March 6, 2024 — Environmental Advisory Board Regular Meeting

Transcript

Captions from City of Boulder YouTube recording.

[0:06] Yes. yeah, just for your remote right here. Yeah. It's a coaster Cobster. Yes. strangest from what I've ever seen. Hey, Carolyn. good evening. Make you a co-host in case you want to share anything.

[1:04] How's dinner outstanding? You're missing out, hey? Thank you for allowing me to do this virtually this evening. It was a long drive, a lot of driving today and heading back to Boulder after picking dogs up was gonna be a little challenging so, and as much as they loved, I would love you all. II didn't feel like bringing the 2 of them to the Eab meeting was was was going to go over that. Well, they can be quite a distraction. Wise choice. Okay. So I call this meeting to order, and the first item will be the see if we can get this to cooperate this time, because I know it loves to switch

[2:05] Carly. If anything looks weird, let me know, because likes to. Can you see my screen? Carolyn, the the Powerpoint. Yeah, I mean, it's coming up. So there it is. And it's just not in presentation yet. Okay, there we go. My name is Heather Sandine, and I'm serving as the technical host for tonight's meeting. We're thanks for your Grace and patience as we deal with the technology issues. Let me pop pop pop up today. The city has engaged with community members to co-create the vision for productive, meaningful and inclusive civic conversation. This vision supports physical and emotional safety for community members, staff and board and commission members as well as democracy. For people of all ages, identities, lived experiences and political perspectives. For more information about this vision in the community engagement process. Please visit https, Colonel.

[3:04] Forward, slash forward, slash folder Colorado. Forward, slash services forward slash, productive hype, and atmospheres. The following are examples of rules of decorum found in the boulder revised code and other guidelines that support this vision, these will be upheld. During this meeting all remarks and testimony shall be limited to matters related to city business. No participant shall make threats or use other forms of intimidation against any person. Obscenity, racial epithets, and other speech and behavior that disrupts or otherwise impedes the ability to conduct the meeting are prohibited. participants are required to sign up to speak, using the name they are commonly known by, and individuals must display their whole name before being allowed to speak online currently, only audio testimony. because we do not have registration for open and public comment. Tonight, you can indicate you would like to participate by using the raise hand function. The raisin button is in. The is in the participant box, which can be found in the menu by hovering over the top or the bottom of your screen, and then clicking on the participant icon.

[4:10] When the box opens you will see the raise hand button at the bottom by clicking that button you can indicate, you would like to participate and open a public comment. If you have joined us by phone, you can press Star 9 to raise your hand and heather. I don't know if you see it, but there is a hand. Yes, sorry. It's all, I believe. And then before we go on, Poll or not. Did you want to approve the minutes? Okay. So the next time in the agenda will be the approval of the minutes. So I'll put the motion to do that. Anybody second. Thank you.

[5:08] Hi, guys, hopefully, you can hear me. Yeah, I guess. So I saw a wave. so it's a pleasure to talk to you again this evening. Good to see you all. and hope you have a productive meeting. and what I've been working on lately is legislature and bills at the Legislature, and I hope that the city is. and promoting some of these bills. So II know that when you do the priorities for your lobbyist in the fall you don't know what the bills are going to be. but now we know what the bills are. and the one that particularly interests me because I'm a leave it in the ground kind of guy is Senate Bill 24, 1 59, which is called Mods to energy and carbon management processes.

[6:07] But what it does is phase out new oil and gas permits by 2030, and also ensures that the oil and gas industry has liability for cleaning up their messes. So I we think it'd be great if the said he would testify in favor of that bill. And there's a a suite of 3 ozone bills that seem to have pretty unanimous support through the environmental community. and I will send you guys an email listing out all these bills. We don't have time to night for me to go through this. But just wanted to let you know what's going on. And so thank you for your attention and have a good meeting.

[7:00] Thank you, Robert. Thank you. Thank you. Okay? So thank you, Paul, for those comments. Let's move on to the next item in the agenda, which is the the excel energy Update. Hi, Karl. great. Well, thank you. Everyone. We wanted to put this on the agenda just to to follow up and and give the opportunity. For the the panel to ask any questions or provide any feedback on some of the updates that Excel has been presenting with the community on the the partnership and just kind of give an overall update and also understand from the panel what would be helpful to support your efforts? In the in the coming year as well around the topic of our partnership work with excel rather than going through a Powerpoint presentation. II just wanted to to create space, to kind of walk through a little bit of what's been happening. Some of what was shared with our city council last month at at Excel's update there, as well as our advisory panel.

[8:07] But just to step back. We have had a few presentations to the community that have occurred. The first was to our Excel energy partnership community advisory panel at the beginning of February, where Excel provided an Update specifically on the emissions milestone. That's part of our franchise agreement with them. So if if everybody will recall when the negotiations happened around the franchise agreement. our our team felt. You know, represented by our mayor and council member. Yes, as as well as our city leadership. There's important to to ground that agreement and continued progress towards the community's emissions, reduction goals and and goals towards renewable and 0 emission electricity. And so there were milestones that were embedded into the franchise around system level, grid, wide emissions, and the first one was for the year 2022

[9:04] calendar gears. So that is the total system emissions that excel that is associated with all of the electricity excel, delivers in Colorado, to its customers. There's another milestone coming up in 2024, and then there's subsequent ones. In the outgers associated with continued progress towards a 2030 target. And each of these milestones had consideration within the franchise around. You know, if not satisfied with the progress being made. Those milestones or or failure to meet them, was one of the potential options. For exiting the franchise. We also have the 5 year anniversary coming up. Next year. That is another decision point within the franchise. So that's the background. I'll pause just a second and and see if there's any questions just on that intro. I guess I have a general question of how that went in February and how it was received in the overall outlook.

[10:07] Yeah, so first, maybe I'll do a quick preview of of what the information was and and so specifically. and I wasn't again, I wasn't gonna show. This is Powerpoint, just just to speak to them. More specifically so. The milestones are tied to again. Metric tons metric tons of Co. 2. I guess there's short tens of CO. 2 in our agreement on the 2022 target with 16.6 1 million short tons excel, did have admissions in excess of that they, their achievement was 16.9. So 300. it's I wanna. Say, it was about 1.7%. So it's point 3 million short tons in excess of what our target was. So 1.7 over the target.

[11:07] They're also forecasting, acknowledging that we're only in 2024 now. To be over in 2024 they did share with us. A number of contributors to that to include the effects of the word in the Ukraine and elsewhere. You know some of the other impacts on natural gas pricing that drove certain decisions around. What generation mixes were in play? The the fact that the load growth was a little bit more than they had anticipated. When they went back in 2019, when they were setting those targets, and also just acknowledging the fact that when they signed onto the agreement they were dealing with the portfolio of generation that was in place prior to the agreement, not the one that they were filing with the Commission are now moving forward with. So I think all of those factors.

[12:06] We're definitely, I think, well received. And certainly good. Ex excellent explanations, for why? There was deviation. From what they were hoping to achieve. Most of the discussion really centers around confidence around the the future targets and the fact that very quickly they are showing that, you know, by mid 2026, 2027. They're gonna start to do better. And exceed what what the milestones are in the franchise agreement. So it's a little bit of timing related to where they are, and they were in the regulatory process. and a little bit of that control I think we all acknowledge, though certainly the the fact that the first ones were were short certainly lend themselves to really dive into what confidence we have around those out your targets. That was a lot of what the discussion was. I think there was appreciation of bringing it forward and and creating that transparency and sharing with our panel as well as city council about the progress. Anything you would add. Jonathan.

