. So we have those 2 elements. So it's the 625 h education as well as thriving clinic as well. Great, thank you so much, Melinda. Mark, do you have a question for Applicate? Go ahead. I do. Thanks. And I've just been a over for a really, really long time. And, my very first massage when I arrived in Boulder was from a student at the Boulder School massage therapy. My question is, is do you I know that the boulder school massage therapy has been through many changes and disappeared and every so forth.

[26:10] Do you have a link to that or is this just an entirely different school? Is there a historical? Chain back to the school Not exactly however we did open right after they closed and the founder graduated from the Boulder College of massage therapy as well as a founder graduated from the Boulder College of Massage Therapy as well as a lot of our faculty, from the Boulder College of Massage Therapy, as well as a lot of our faculty or long time faculty from that school. So that's the only relation. Yeah. Thank you. Ml, did you have a question? I do have a question. I have to actually. So in your narrative that you mentioned, Yeah, the clinical portion of the program takes place on weekends and varies based on student availability and community member preferences. So I'm curious is this community member. Are these neighbors? Are these clients who are these community members that help establish the?

[27:10] The times for the clinic. Establish the times. I'm looking at your application narrative. It says the clinical portion of the program takes place on weekdays and varies based on student availability and community member preferences. Oh. So I'm curious just to who these are these community members. Are the neighbors, queried as to what works for them or is this community the people who are actually taking the cut? Who are these community members that are referenced? Just that what we find works well with people, it just tends to take place, in the evenings after they have had a long work day. So most of our clinics actually take place. In the evenings we do offer daytime because that does work better for some of our community members and this is just after doing it for a while and just noticing what what people like and what times are working for people.

[28:08] And we also because our program is part-time, a lot of our students work full-time. So we like to have different options for them, you know, to do their clinic in the evenings or people that you know have different work hours. We also offer that kind of daytime shift as well. Yes. Okay, so it sounds like you community members are your students and their clients. Okay, second question. I think I also read in the narrative. That the Boulder Massage Therapy Institute relocated to this address. Correct. From gun barrel, from park drive to this address in 2,020. So does that mean you've been operating out of compliance for 3 years or there's kind of a I'm confused. I'm not sure because we've always applied for a business license and been up to date on our business license.

[29:05] So. I'm not sure I could answer that question. Oh. Allison, is there a? So they've had a active business license since 2,020 but this particular application triggered a use for you. This was the switch triggered by it was, It was the license renewal. And I think this would, if I can't, I again, I could look up and see when the exact. Communication happened. But sometimes it takes a little bit of time to get for applicants to get these from you, prepared, but I think someone else joined and might be able to speak to the timeline a little bit better. Hi, this is Charlie Roth and Mike Davidson, we're counsel for, Boulder Massage Therapy Institute. This came to blur massage thereby inst's attention when they renewed their business license. They thought they were in compliance with zoning at the time, but once this was turned into the city of Boulder, they realized that specialty this use was not allowed.

[30:15] So we started this use review, application and have been moving forward and this is. When we've turned it in. Wow, okay, so it's taken since 2020. I'm sorry. We are a long process. Thank you for, thank you for answering your questions. Thank you very much. Any other questions from members of the board? Yes, Laura, go ahead. Hi, just another follow up on Ml's line of questioning. So. When did your business license expire? Was it a multi-year business license or do you have to get a renewal every year? Allison, do you have that detail? Yeah, Alison, Charlotte, sorry. Hmm. I don't. Oh, okay.

[31:08] I believe it's yearly, but there was some communications with the city of older kind of understanding the PED. We believed under the PD that the uses were permitted and there was some communications about if it was permitted the code had changed and the Noban clean sure had changed so we were uncertain if it had if it was allowed and permitted and once we got to that conclusion that it was not permitted under the code, that's when we begun the process of the land use review. Okay, thank you very much. And I believe Alison could chime in too, but I think that that specialized instruction facility, the new code, provision that just kind of came about recently. Yeah, it was previously, I think it was an adult education facility name. So that tweaked. A little bit. But I think the, the renewal process is something that I think is sort of new to the sales tax team.

[32:03] They do auto renewals and I think that's when, this was caught during, that process. And I think that happens every. Few years I'd have to check with the sales tax team. Okay, thank you. I appreciate that. Any other questions from members of the board for the applicant? Alright, I believe our next step is public comment, to this item specifically. Unless again, someone corrects me. And if so, Vivian, could I? Hand the mic back over to you turn that portion. Sure. So this would be the time for members of the public to raise your virtual hands. We can call on you. Okay, Lynn, please go ahead. You have 3 min to speak to this item. Please go ahead. Looks pretty good to me, but, the use review should include jobs, housing, balance requirement.