[13:10] yeah, I guess there would be a couple of comments here, Caroline. I think this is a great overview, and and certainly I would love the Board to know that if you haven't either seen the presentation that excel gave to count. So we can send you a link to that. So you can actually hear in their own words kind of how they intend to make sure that they are getting on the right trajectory to meet our goals. And then, if you haven't been on the website, we actually have built out a pretty substantial website that talks all about the partnership, the framework. What what about the agreement is really substantial? And really starting to explain that the the emission reduction milestones for things. That that was something that we put into the agreement very specifically, because we wanted to see your over your reductions and emissions between 2,020 and 2030, not something along the lines of like very little progress, and then maybe something more substantial in the outer years. What's under that curve really matters when it comes to emissions. But II would also say that I really wanna applaud and appreciate Carolyn for her work and helping the advisory panel, which is this is the the citizen group that really is has been assembled to help kind of guide A lot of the work between excel in the city. That partnership group.

[14:27] And the the reason I bring that up is, if you've not seen some of that detail. It's really important to recognize that our partnership is is is the initial reduction targets. But it's also the value that the partnership brings in terms of projects and programs that would not have happened otherwise. And so that's a lot of the work that's been underway at the local level. And so certainly we are not going to be in a position of defending excel. We were disappointed as well, I think Council voice their disappointment, and the fact that that excel missed their 2020 target and anticipates missing the 2024. But I think II feel like they did a a good job of explaining the factors as Carolyn mentioned. And now it's incumbent on us to make sure

[15:12] that they're going to really double redouble their efforts to get back on the trajectory. They did a a nice graph if you didn't see it. That really shows in the other years, probably by 2,026. They're gonna dive under kind of our straight line. And again, we just pick targets you over year, straight line between 2,020, and where we want it to be in 2,030. And so it's not entirely unexpected. But again, we wanna use this as an opportunity to to really accelerate the work of the partnership we're and in a planning phase now for a couple of years, and I think we can really start to see some some great action at the local level. So that's the piece that I wanted to add. You were probably oh, I was. Gonna say, I appreciate that, Jonathan and I. Yeah, I mean, I think we wanna acknowledge that. it, you know, getting off the ground with the partnership and starting to stand up. Things that you know could show you know, more material commitment for myself to the community. Certainly taken some some time. I think we're all very much aware that.

[16:13] I think there's expectation that there were going to be very visible things early, and it's taken some planning, but I think we are also, you know, excited about some of the things on the horizon that the progress we we've made, and and so I think that was also part of the conversation to bring forward some of the priorities on this coming year around. Some of our projects which we can talk about as well. I just wanted to start to kind of part of the background of the presentation, and and and the reason we put it forward. So I'll pause and see questions for Jonathan or I. Based on that. I assume that when you talk about missions production, that's increasing renewables and decreasing coal, that's other than half. Yeah, that's correct. It's so. Systemwide emissions would be all the missions associated with their generation. So the more call use they have. Obviously the higher emissions they have, the more renewables. It's going down, and that makes is rapidly changing. With some of the projects that were brought on just in the last year or so on the renewable side.

[17:23] The call plans. I mean most of them will be retired. Within the next 2 years. The last unit will be retired. By the end of 2030 at the latest. And so we're certainly we're we're certainly gonna see that trajectory, I mean. Natural gas still has a missions associated with it. But certainly we're we're seeing the right trending in terms of their their portfolio that lends itself to to suggest we're we're gonna make substantial progress. And I would just offer not just them. We're seeing statewide some substantial progress.

[18:00] towards really cleaning upgrade emissions. In in a very meaningful way in in the coming decade. Couple of decades. So II think there's I think we should all certainly celebrate the end of call in Colorado. Obviously, we all want it to be as soon as possible. And and yeah, there's a lot, you know. We don't like it to be yesterday. But it's still very notable that we we know the date, and it's it's going to be largely over 80% renewables by by 2,030 which is pretty substantial. like equity question. When the when the coal plants close. What happens to all the workers like to the transition to a new, to like gas, or they get any help in transitioning into a new industry like, what do they do for work? Yeah. So the excel has been working very closely with all of the affected communities tied to to those plans. Looking for opportunities, to to move them into either new sources of generation. So some of those

[19:10] facilities have been like transition to natural gas, and they're still working there. Others are exploratory. And then there is going to be this summer. A a new request for proposals that are the the just transition resources that would help short, you know, back. back, fill some of the the jobs in those areas. They're certainly concerned about both workforce and what that workforce represents in terms of like, you know, tax income for communities. Right? So it's it's both the workers and and the economic and condition of of the communities where those plans have been. So that's been a very extensive process at at the Commission something that companies been been undertaking. Quite extensively, and then not everything's answered at the structure. So this this plan that's going to come out this summer. Their their call for that resource mix will will bring you more clarity to them.

[20:08] Okay, and I'm really quick, I would add him on. This is the story that's playing out everywhere as possible. Generation is based out. How do you think about that? That's the term that's typically used to to think about the impact on those local economies on the workers, etc., I mean, I would point out, and if you caught it in Carolyn's remarks, but the State actually put forward and developed an office of just transition. And so it it was really, I think, a very thoughtful approach to think about those communities like Hayden and Craig and and others that, and not just those that are certified by excel, or or have a generation, facilities that are open operated by excel. But but all utilities. I think this is just the trend that that all States are going to be going through. Others are impacted more than us. And I I'm really, I think, quite proud that our State recognized that was going to be an issue. And really tried to take steps to to make sure that those communities were

[21:01] oh. that we need to be thoughtful around questions. You can also see anything else related to the partnership or anything you'd like to know? Like what's happening on I don't know. Electric vehicles, for example. We do have some exciting things coming up there. One being hopefully hopefully in the next couple of days. Or early next week we'll have a new bi-directional charger installed at 30 perl. As part of that affordable housing property. It's going to be used for or else it's gonna be.

[22:14] I'm having a card share vehicle there and then the the car is parked. It'll provide the ability to reduce electricity, demand and and save money for that property. So it's an extension of the pilot. The city's been conducting at North Boulder rec scaled up now at 30 perl. And a different application, so we could continue to learn how vehicles can to be used to provide storage and support for the grid so excited to see that project off the the ground. It's in construction, and we're just waiting on the chargers to be delivered at this point. We're also working our transportation team in particular. If they're working closely with excel via see you on the share transit charging hub added, via property on the east side of town. So there's been a lot of planning work around that on the Ep front

[23:09] where very focused on the undergrounding project for Chautauqua. So starting very soon, there's gonna be more work going on up at Chautauqua around both wildfire mitigation. As well as underground in all the overhead lines in that area, over a multi phase project that starts this year to to just really help enhance the resilience and prepare that site, that area as well for future electrification. So you know, sizing service as as part of this effort. So it's a very complex project as you can imagine. That's There's there's a lot of wires and utilities that run in a very dense area between the cottages. And so there's been a tremendous amount of planning and and cross department coordination around that and other city projects like repaving the roads and some of the water infrastructure as well. So we're pretty

[24:17] pleased and excited to see that project moving forward within the partnership. There's been a lot of work to the benefit of the community in terms of just addressing some of the re reliability issues we have as a community, and we've certainly heard of city staff. Folks in the community have experienced repeat outages or or issues. And and so through our partnership, excel's done some drone studies of areas of our community identified issues in the making repairs. We've enhanced some vegetation management in areas where we're seeing. you know, some weather related. If particularly snow loading on on vegetation, causing outages so not as not as exciting. And the emissions reduction space. That's certainly important to our community? As well. So, and then a number of projects on on the horizon around

[25:10] electrification, including looking at how we can potentially retire assignment of gas line in in a downtown area. So we are looking at A at a project focused in on pro once and pro 7 of Pearl Street that requires a gas line replacement. And we're gonna look at trying to electrify those businesses and residential us there to avoid that gas infrastructure project. It's very challenging undertaking, but we're going to be working on that in the coming year as well. So lots of exciting things on the horizon. For sure. I have a couple of questions one I know. Hannah asked her question about and where the primary mechanisms of the carbon emissions reduction come from, and I'm wondering. do they track, or is it accounting for at all like the transmission lines.