[33:02] If it doesn't already through the Boulder Valley Comp plan, then there should be an evaluation of that. For the employees that are coming in here. It's kind of a dead end area. I'm not going to go there on my bike, you know, but we do need massage training places so that we can have little massage studios in all the fifteen-minute neighborhoods, right? That would be very cool. Let's see. It's the same idea. It really, these considerations need to be made for the fact that it's not a destination place. I mean. It's kind of stuck there in this corner. It's gonna require it's very car oriented around that area. I mean, we've got to deconstruct that. It would planning board, you know, like the card orientation of general areas, but to deconstruct that's going to take decades and decades. I'm sure. So that there's small neighborhoods and people aren't having to go on the Woody Hills Highway in Iris and the the large areas.

[34:13] But I'd say it's basically probably approvable because because of the fact that it's a training. For folks that are going to be. Providing the benefit to the neighborhood, but. I would say if you could actually have the training center. Set up some kind of a situation where micro massage things could be all around town in the 15 min neighborhoods, then that would be a constraint on them. That they'd, you know, have to do that would offset the fact that they're kind of a destination resort type thing where people are having to drive out there. Yeah, that's the best I can do on this situation. And I'm glad there's lots of interest in massage and Boulder there always has been.

[35:08] Thanks. Bye. Thank you so much, Lynn, for your comments. Anybody else? Okay, that concludes the public hearing. Back to Lisa. Thanks, Vivian. All right, we're gonna move into discussion. So this is board discussion. Anyone who would like to speak to this item, feel free to raise your hand. Okay, and we'll kinda go around, give everyone a chance to talk and then maybe have a second shot and then we'll. Probably move forward with thinking to sit. So any hands raised. I saw you up first. Laura, please go ahead. Thank you. Thank you. So this one is a slam dunk for me. You know, this kind of instructionalized instruction, specialized instruction facility is allowed in this zone. As long as it meets the user review criteria. You know, it's not changing anything about the built structure.

[36:01] It's not changing the character of the area. Message therapy. The clinical portion is clearly allowed under both the code and the PUD. The only thing that we're really talking about is the idea that some folks are getting trained, which clearly does provide a service. In convenience to the neighborhood. And I don't see it having any negative impacts and it seems consistent with the character. So I have no qualms about approving this enthusiastically. Thank you. Laura. Emil, I see your hand up. Go ahead. Thank you. Yes, I will concur with. Laura's enthusiasm. I think it's always great to. See some of those threads that were part of early boulder still remaining in in a viable fashion. My questions were answered, to full satisfaction. And, I think that this is one of those projects that, as the codes. As codes, zoning, this use review criteria, evolved and changed in this last year. You know, it put people in a, oh gosh, it's not business as usual, something has changed.

[37:12] And so put put the project in a position to have to approach. What would have been a standard process in a in a different way because of the change changes that we've made to those base criteria in this recent months. So I can appreciate the timing and the way that has worked out and yes, I am. Prepared to support, this motion. Thank you. Anyone else who would like to speak to this? I'll just speak as chair and say that I very much echo. What we heard from, and Laura, it seems. Quite straightforward to me. And I am planning to support it as well. And Mark wants to speak in just a moment. 1 s, Mark.

[38:03] Let me say something to staff real quick. I'm having trouble accessing the motion language and I think we may be speaking to it soon. It doesn't need to be speaking to it soon. It doesn't need to be open screen yet, but. If you aren't already anticipating that, if you guys could get ready to put it up one and if we get to that point, that would be very helpful. Mark, go ahead. I was just going to offer and make a motion. Unless anyone, if everyone was done speaking. And I have the motion language ready to. Yeah, so, okay. Yay, thanks Mark. That's fine with me unless I see another hand come up and someone wants to weigh in. Okay. I think I think you're good to pursue. Okay. I move to approve. Use review number L you are 2023 Dash 0 0 0 3 3 3. Incorporating the staff memorandum including its attachments as finding a fact and subject to the recommended conditions of approval.

[39:04] Second. And do we, and a second from Laura, so motion introduced by Mark Mcintyre and seconded by Laura Kaplan. I'll go ahead and take a roll call. Mark? Hi. Yes. Yes. Yes. Laura. Okay, Georgie. ML. And I am also a yes. That passes unanimously with planning board members present. 5 0. Alright. I think our next item is, Matters? Is that correct? I don't have it pulled up anymore. Where am I? Thank you all. So I just want to say thank you so much and I hope to see you guys at the clinic. Thank you, Melinda. We appreciate you being here. Thank you, Alison as well. Congratulations on your approval. Okay. Thank you so much. So yeah, we're proceeding on to matters. So this be matters from planning directors city attorney. Any staff have anything to bring forward?