[26:02] and how that comes into play as well as like the upheat of and maintenance of those sorts of things. Yeah, I think there's a number of ways to answer that. So from an admissions standpoint, like all of those losses, are accounted for from their emissions, accounting because they're they're tracking like how much they have to generate to actually deliver to meet the sales requirements, and so they also account for some scope to emissions associated with generation. So it's it's a pretty expansive process that follows a a established registry process. So from an admissions standpoint, they're they're very encompassing. there's separate as to what level of investments being made in the infrastructure, both distribution system and transmission system. And there's a number of

[27:01] II I'll say there's less clarity around all of the investments being made there. But there's work in progress to bring more clarity around that system wide. And so this fall will be the separate distribution system plan that excel will file to really look at that future investment need around the the distribution infrastructure. For you know, growth, reliability, electrification, all all the things we know that there's gonna need to be investment both in expansion as well as reliability. There's other plans. Like. There's a project called the Power pathways project that's looking at the new transmission and and they're constructing the new transmission that's going to be needed to bring the renewables into the communities. This just transition plan? Ha! We'll have a transmission component to it as well, especially you know. One of the nuances of going to more renewables is where the best resources are are farther away from the communities and the low centers. So like, if you think about Denver as a good example, they've got Cherokee that's been down there in Central Town. There's also some some natural gas peaking plants like all around the community, so they don't have to transmit very far. But if you're building, if you're supplying them with wind and solar, you're gonna need to bring those resources in.

[28:20] So add more transmission. That's one of the things that they're they're looking at in terms of the future investment needs. Certainly we know that transportation electrification and building electrification is is gonna drive additional investment as well. And my other question you had mentioned at the start in terms of meeting certain targets corresponding with dates that we have a timeline where we can essentially phase out franchise and cut it off. Is that likely? And if if it is, what, what's the kind of fallback alternative.

[29:00] You may take a swing of that one. Yeah, I mean, I would say. you know, I think there's I'll just talk mechanically. how it works so within the the franchise that decision can be made either by counsel or community. And so there's there's a mechanisms that would, you know, either a council super majority vote can make a decision around the franchise or a community like valid initiative to make a decision around the franchise. I certainly would not comment on the likelihood. I mean, we would not speak for the position of counsel or community in in terms of of that. you know. Certainly we're prepared to, you know, at least do whatever analysis or or other things are necessary to understand, like, what does it mean to exit a franchise at this structure like, does it? It doesn't necessarily mean like picking up unicilization again, or could and so there's considerations that would have to come in, you know, city staff. That'll be something we'll be, you know, ensuring that if Council is interested in that, at least exploring that

[30:08] we would make sure that we have information about like what that would take or you know what some of the pros and cons might be related to it anything else you want to add to that, Jonathan? Yeah, I think that was good. Yeah, it's a it's an excellent question. And just to, I mean, provide even a little bit more clarity in terms of those trigger points. So there are 2 ways that or 2 triggers. One is the failure to meet those emission targets. And those happen in 2023, 2025, 2028. Those are the dates associated so the missions that that are emitted during those years will be evaluated, and then they're verified by a third party, and then we have the ability to choose whether to get out of the franchise or not by the mechanism that Caroline just described. There's also 5 year anniversary opportunities that we call triggers as well. So that's 2026 and then 2031, 2036. So those are kind of for any reason. If we wanted to get out of the franchise by vote, we could do so and, like Caroline, I would not suggest that we would provide an opinion on whether we would or would not. But I do wanna say

[31:16] in order to opt out, we need to think about what we're opting in to. For 10 years we existed in a state of no franchise, and there are risks, I mean, we we lost the franchise fee. We had to go to the voters to secure dollars that are transmitted to our general fund the franchise fee. We would need to think about that loss again if we're at a franchise in order to kind of red back up the municipalization engine. Obviously, we need to think about the staff. We need to re redo our analysis, of course. And so there's a little bit of a period there in terms of when we would vote. And so the next year is that date by which we would want to start thinking. We? I say, we, that the community or council would want to be thinking about an alternative, choose to do so.

[32:04] So again, we would provide any analysis or data for the decision makers if they want to start thinking about that. But at the at the presentation that Excel gave, there was no indication that this council, at least at this point in time, had any desire to move in that direction. yeah. Well, what I what I will say. We were very thoughtful. When we created the partnership agreement that today give ourselves the ability to opt out of the agreement. If it wasn't working for the admissions, purpose, or for any other reason, and in the agreement we also locked in some things that were incredibly challenging with municipalization. So there were th. There was this kind of unknown cost that was floated out there. I won't get into the details called going concern or stranded costs or 2 big chunks that could be big dollar amounts, and so it changes the calculus in terms of purchase price.

[33:17] and then your debt service to pay back that debt, and then that all will save the to to your read structure, so forth, and so on. And then the actual acquisition cost of the facility, some of the things that we would actually buy and on and operate. And so we locked in some of those details to say, if we went back to municipalization. We cap some of those costs and and address some of those issues. So if we did, we wouldn't start back at it's square one. We would actually not all, not kind of pick up where we left off, but actually be a little bit step ahead. But but our as staff, our our charges, to make sure that this partnership is effective as it can. Possibly. Yeah, I mean, I think it's also just

[34:00] worth technology. The success that that was has been realized from the municipalization effort in terms of really creating that state wide dialogue. And, you know, lending itself to to systemic change. So it's really, it's very interesting. You know, we're in a such different place about like the mission side of of what was a motivator for municipalization. We're we're gonna be at. you know, somewhere between 87, and you know, or more percent emission reduction from 2,500 in 2030. It's it's maybe not 100. But we have projects to close that cap. So it might be. So from an admissions standpoint. A lot has changed from those decision points. That have been knowledge. That doesn't mean that there's other, not other values or things that I think, would be looked at in in that conversation. But

[35:02] it's a very different dynamic. But we should really celebrate the success that this community had in terms of really really driving that change. it, it's it's such an amazing landscape we were. We were having this conversation just the other day about we we put out these targets, and everybody assumes they're there there are these lofty, audacious things that will never meet. And yet, look! We set one to be 100 renewable, renewable electricity to eliminate great emissions. And Who thought that we were going to meet that? And you know, in whatever year it was that we first set that target and yet statewide all the modeling says we're going to be 97 or better emissions free without any policy action. And there's going to be policy action. That's that's being proposed in this legislative session. So

[36:03] I think that's just phenomenal. And and it could not have that outcome would not have been achieved in the absence of many different strategies, from utilization to to driving passage to the renewable energy standards to statewide bills. That the community had. So I think you know, I always like to take a moment and just really celebrate success that came from that. Now we gotta get the gas system taken care of that sorry electricity solve. Let's move on to gas. Let me understand questions. you great. Thank you. All right. And then I just invite you. If there's any topics

[37:05] that you would like us to bring forward related to the partnership to dive into a little bit more. II know our colleagues excel, would certainly be happy. To join, and we could deep dive, and then, before I leave you to your agenda. I think I am your agenda for April and so just wanted to to preview that we'll have a couple of topics. The other thing I just wanted. Why was here to mention? we we didn't come and talk to you last, II think, was in December. Around the energy code update. And we were anticipating going earlier in the year. And I just wanted to share a brief update. It is going to counsel. On consent for first reading on the eighteenth of this month. It will go forward for second reading public hearing in in March. and it's it's could nothing change from the conversations that we had with you all. And so we just wanted to make just give you that update and acknowledge that we we're still very much on track with what? Josh and Robin, I spoke with you. I think Rob was with us at least. Josh and I spoke with you about when we did give that briefing, and we're looking forward to finishing up this project and having it go into effects. I just wanted to to get that update as well. I was here.