[40:06] I have a couple of things I'll mention very briefly on calendaring at the end. Brad, check in your head. You want to go first? I guess everybody shot me tonight. Nothing to say. Brad, did you have something you wanted to introduce or are you good? Well, I was just gonna take this moment to. Try to thoroughly embarrass Devon because it is his last official planning board. Meeting. However, you will be at the retreat helping with some of the mechanics which I think I'm doing math right is like 2 days before your last day or something so which since it's a late meeting, it actually is more like, yeah. Lesson. But we've appreciated Devin and, wish him very well. You know sad for us but certainly glad to

[41:08] I appreciate that. It's been great really working with y'all. As Brad mentioned, I will be there next week to help you guys with the agenda there for everything in the council bias training for the retreat, which I'm excited to actually see you guys in person for once. You know, that's a plus. But no, it's really been great. Just working with you all, you all have such a dedication to this board and to the city of Boulder, which is so clear. It's been great working with you guys and I've said it a few times now so it's ringing the bell for you here, but I'm sure I'll be back and bolder at some point and we'll cross pass again. So thanks again for y'all and I will look forward to seeing you guys Yeah, thank you so much, Devin. You've been. Competent and friendly and just on it from day one and we were very very lucky to have you in. As I said in the agenda meeting, it's soon as I saw how good you were I was like oh he's gonna get promoted internally or get something else like Yeah, verily, but we are very lucky to have you.

[42:00] So thank you. I appreciate that. Thank you. I'm sure that Lisa speaks for all of us there and we won't say goodbye yet since we'll see you next week but it has been really great having your your support. Exactly. And all of your scales. Brought to bear on this board. So thank you, Devin, and we will miss you. Much appreciated. Thank you, Laura. Likewise. Alright, I'm gonna do a couple of quick calendaring things and then if anyone else has anything they want to bring up. Please speak up. So the first is I believe we've all been invited to do one on ones with our facilitator. For our board retreat so if you haven't had that yet or if it somehow hasn't gotten scheduled or anything else is going on just you know if it works through scheduling able to attend I think hopefully those will help to make our retreat. A wonderful event and as good as it can be. And then I also just wanted to mention that we have some upcoming. Planning board meetings that are scheduled for like the Tuesday before Thanksgiving the Tuesday before Christmas there's one that's the second so just the day after New Year's.

[43:08] And just to encourage board members to look at their calendars, look at what's happening with their personal lives and work lives and family and anything else you have going on and just reach out early if you know that you won't be making a particular meeting. Which is certainly possible in normal during these months, just so that we can keep an eye on Quorum and just kind of see what's happening. So just, please keep track of that if, you might not attend one or more meetings. And I think that's all for me. Mark, go ahead. Oh, I was just checking my calendar and so I still have it. Next Tuesdays. The 20 fourth the retreat as a hold 5 to 8 pm. With an overlapping planning board meet. So obviously the the meeting I just wanna concur and understand is it at 5 to 8. And, and is there a change to the invitation? For that coming.

[44:04] Yeah, thanks for flagging that, Mark. It is actually it is gonna be next week in replacement of and at the planning board meeting. So we'll meet at 50'clock for dinner. And then eat for about 45 min or so and then we'll go right into the. So I'll go ahead and send out an update a calendar invite tomorrow. Great. Thank you. Of course. Yeah, so as Devin just said, I think that 50'clock start is to allow for a little bit of socializing and. Eating prior to the formal meeting starting. So the formal meeting will still start right around sixth. But we wanted to give a little reway for people to come in and sit down and eat. So that's that's why the earlier start. And will George be able to join us at some point remotely? Oh, George, we'll miss you. No, no, I think it'll be more disruptive to be remote than let you guys go at it. I'm sure I'll be I'll miss you guys too. I'll be there soon now. You know.

[45:00] You don't wanna be a giant learning head above us. No. Okay. Okay. We will, Fedex your dinner too though. Okay. Does Doordash deliver to Sweden? Okay. 3 9 3 am. They've probably got their own service. We could, we could send something. Yeah, all right. Anything else folks before I, gavel this out? Yes, go ahead. Just, I think Vivian has left us, but, crediting her for the idea that we wanted to wish Sarah a happy birthday. I understand that it's her birthday. So Sarah, if you're watching, we all wish you a happy birthday. May the minutes reflect that if we're allowed to sneak in things like that. Alright. Oh yeah, I hope she's the, it's her birthday. I suspect she's not watching. Okay. I suspect that. Yeah, yeah. Okay. I really But a bit if she looks later, she's being thorough. Alright folks, I'm gonna go ahead and adjourn this meeting. Thank you all for your time. I'm glad it was such a quick and short and concise one and we'll see you next week in person at the retreat. OkayThanks allHi.