[38:27] Thank you. Thank you. Thanks. Thank you. So 5. I have nothing to make sense of. puts another one.

[39:05] This is something's quiet, whatever it is. Gotcha. Let's see. All right. perfect. Alright. So this is part of the next item, which is the our letter council? I thought if you could pull up the the bulldog piece. Okay. I wanna say, thank you guys for the edits, Hannah, I still appreciate it, took the effort of Brexit. He's in charge of, like updating and editing and approving the changes I really appreciate. Well, I accepted all of them. They're all really great. Alex, I really like the restriction you did with the letter as well. That was really nice. I really appreciate you that I'm Greg.

[40:09] I appreciate your edits as well. I I didn't find the letter as much after I got your edit, but I think I try to synthesize your the the vibe of your letter, which was like a sense of urgency around what we're requesting. So I modify the intro and change a couple. Yeah, businesses. You know. really productive and and like boiling each thing down to having its header. And then the brief summarization, and then slightly more in depth, I think was a great way to structure it.

[41:03] And I think I mean, it's it's a well put together. Letter that hopefully will be productive in its average to counsel. So I guess. do we want to discuss more about it like we need? Okay. I'm sorry. Just sorry to interrupt. It. It's probably best, because the this letter hasn't gone to council yet, and probably shouldn't be projected public if you would all like to see it so that you can speak to it, I can split the screen and share it with you all. Oh, good at some. I didn't hyperlink.

[42:01] I think very upstanding programs. Or I say, this morning, go this way early afternoon question. Yeah. My morning. how that aligns with the day's schedule is kind of strange. But yeah, I think all the comments are resolved. Yeah. you know, I think that unless there's any like small changes that people desperately think need to be made. I think it's a solid letter that doesn't need a whole bunch of revisitation. Let's see. Yeah, I mean. I think I think it looks good. I'll pick on something approved. Everything looks good,

[43:07] plus. I think that the there's a pre-retreat Council meeting on Fourteenth. So it'd be good to get it in ahead of our good work, anyway. if we're not changing. Comprehensive plan need a link. I think they know it? Well, that's something that they either know well already or have easy access to pretty accessible. It's yeah feeding me alright. So we need to

[44:08] work. Let you know but feel pretty confident this is pretty seamless. Well, that's easy. So we don't have anything, all business or updates. So let's go to Jonathan and the update on the city's climate lawsuit.

[45:00] Yeah, sure. Thanks, Aaron. Board members. This is a an item that we put on your agenda a couple of months ago, is a little bit more timely, but still felt it was probably good to spend a little bit of time talking through with you. The oral arguments that took a place about a month and a half ago here in Boulder, and answer any questions that you have about our client lawsuit? And those could be substance based questions around, why we file the lawsuit, what's really contained within it or procedural? If you have questions on the steps along the way and where we think it might go. But I'll just give a high level overview, and then certainly take any questions that you have. So we filed a a lawsuit back in 2,018, after a fair amount of work prepping for that lawsuit and the lawsuit is against 2 fossil fuel majors. So Exxon Mobil and Suncor Suncor is. If you're not familiar. Canadian based Refining Company, you you know of Suncor. It's the refinery you pass.

[46:03] As you're headed to Dia typically in Commerce City. They refine Canadian tar sand at that location. But again, they are. They are a predominant supplier of petroleum in the State of Colorado, but they are Canadian Based company with many subsidiaries. And the reason that we filed. The case, of course, is, there have been a number of climate lawsuits just starting to take shape in 2,018. We were pretty early in terms of filing, but ours was a little bit different in a number of ways. We were the first case to be from an inland community or state and our our basis and claim was substantially different than a lot of the other cases that had been filed at that point. The cases against Exxon and other fossil fuel companies were largely based on the the burden of the seat, meaning that companies like Exxon have known for a very long time with the damages of the the use selling and use of their product has caused and the the impact it's had on climate change.

[47:03] And so the the premise then was to sue the company, to stop that behavior, to stop them from selling and and continuing to revine and doing the thing that they do, that they're in business to do. Where that really gets tangled up is where? What is the right venue? And what is the right place to regulate that? And so the EPA obviously has been the predominant regulator through the clean air act to regulate pollutants like carbon. And so the question is. should these kind of cases go forth at the state level? A. A. And should it be Congress that is really determining these issues, and maybe addressing climate change shouldn't be done in in a courtroom. It should be done in Congress. Anyone has their own opinion on that, but we recognize that that was a bit of a headwind, and our approach was was quite different with our lawsuit. We applied a a State toward or damage claim to our, to our lawsuit. And originally, when we filed, we had done some work with our colleague Paul Fan, or not Paul. Fan, I'm sorry. Paul Cheneowski. Who runs resilient analytics. Some of you may name no Paul.

[48:16] But we worked with him to really understand the costs associated with climate change. And how those costs may change over time. So let me let me give you an example. So cities like Boulder and any other city. We use taxpayer dollars to provide public service things like paving roadways, billing potholes and lights and trails and rec centers and transportation and utility systems. And you know, you know, waste water, all of the things that cities do. And our analysis was to determine. Well, how does that change? How does cost change with an increase in temperature? What happens to asphalt with 2 degrees rise and temperature on average, more days of extreme heat. What does it mean in terms of our water, water, quality, and quantity? How do we think about those impacts? Then have you apply a dollar figure to to those things.

[49:07] So why, that's really critical is Our case, again, was based on on a damage claim. Rather than kind of a a behavior challenge. And it's been incredibly powerful. And a useful way to think about the case. And so our, if if you read our original lawsuit, and one thing I want to share with you is that on this case is actually being led by Earth International. It's a DC firm. They are pro bono law firm working on our behalf. and they have been since 2018. We went into this lawsuit jointly with Boulder County and San Miguel county, and we did an analysis on those costs at that time in 2,018, knowing that we would have to polish those details as we had further into the case. So without going into all the details procedurally, essentially, we have. We've had fits and starts since 28 since 2,018, which is not unexpected at all.

[50:06] The the biggest part of the fight up to date has been about venue. This kind of case is definitely better for the defendant to be heard at Federal level. which means our jurisdiction. It would like to be heard in Houston, or some other location far away from from boulder. Different set of principles apply, of course, but their argument has been that this is a Federal case. We shouldn't. It shouldn't even have been broad, of course, all of all the reasons that a dependent like X on the one some core would we would expect them to bring so we've had multiple rulings from our District Court, and it actually made its way all the way to the Federal Supreme Court, the beginning of 2,023. That was a little known fact, I think. Okay. I'm carrying a lot of you for just one. If one.

[51:24] Where was it? Okay? Supreme Court. Yes, sorry when all the Supreme Court which was really quite, quite thing. And the reason it went to the Supreme Court is again the dependents. Continued to to acknowledge that the rulings that they they, it was not available, ruling all of the rulings that basically said the case should be heard at the local level, which means District Court here in Boulder. made it all the way to Supreme Court last year. And we were the Supreme Court had 2 choices, they could have taken up the case, which was, would probably not have resulted in a variable outcome, I think, for us, or they could have just chosen not to take the case. I am so glad that's way home. I picked it up and then was gonna give it to us perfect.

[52:18] So they actually reached out to the Biden Administration Solicitor, General, or advice, who issued over a a paper essentially to say Supreme court. You should not take up this case for all the reasons that have been heard at the lower lower lower courts. I think we are a little surprised when the Supreme Court follow that guidance and did not take the case. The result of that is that the lower court ruling stands. That means that our case will be heard in District Court here in Boulder huge win for us last year huge win. so that kicked off the next step in the process, which is the defendants filing motions to essentially dismiss the case, the file motions to dismiss. So they didn't get the venue that they wanted which meant that they will just they. They will argue the merits of the case and try to get the case thrown out again. That is argued here in District Court, and the first oral arguments for about a month and a half

[53:18] ago. Here in town our Earth Rights lawyers were here. Many of us went to the hearing and it was an opportunity for our lawyers, Earth rights lawyers, and we also have Colorado council as well. You have to have some in State council. So our lawyers were arguing our case and exonerated their case, and why we believe the case should continue. They argue by the case should be dismissed. At this point the judge could rule any day. He, of course, did not do a bench ruling, which we didn't expect they'll need to take a little bit of time to think through the arguments. But what that means is, if if the judge comes out and does not approve the motion to discuss. And the case continues.

[54:04] we're in a new, a new territory, for sure. We enter into what's called discovery phase, and that is the opportunity for for all parties to file discovery on each party. That means that we can ask them any questions essentially, any questions, and they are compelled to answer those right? And so this is where cases get really interesting, particularly in this space, because you learn a lot. Things that have been not public become public. And so we have always thought that getting to discover would be a significant milestone. We will see where things head. We'll see where things get. When the judge issues his ruling hopefully in the next. I'm gonna say optimistically, in the next 60 to 90 days it could be longer. Last thing, I'll say there are multiple cases like this working their way through courts. Not just nationally, but of course, internationally. There are a few cases that are in a similar place as us. Hawaii is just a little bit ahead of ours. It went to their State Supreme Court, and they are in the process of starting to think about discovery. There were some other cases, that kind of

[55:18] challenge, the timing of ours, because again, there's a Baltimore case, and the Supreme Court wanted to see how that ruling played out before they ruled on our case. So it just delays. It feels like it's been a very long time. But in the scheme of things I feel like we? We've started to accelerate a little bit. So that's a bit of the overview. Happy to take any questions that you have any thoughts but again. Just wanted this to be an update to the board the big city? Excellent! Does it have something like that here in Colorado? Meaning? Are they headquartered in in some way. No, they're not, and and it doesn't have to be. And I think that was one of the jurisdictional issues that's being argued by the dependents, basically to say.

[56:13] if if the actions in one State are affecting individuals, businesses, or others in another State, how do you address that issue is, is there some kind of jurisdiction issue that works for or against the defense in this case? And there is a lot of legal interpretation. Both sides were arguing. I mean, I just like to make my head exploding. We actually have a lawyer who is an expert on jurisdictional law when it comes interstate jurisdictional law. And so it's fascinating to hear his take on on the arguments. But again you mentioned is one of the major oil and gap like oil providers. Right? So a lot of the gas stations are subsidiaries of Exxon. Correct. But both Exxon and some corner. Yeah, yeah, for sure. So both do business in in Colorado. But you pick those 2 because they're the biggest ones. Well, there are 2 reasons. In 2,018. There had been a lot of of information just coming out the year prior 2,017 around. What was that? That was the first time we started fossil majors

[57:20] meaning who are the largest polluters? Globally, and they're only a handful exon. Mobile certainly is one of those. So if you look at climate lawsuits across the board. Virtually all have targeted Exxon Mobil because 2 things a they are fossil, major. Second, they are The company, I think is that that have been exposed more than any other for deceit meaning they knew about issues related to climate. There's been a lot of recent news articles in terms of what they knew when they knew it, and how they covered up that information. To make sure that it didn't impact their sales. So that's the reason that we chose Exxon Mobil because it it seemed really logical as a possible major. And then Suncor, thinking about the biggest polluters in the State of Colorado. There is direct source pollution. And then there is gonna be indirect source pollution. And as a refiner and

[58:14] an entity that is bringing in dirty Canadian tar sand report, refining it here at their facility. And then you know, a major major provider of petroleum in the State of Colorado. That's why we chose an in State entity likes. And now what are the legal arguments more or less like a new able to summarize them a little bit. I know you've got a lawyer, but it's like, what's yeah. I mean the biggest. I'm happy to provide you a link to all of I mean, if you want to read thousands, it's actually fascinating stuff. The the basic premise or non is what's called the damages claim, meaning th. The actions of the defendants have caused damage.

[59:00] And we, as taxpayers and cities in the State of Colorado, we are putting the bill for those damages. And so it's a it's called a torque claim. Very common in state law. and it's not been applied in this way. Ever. So if you think about something like climate change, and this is where I think we get a little bit stuck early in the early years of the case there there have been a lot of there's been. There was a lot of criticism. Over the case to say, look, you shouldn't try to solve climate change in the courtroom, and we're not saying Exxon. You need to stop what you're doing. We're saying you need to pay your fair share. We are paying for these costs. We're gonna have to pay more in the future. You have to pay your fair share, and that is what that's the the substantial basis of of a damage this morning. And that is why our cases, a little bit different than others that have been out there. Others are starting to kind of apply that tech, that tactic as well, because

[60:02] it's it's justified. It's it's tried. It. It makes some sense. We still are a little bit in territory around this jurisdictional issue, again, burning something in another state. How is it impacting? Our communities? And then, of course we'll have to refine our numbers in terms of what are the actual costs? How far do you go? And are you looking at historical costs, or are you looked at it? Are you looking at projected costs? Those are wildly different things. So we have some work to do there. We did originally. Yeah. Originally, I think our number was in the realm of 300 million dollars annually. That was a very crude estimate, but it was. It was. It was done in a way to look at miles of roadway. How often do we pave what happens with extreme heat? How do? How do asphalt roads, crown and buckle. What what do you need to do to overlay those types of of damage we had? We had a great amount of data out of the 2,013 blood in terms of what happens to our utilities

[61:11] when we have 7 and late and runoff, what does it do to our facilities. What are the costs associated with maintaining? Our sewers and drainage systems? What happens when those culprits wash out so streets and roads trails, our utilities. We really focused on those things because we had very, very direct costs associated with those things. But there are multiple multiple layers to think about social costs. Well, those come with all our figures to essential services that we provide thinking about the fact that we have to think about increased cooling loads for public facilities. Where will people go during times of extreme heat? What do we need to do to think about the changes to our water patterns, both quality and quantity. So those are the things that we've been digging into lately, and that's gonna be a bit more of art and science. But we have a lot of

[62:03] really good data to back up those cards. And you can still change that number. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Because what that was our original basis. And and we said, and of course we'll have to update those numbers when we get to the next phase city. Great question. So Boulder and Boulder County, the city in the county have remained connected. We we remain connected in our case, San Miguel because their district, their local district is not boulder is Denver, so their case will be heard in Denver. So they've been bifurcated a little bit. But the the 3 entities together. When it went to the Supreme Court, basically said, your cases need to be heard at the State level. Our district court is boulder, and there's will be in Denver. They are, they are pro bono, which means that they are. They are working on our behalf right now. They do get paid if if we win but right now the the legal support and expertise that they bring, we don't pay for

[63:12] we, of course we do have costs associated. So we have staff time. We have our lawyers who do the work. But they don't do the briefing. They do. They don't do the arguments we meet regularly? To talk about the case, but cool oral arguments. I imagine the judge was was asking questions like. Do you guys get a feel for his questions like in terms of, was he skeptical? Was he receptive to to the arguments so that you can kind of tell, you know, based on what they ask. Well, what I what I will say again, since we're on the record. Is that the judge is incredibly smart. He has incredibly good questions. It was very clear that he had read all of the briefs that work before him. That's what you want. I appreciated again as someone who is not a lawyer. The the line of questioning was very specific to

[64:12] the merits of the case. It is before that judge which is not should we or should we not? I mean our costs or kind of who should really be hearing the the various arguments it was really on the motion to discuss, so our dependents in the case, but for their arguments of why they believe the case should be dismissed outright. Our lawyers argue why it shouldn't and should continue on I don't know, and the judge was was incredibly good at asking and keeping conversation on that topic. so he asked excellent questions of both sides in the case. I say all 3 sides because of 2 dependents, and then, of course the city and the county are joined to particularly relevant part is not necessarily winning the case, but more about getting to a point where they have have have to actually speak truthfully the companies and sort of the transparency that can bring so right like I mean, because there, from my understanding, there were sort of 3 major milestones, which is making sure it's sort of the district level.

[65:17] making its discovery and then actually resolving the case. And so we got the first one getting it back to the district level. And so now we're just waiting on whether or not they will actually have to listen and answer questions truthfully on a public stage. because even if we don't win that 300 million dollars here, whatever new figure it's gonna be. that is. questions that they will have to answer under public scrutiny that they can no longer avoid. That's correct. Which can bring a large amount of backlash if the answers are suitably horrific, as I'm sure they they are. Do you guys already have questions in mind? If if discovery is granted, or is that we've been thinking about this for? Yeah. Well, before 28,

[66:06] thanks. That's can't wish you here. What happens? Small question you mentioned at the start that we're one of the first landmark states to bring this forward. Why, our coastal versus landlock States just like shipping imports no, the the reason being that and this is th th. This plays out on in many different levels, right? So coastal cities are, are are feeling the immediate effects of climate change right with sea level rise, and many of those cities are spending on huge amounts of dollars trying to protect assets, protect, infrastructure, protect people. And so most of the Co. Most of the cities, if not all the jurisdiction set in a file cases. Our coastal cities, who are already spending a huge amount of money. which is an interesting

[67:06] point. Given that they did not take the approach that we took in terms of like cost and damage. Right, they they obviously reference that, you know, private change is resulting in huge cost to jurisdictions. But that wasn't the basis of their case. I think we learned a little bit from their cases, and then took a different approach. Do you have any thoughts on, regardless of whether or not this goes discovery? If our lawsuit will help future lawsuits and their successes and learning from ours what worked, what did work? Or if it doesn't get to discover, do you think that'll hinder future lawsuits from taking this fact. No, I don't think that's the case at all. II think there's no question that every case that's brought, I think, is getting the whole conversation a little bit further and further. And I think that this issue of kind of accountability is really becoming much more mature.

[68:05] So really thinking so when I use that term, I'm accountability. It really starts to shine lights on who's really at fault. And I know we've talked a little bit in in our conversations about part of what drives some of our system. Level thinking is. you know, a historic approach is we all bear the burden, and we just continue to say to each of our residents, you need to use less because you're contributing to climate change. Well, when we don't have choice in terms of our energy provider when we don't necessarily have many options. Who are the polluters? It's it's not each of us with a mini coal plant in our backyards. So how do we think about kind of the systems level changes that need to happen? So climate accountability is a really big piece of that. It's why we use the same approach with extended producer responsibility in terms of materials and packaging and really thinking upstream to make sure that we're addressing the the cause of of the problem. So

[69:07] personal footprint is a scam. So if the onus is on us to fix things, then things will never fix. Continue to people breaking their name, to continue so for forever as long as it's profitable. Did you get? Did earth breaks. Come to you with this? Or did you guys come to them like inside your business? It's a good question. I will say that. Our lead attorney and I were introduced we had some conversation. That led to more conversation that led to realizing the county should be part of this conversation as well. And yeah, so I don't. There's a real answer to that. It was kind of mutual.

[70:04] but what was really important. We spent a lot of time in front of city Council. Asking whether they believe we should go down this path early on the big question was whether or not we were going to be spending a lot of taxpayer dollars on this. And philosophically, I think some of our constituents don't believe that again, that solving climate change is something we should be doing in in a courtroom. I would argue that it's not just. It's all would be above and this is one of the tactics that that we're taking, and I firmly believe it's a it's a really important one. you know. Somebody profited off to another person knowingly. you know, not telling the truth. And why not be able to get some of that money back? Umhm. Okay. thanks for listening. Thank you.

[71:03] Okay. I'm sorry. That's fine. That's great. Okay, so you have the. there's 1 s. be nice. There we go. Okay. I make this computer mad frequently. So first few things that I wanted to mention to you that are coming up. You had a look at the Council. Look ahead. A few things that I would like for you. Carolyn mentioned a couple of things. So this points out that we do have some things that might have caught your attention. And again questions about them. First one.

[72:00] there are some things happening on March seventh. Obviously there is this this piece. I it's a consent item, which means there's not going to be any conversation about it. In excel issue. Related to subsurface electric and telecom utilities on open space. This is pretty normal. There's nothing there that II think, is all that interesting to you. But I'm happy to share more. If you'd like. You can see the first reading, ordinance, a 86 24. This is again tied to the south. Conversation. So that's an item that is been moving for quite some time. The things that I would certainly think the Board would be interested in. March fourteenth. I think you mentioned it a little bit earlier. There is a discussion that Council will have around their priorities. You're gonna talk a little bit about the work program, gonna talk a bit about the citywide strategic plan and really setting them up for a good Council retreat in the beginning of March. That's when the Boards and Commission appointments will also be done? So that is a an important one for you all

[73:09] the March 20, fifth meeting. You can see there's some item there. That's the one that Carolyn mentioned earlier. That's the first reading of the energy conservation code. She mentioned. Just how we've been tracking, Updating those code changes, talking to many boards. We came to you very early in the process. We talked to a few others planning board just a couple of weeks ago. Many constituents in the community. That have really helped shape where we're going with the energy code. So that'll be the first reading and then the the public hearing will take place on April eighteenth. So you can see that later on the second conservation coming into conservation code. So those are 2 to that. I think we'll wanna watch pretty carefully. If there's more information that the Board would like to have room. What's being proposed? Certainly we can summarize that we can bring it back to you between now.

[74:06] But if we would want to do that before second reading, if if that's the case, and Karen will be. Carolyn will be here next month. So if you have any questions about what's being proposed, that would be a great time. I'm sorry. That is that something you can send to us, or is it not yet when you say that that the energy code updates? Yeah, I mean, are you looking for the entire code and kind of the red line of of? I know we talked about it, but sometimes it's easier if I just read something. Yes, yeah. Careful what? You're asking. The website, actually.

[75:10] what are we changing? Here are the areas. Here are the things. Here's why we're changing it. So that probably is going to be more relevant. That's great. You ask. And if you can't answer, that's fine. But what was planning for feedback. they have additional things that maybe we missed, or insights, or like different ways of thinking about things. As far as I understand, is is what I know is that it was very positive. We've had a number of conversations, with some council members included, to talk through what it is we're proposing and so they were supportive of what we were proposing. I don't think there was any changes to check. You did. Okay, great. And am I right that it's kind of a here's what we're changing. Well, it's a huge document. I mean, it's it's not like a few pages. Oh, absolutely.

[76:23] You grade your own Gpd with it, feed it back to their knowledge base. And then just ask a question. Okay, what changed? What are some? What is the code related to vehicles. I mean, you could do that. Or also there are the people who updated the code who could probably answer those questions. Well, that's what we tried to do on the website I like to check, but we tried to summarize it, to say, what's changing with this? What are the areas, what what are the themes? What are the things that you know? Why are we mucking with the language, and what do we want to accomplish with the mucking so shouldn't call it marking. It's actually really refining.

[77:00] Okay, so, looking ahead, there are a few other things that I really wanna put on your radar you can see that on April eleventh, and happy to bring this to you. II don't know. Certainly we can do it at the board once, but you know we're in the process of purchasing our city street lights. We are running that generally out of my department. Transport. A transportation manages our sweet light program but the acquisition we are in charge of. It's something that's a little bit of a residual from our municipalization and Excel partnership work. It's one of the things that we put in there, the ability to purchase street lights to be able to convert them. We talked with you all about the pilot project. If you recall about the street lighting, this is a little bit different, though. So if you look at this April eleventh item, you can see there's a first reading reading of an ordinance step, Date Street light standards. This is really about attachments, to to the polls. And so it's really kind of the Wonky code piece of it

[78:03] not necessarily related to the conversion of the street lights with the acquisition. So I just wanted to let you know you saw street lights on there. Happy to talk about what we are changing in code. II don't think it's necessary to bring it. I would like to come back to the board and talk about where we want to go with the conversion process that once we acquire. Yeah, II feel like, probably the second part of that is much more relevant than the first part. Correct? Yeah. Yes. May ninth. You can see some things on there. Council be talking about. Ballot measures will be talking about budget update. But may twenty-third is really a date that I want to highlight for you. So that's where we are. Gonna be going back council with a study session on the noise related to. That's our landscape equipment. With that. We talked with you last time. So it's why we want to come back to you next month.

[79:00] Have more of a discussion. See where you can see where we are, where we're headed, and with those working changes and get feedback. that's the that's the short of it. So we're looking ahead for the next several months. Sounds good. Any question pitch. We discussing Hannah's yeah email, I didn't have a chance to. That's okay. Yeah. I need to. II pull for promotion to this. I mean the agenda and add, it's both systems. Stop the agenda. Anybody? Second? Okay? So I had an idea, and the ask for before would just be like an endorsement. We're behind this and the app and what it is. And this can evolve. But I talked to an organization today that works with cities specifically, restaurants to help them just do like a brand

[80:04] plant powered for the planet month and just bring it's like a campaign. It's just saying. add a special climate, friendly option. Or that's basically what it is. It's like 15 restaurants they get to opt in. They can say no worries. That part that the city's involved in is really just and like endorsing it, city council and city staff. Ideally, the climate department would just say, like, Yes, we support this and give like a quote for press. The work is done by this organization. I would help like connect to local restaurants and make any interests and stuff. So it doesn't cost money. There's no like no staff time work or anything like that. And the reason I want to do it. You can read. So one thing I sent was the impact report from Austin. So they quantify all the climate emissions and kind of the climate impact from City point of perspective. And then they work with our restaurants on sales and help them stay like from the dollar perspective. Did this help your restaurant or not? And how did you get more? Step more people in, or things like that?

[81:18] So they do all that work which I think is really cool. It's not. It's not a big. This is not like the change I want city to make, but my thought is like, Take one step, do one thing, get a little momentum going, and then they also work with cities on writing actual policy that they can adopt within. Let's do. And so this could be like a a foot in the door and kind of getting some stuff done. It could be a cool thing to say like this is, you know, brought to the city from the Eib, taking a stance and kind of like getting momentum going, since I have little expectations of the speed of other change happening. So that's my proposal

[82:01] so that has to be with the Eab. Wanna say, like we endorse this. So you said, there's like a month where they bring bring these restaurants to put this out menu. So when when does that happen? This subset of restaurants? Are they environmentally conscious? Or yeah, I mean it would be it would all be plant based on yes. quantifying the missions, climate impact part of it. And I talked to the her, she said. They work. They try to do a mix of restaurants. So it's not. It's all very cheap, affordable to fine dining, all locally owned. So not chains, and then different parts of town. It's not just, I mean, realistically, it's like a small small campaign, but I think it'd be a great way to also see, like

[83:02] what community members want to like, get involved in something like this and kind of stop it. Educational that's like their plant-based on the Planet special. I don't even yeah, I there's a little I don't have like total clarity in what will look like. I said something about table tense. I don't think it's II think it. From what I understand, it's very much focused on sustainability and climate. So it's not. They don't use the word vegan, or kind of like any of that okay side of things. It's more like adding one special option for. And then they survey customers get data. So the only base. But the only thing they're changing is this one

[84:01] special meal coming up with a restaurant not talking about? I think they have like flyers and stuff that can go with it that give it to the educational part of it. Yeah, she said, though if they want help with menu they'll help, but usually restaurants to do themselves. They've done it twice in Austin. and Austin is now writing, and some actual legislation, or I don't think Council, whatever Council is putting in some policy, what is it around it? And then they did. some random place in Pennsylvania. another one. So they've done. They've run this campaign a few times. Yes. So if Boston done it a couple of times, it sounds like it's fairly successful. Or, do you know, like metrics wise, I assume, Co, 2 reductions or mission reductions that was impacted. Businesses find that it brought in. Yeah, we're customers, or more

[85:13] higher diversity of customers or change their profit. Margins. Yes, I didn't get the her impact report from the restaurant side of view, but she did say, let me look at my notes that it brought in new customer. They brought in new customers that otherwise and their existing customers also were interested in trying them. Which was, I think a surprise to the restaurants understood. And I think the impact from Austin is that they have to remember exactly what the it's just. The report would like admissions and stuff. But what I was really interested is the fact that council that like actually signed

[86:01] some ordinance around they they're similar to Boulder that they don't do a ton of ton of pro procurement, so they're kind of doing a mix of. So he does procure, and also educational campaigns to know what the ordinance was, did they? She? Did not send it to me. but she said she can help she? I asked. She said. There's someone from the awesome staff that would like we'd be really happy to to meet with city staff or council to kind of share best practices, and it hasn't. I don't think it's been finalized yet, so I just said it was mentioned 12 plant-based who would stuff was mountain 12 times, and then, whatever they were writing, that's all I got. But I can get. I do have other cities. okay, yeah, I'd be curious. I mean, I'm just curious to see what

[87:01] it's Jonathan has any. Yeah, Jonathan. So ideally, the climate department would be the best, and then council, and they are. and ideally, you know. Maybe we get Jonathan to go to one of these restaurants and see how it goes. Then, like open during

[88:17] Hi, I'm representative of the AV. In this moment. This is something we want to bring forward with council, or we can send something through staff that will potentially make it there. I think. Okay, we just meet with them. We give the an individual in the board the sort of the power to represent an opinion of the Eab, and then we can't meet with the council, because that's a whole bunch of open meeting laws. But you you could have a a you know, one on one or one on 2 or 2, on one or 2 on 2 sort of like, with official power from the Board request to have a meeting with council or a couple of Council members.

[89:06] Did I miss anything? No, that was that was right. I mean, so yeah. So we my one question for you. So does our support, and getting the city to officially support this this program, have anything to do with their ability to work within the city? Or is that going to be more? They they choose to work in the city and choose like, and they would then need to find restaurants to work with in order for it to work, or does to see choosing to support their involvement, actually have an impact on how involved they can be or how involved. Oh, this yeah. Oh, II didn't. I don't think they would ever do it without the permission they don't need permit. It's it's more about like permission versus endorsement, either. Those are required because they're just working with private businesses to do an outreach campaign right. But the theory of change is

[90:22] liaison, that or whoever knows restaurants, but basically just introduce the local restaurant owner to managers, to the person, and then they have all these templates that they work with. I think it sounds like a cool idea. Yep, I don't see any downsides. Personally. I don't either. Yeah. So we'll well, next step be to like. that's a new. Yeah. I think if I get the endorsement of the board. Good, then wanna talk to John and work on the endorsement staff, and then I will talk to you. council members, Mayor.

[91:07] and just see, it doesn't even have to be. It could be maybe 5 council members, or like the whole council. So yeah, yeah, there would be nothing else for the board to do unless you guys wanted to get involved in, like. I'm just thinking about the logistics like like Brooks said you could draft something and then go to a console meeting and say I'm speaking on behalf of the board after we. I guess we'll have to approve those 2 min, 3 min individual. I have gotten the endorsement from. No, you do for sure. Like. Also, we wouldn't if okay, so we wouldn't. It would depend on how involved we as a board want to be. But if we decide, hey, we support this concept. And then here you have full permission to go and speak. On this, we don't necessarily to approve the full 2 min speech that you're gonna give

[92:19] but if if it is an official board position that we vote on on record. and we have a majority vote in support of it. and we give and a permission to just go to council and say, this is something we support. But then what would you say was speaking myself, or speaking on behalf of the board, because those are different things that would depend entirely on what we decide. Okay, just no thanks. Harold, just offer a comment here. Procedurally, I it totally depends on what you're wanting counsel to do. If you are looking for an official endorsement that takes many different forms. A proclamation, a declaration, or an ordinance. That's what an official endorsement of the city looks like.

[93:05] If if you want that endorsement to fall into one of those 3 categories, then it makes sense. For the board, a representative of the of the Board to attend a council meeting and specifically ask for that endorsement. We'd like this endorsement, and we think it should look like this should be a proclamation, or it should be a declaration or something. I don't think that's what you were describing. So thanks. That was a clarification question which suggests to me that that's probably not the best forum because otherwise you are asking. You're going to a council meeting a policy discussion of of the policy makers and asking them to do a personal endorsement. And that's not the place to to do that. That should be something more like an email to council members, and that email could come from the Board. It could come from you as a representative of the Board, you could say, speaking on behalf of the Eab. This was brought to our attention. We'd like to bring this forward to you, and

[94:05] as individuals who love to encourage you as individual council members. If you feel it's appropriate and align with your values, and you think it's important to to endorse that feels like the right thing to do, for from the Council's perspective. And I will just say, while I'm still talking, we get these kinds of requests pretty frequently endorsement could look like a lot of different things, and the city is is usually pretty conservative about using the city voice to endorse a certain thing. We try to be very careful about endorsing one certain business over another business consult, and one particular movement over another movement. So a lot of times and and to these organizations will come to the city and say, Hey, we want you to do a declaration or resolution, and support everything, and then council decide whether they want to do that. So I think there are a couple of options. If this is something that the Board would like to do, happy to work with you and figure out the best pathway. Figure out what endorsement could could look like. And then the support that we can provide as a part of. So in that email that you mentioned, it will be more like it wouldn't be the Council as a body, but each individual member.

[95:19] So it's like you can send a note to council. There is that council email that's open to the public. You can do that. And as a board, if you send something. Hey? We wanted to draw your attention to this understandably, we're not asking for official city endorsement as an organization, but we love for you as individuals like, I said to if you'd like to learn more about this, and I think feel like this could be a a powerful tool and draw some attention to this cause. Reach out and love to work with you cool. And then what you were saying about the city that's meeting like staff, so like the climate department. Well, if yeah, I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. So the city tries to speak with one voice meaning that that if the city's gonna endorse a thing. It's not a department of doors, and it's the city endorsement, so that that comes with a lot of power through council. It can originate from departments, but it did it like departments are sort of like the brain of it, and cancels the voice right? So it doesn't matter where it's coming from.

[96:24] But it's like an endorsement of the council endorsement of the city. Yeah. Can city staff also do personal endorsements like council. Of course. Okay. that seems like the more appropriate for this I have. I do think we should come up with some declaration ordinance proposals in the future, but not not not there yet. So that's what I'd be thinking is more of the personal, not the city's speaking. Yeah. So then, yeah, you're either gonna want to reach out to council members individually, schedule meetings and talk with them, or probably start with as joiners talking about sending an email to the whole Council, inviting them to reach out to you personally, and if they want to have schedule meetings, talk about more, or just get their endorsement, or whatever to the project, then they can do that

[97:09] interpersonally, but it will be outreach on the record. So rather than having a single endorsement. But from the city it will be 9, or, let's say, 9 9 individual endorsements. Yeah. And they can endorse as a council member. For sure. They can represent their position as a council member. Pretty And I'm curious what other cities have done if those more just like personal endorsements, or if they get curious, I don't know the answer. What other sentence did that. I think that what other cities that's also not is interesting data, but yeah, less particularly relevant in the short term. Thanks. So I think the best next step would be to reach out to her for sure, but would be assuming that we both support would just be shooting email, the council accounts email being like, Hey, there's a thing that has come across our desks.

[98:07] We would like to hear, you know, either your support of or your questions about. Yeah. Great. So are we in agreement, lieutenant. I'm good. See it first. Sure got it makes sense. Yeah, thanks for sharing this. before we end. There's one more item that I forgot is the multi-city environmental or meeting. So it's finally happening. And it's in 2 weeks, I think 3, 2 weeks March 28. I think that did. I mentioned last time you mentioned that because you were, wasn't your most aware of it. But I guess I'll remind there.

[99:02] yeah, I guess we don't need to add an item to the agenda already mentioned. Have you guys wanna go? I think they're gonna ask. You know people to introduce themselves. talk about what we do. What's the scope of our board? I'll probably just mention, like, Go ahead. You know what we have done this past year and what this call, you know, the advisory role of our board stuff like that. If you wanna talk about food systems. This will be a good chance. Farms. Yeah, I'm sure. It's March. I think it is email march twentieth at 6 30 pm.

[100:18] it's in Westminster City Hall in person. Yes. Dinner will be served, and you need our Svp. By March thirteenth 7 to 7 30 table work. Get acquainted. Small groups 7, 30 to 8 larger group sharing next steps. And there's a rapple. So quick comment. Do you mind if if any of you do plan to attend. I feel like I probably will. one of the things that I'll try, and I might reach out to Maria in advance. There have been a number of of

[101:03] I'll I'll call them attempts. There been a number of coalitions over many years around the thing that I feel like she's trying to get at, which is some best practice sharing. There's a little bit of difference in terms of the board, so I don't believe all of the boards that have been included in here are are appointed boards, some of our just kind of citizen groups that come together so levels of authority, I think, are gonna be a little bit different. The approach and and kind of connected connected to the city, maybe a little bit different. But I feel like There may be some level setting to say, look, we have a front range sustainability network. We have. Ca, and part of what the challenge that I've experiences some of the best practice sharing like you get together and like, What are you doing? What are you doing? What are you doing. Isn't that interesting? And we'll see you in a couple of months? And I'm not. I'm not suggesting that that will be the case. It's more. How do we work together? What are the common things?

[102:00] We'll find strength if we all kind of work together. So here's what I'm working on. I can really help you advance some of your work, and so we have some of that architecture already in place. And I would hate to recreate something, but I also don't want to show up and just throw cold water on what feels like, maybe some some movement, so II will attend unless her non, if you wanna advise me not to attend, I'm happy not to. I don't think the format for the meeting essentially so. You have experience with this kind of collaboration. It might not be a bad idea to reach out to her. And yeah, look friendly suggestion, hey, you know, like, I think in the past we so many people attending like you said, if I do this, and then, you know, we go to the next person. What do you do? There's no time to network. So II it might be good to offer some perspective on what has worked in the past. What has the meeting is the most expensive, possible. And I may reach out. It was an interesting email, because it was.

[103:05] you know, my colleagues in Denver, Louis Babcock, who? essentially just my my job in Denver and in long months and Superior Lakewood, and looking at my colleagues that I know from these other coalitions, are all invited to this as well. So so do you want to send out this invite? Do you want me to send it out? Yeah, I mean, do you have it there. Just forward it, please. That'll be great happy. To which reminds me. I wanna monthly climate happier. I'll send you guys the invite. I waited because I wasn't sure.

[104:11] Oh, yeah. okay. yeah. I don't like to. I was like Westminster. I don't know. Alright guys. So meeting is scheduled for April third at 6 pm. So I put forward a motion to adjourn the meeting. I'll second that alright, and then we're done great.